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Forums - Sports Discussion - The NFL Thread 2011: New York Giants Win Super Bowl XLVI

No game is ever won or lost by one play. It came down to one play because of the hundreds of other plays. Had the 49s scored more points, or prevented the Giants from scoring, or were able to get a first down, then the muffed punts would not have mattered. They mattered because of the performance during the rest of the game.



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RolStoppable said:
Euphoria14 said:

I know the Pats aren't a bad team, they have a hall of fame coach and hall of fame QB and have won (3) rings in 11 years and this is their 5th Superbowl appearance overall in that span. Also 3 points is only a fieldgoal, so they think something like a 24-21 Pats win. It doesn't bother me really that they are underdogs since they always are for some reason, it was just that I wanted to give the argument anyways for why the Giants should be the 3-point favorite instead.

I am not a gambling man though, so the odds don't really effect me. 

 

As for the quotes, I already gave a good place to start. It wasn't twisted by the media, I heard it myself. I am 100% positive you could find it in the Podcast for WFAN.

As for the "our" part, I would wager that if I said that it has much to do with the fact that I live in New York. Like I said, I have no real particular team. Well, I guess you could consider me a "New York Fan" in this case, if you really want to label me as any sort of fan. I could live with "New York Fan". 

Yes, I know they play in Jersey... 

 

Won't catch me rooting for the Yankees though.

Fair enough.

But regarding the quotes, a Giants player saying something about another QB isn't what I meant. I want to read quotes from Rodgers to see how he talks about himself, the Packers and his opponents. I rather form my own opionion than going by something that a player of an opposing team said.

When I get out of work I could take the time to find some but my point was that there are players who are bothered by what they feel is arrogance and/or cockiness and they could use it as a motivational force in games. I think Roddy White was another, although unlike Rolle he doesn't like it.

With White though it could easily come off as him being a sore loser.



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kanageddaamen said:
No game is ever won or lost by one play. It came down to one play because of the hundreds of other plays. Had the 49s scored more points, or prevented the Giants from scoring, or were able to get a first down, then the muffed punts would not have mattered. They mattered because of the performance during the rest of the game.

I agree with you. While Kyle Williams of course shares a big part of the blame, remember the guy was a fill in, he got too absorbed in the moment and tried to do too much. He even had some real good returns.

What is being forgotten is how the 49ers went only 1-13 on 3rd down conversions, with the only conversion coming at the end of regulation. That alone can kill you too.

There is plenty of blame to go around, especially since they could have just as easily won that game. 49ers defense was in control of that game.



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Mendicate Bias said:
ljigga said:
Mendicate Bias said:

Both teams can make excuses for why they played the way they did. For example

-Gronk was ruled out of bounds when he clearly was in for a reception that would have put the Pats on the 10

-Kyle Arrington (league leader for interceptions) was out for half the game due to an eye injury leaving us with two wide recievers in the secondary

-Gronk was out for most of the second half due to the ankle injury (btw someone needs to end Pollard) 

But none of that matters, What matters is that the Ravens were only able to score 10 points off three turnovers and didn't have what it takes to win the game. Oh and those extra Brady interceptions you say got called back because of flags? Both times Brady saw the flags get thrown and knew he had a free play so he just heaved it up into double coverage to see if his recievers could come down with it. I'm not saying Brady had a good game but he went up against the third best defense in the league (49ers were 4th) and frankly the Ravens made some amazing superhuman plays to come away with those inerceptions. I wouldnt count on Brady playing so shaky or Woodhead fumbling a return next week. 

Oh puuuh-leaze that "catch" by Gronk was as much a catch as Evans td catch - he had two feet down before the ball was swatted away, Gronk caught the ball after his foot left the ground.

This is football injuries happen, worst excuse ever, take that mentality to figure skating or golf where it belongs. Pollard made a clean tackle on Gronk, I suppose you would have loved it if he pranced over with a flower and tried to dance with him instead of tackling him maybe? - His foot got caught under the tackler/in the ground.....its football.....not fluffly play time. Injuries happen in the game and I would never wish it on anyone, I've seen far to many of my teammates with serious injuries in the past being affected in everyday life now; hope dude is ok and back to himself real soon.

I guess on that interception in the end zone where Brady tossed it up into double coverage there was a flag to? The flag didn't come on that first interception until after the throw by the way, so terrible excuse. Brady had a terrible game, absolutely terrible....Joe Flacco outplayed him...the word good does not come to mind when you think of Brady's play in that game - no TD passes and 2 interceptions. NE's D played amazing in shutting down Ray Rice and Wilfork was clearly the MVP of that game, and other than Cuntiff shanking the FG was the only reason they won.....not Brady. The Raven's live in that dude's head. 

Im not counting on Brady playing shaky and im not counting on Eli getting hit 22 times and sacked 6 times. It's open season in 2 weeks and thank God the superbowl wont be a boring snoozefest of Harbaugh vs Harbaugh.

They specifically went back over that play at half time and showed that he had both feet down and posession of the ball. Why Belicheck didn't challenge is beyond me, I'm guessin someone messed up at their job and didn't inform him in time.

I was clearly joking about taking out Pollard. What I was showing you was how pathetic it looks to make excuses why a team didn't win. Both sides can come up with plenty of reasons why they could have played better.

I specifically said that Brady had a bad game and that throw into double coverage at the end of the game was horrible. But don't act like Brady didn't come through with some amazing plays despite his mistakes. Driving the length of the field and diving over the pile on 4 and 1 for the touchdown was brilliant and ultimately decided the game. Flacco did not outplay Brady, they both played equally bad. How many times did Flacco have guys open down the field and missed them, I can tell you it was plenty. Heck Flacco got the ball back with amazing field position when Woodhead fumbled the ball. All he had to do was score a touchdown and the game was pretty much over. Instead he came up short, settled for a field goal and the rest is history.

Oh and about the Giants and 49ers game. The conditions sucked and Eli is tough as hell to take all those hits and keep going.  The fact that he didn't turn the ball over at all is probably the most amazing aspect of the whole thing. But don't act like bad field conditions benefits the defense cause I can tell you 100 percent having been a cornerback myself that a slippery field always benefits the offense. The very nature of being a defensive player is reacting. The offensive player knows where he's going and positions himself to get to his spot, trying to make the necessary cuts to keep up with a reciever is unbelievably difficult on a muddy field.

They showed what happened one announcer thought it was a catch and the other contested that his right foot left the ground before he established possession.

If by 4th and 1 you mean 4th and 1/100th of a yard then I agree. All he had to do was break the plane by sticking his hand out, diving over was just extra. When the best play your QB makes in the game is that, thats just sad. Flacco outplayed Brady, he made Brady look like Tebow, dude had a 50 something QB rating, Flacco practically doubled him up. I hope you realize that Brady didn't have a touchdown pass and had several interceptions. Your one of those fans who can't actually see it for what it is; Brady played terrible, got outplayed by Flacco... defense and the running game rescued him, stop being that guy, drop the man crush already. Flacco hit Evans right in the chest and that catch should have been reviewed as many analysts have been saying that it was actually a TD. Between Evans and the missed FG Pats were handed a win. 

Bad field conditions suck for both O and D, having played SS and WR, when that field is muddy everyone who cuts is going to slide or lose footing at some point during the game, irregardless if the WR knows where he is going he cant run that route at 100% speed without loosing his footing. If you watched the game you would have seen how many times WR's slipped out there. Its not one sided. The wind conditions on the other hand benefit the defense alot more than the offense, throwing into high wind speeds can get ugly really fast.



I have lived as a warrior. I have died as a god. Having suffered the ultimate sacrifice, I have been denied release. I...I will defeat Olympus. I will have my revenge

--Kratos

ljigga said:

They showed what happened one announcer thought it was a catch and the other contested that his right foot left the ground before he established possession.

If by 4th and 1 you mean 4th and 1/100th of a yard then I agree. All he had to do was break the plane by sticking his hand out, diving over was just extra. When the best play your QB makes in the game is that, thats just sad. Flacco outplayed Brady, he made Brady look like Tebow, dude had a 50 something QB rating, Flacco practically doubled him up. I hope you realize that Brady didn't have a touchdown pass and had several interceptions. Your one of those fans who can't actually see it for what it is; Brady played terrible, got outplayed by Flacco... defense and the running game rescued him, stop being that guy, drop the man crush already. Flacco hit Evans right in the chest and that catch should have been reviewed as many analysts have been saying that it was actually a TD. Between Evans and the missed FG Pats were handed a win. 

Bad field conditions suck for both O and D, having played SS and WR, when that field is muddy everyone who cuts is going to slide or lose footing at some point during the game, irregardless if the WR knows where he is going he cant run that route at 100% speed without loosing his footing. If you watched the game you would have seen how many times WR's slipped out there. Its not one sided. The wind conditions on the other hand benefit the defense alot more than the offense, throwing into high wind speeds can get ugly really fast.

Go back and look at the spot, it was spotted on the half yard line. And don't act like that is the easiest move in the world, the Falcons tried it 3 times and failed, it is much harder than it appears.

Both Brady and Flacco went 22/36 for passing, how are those Tebow numbers? Quarterback rating doesn't take into account many factors as any analyst can tell you.

I am not a blinded fan, I came out and said that Brady had a bad game. You on the other hand are clearly blinded by your hate for the team and aren't willing to give any credit where it is due. Thats fine, being the best of the best breeds haters. Being from Boston you can imagine we get used to all the jealousy

Lee Evans himself said it wasn't a catch so stop whining about the call. If you think that call would have been overturned by a review you should go back and read the rules book.

On a side note- wtf did you do to your avatar Rol?



                                           

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Mendicate Bias said:
ljigga said:

They showed what happened one announcer thought it was a catch and the other contested that his right foot left the ground before he established possession.

If by 4th and 1 you mean 4th and 1/100th of a yard then I agree. All he had to do was break the plane by sticking his hand out, diving over was just extra. When the best play your QB makes in the game is that, thats just sad. Flacco outplayed Brady, he made Brady look like Tebow, dude had a 50 something QB rating, Flacco practically doubled him up. I hope you realize that Brady didn't have a touchdown pass and had several interceptions. Your one of those fans who can't actually see it for what it is; Brady played terrible, got outplayed by Flacco... defense and the running game rescued him, stop being that guy, drop the man crush already. Flacco hit Evans right in the chest and that catch should have been reviewed as many analysts have been saying that it was actually a TD. Between Evans and the missed FG Pats were handed a win. 

Bad field conditions suck for both O and D, having played SS and WR, when that field is muddy everyone who cuts is going to slide or lose footing at some point during the game, irregardless if the WR knows where he is going he cant run that route at 100% speed without loosing his footing. If you watched the game you would have seen how many times WR's slipped out there. Its not one sided. The wind conditions on the other hand benefit the defense alot more than the offense, throwing into high wind speeds can get ugly really fast.

Go back and look at the spot, it was spotted on the half yard line. And don't act like that is the easiest move in the world, the Falcons tried it 3 times and failed, it is much harder than it appears.

Both Brady and Flacco went 22/36 for passing, how are those Tebow numbers? Quarterback rating doesn't take into account many factors as any analyst can tell you.

I am not a blinded fan, I came out and said that Brady had a bad game. You on the other hand are clearly blinded by your hate for the team and aren't willing to give any credit where it is due. Thats fine, being the best of the best breeds haters. Being from Boston you can imagine we get used to all the jealousy

Lee Evans himself said it wasn't a catch so stop whining about the call. If you think that call would have been overturned by a review you should go back and read the rules book.

On a side note- wtf did you do to your avatar Rol?

The Falcons don't have the OL that the Pats do and Matt Ryan is useless. It was a move that took alot of heart and balls id say that especially seeing how Ray Lewis flipped him over.

Yes but how many interceptions did Brady throw? How many td passes? Now what about Flacco. Men Lie, women lie, numbers don't.

I like how you know nothing about me but automatically assume because I call it how I see it that I am a Patriot's hater, relax kid. The Patriots are one of my top 3 favorite teams in the league.

I know Boston's won alot of recent championships, but I the last I recall in sports I follow was '08 Celtics....we all see how you guys are doing this year though in bball. I dont follow hockey but maybe you won that last year? this year? Baseball was the meltdown this year because I remember reading about the coach dude.

I do remember there was a year when Bos teams took  almost all professional league 'ships, but seeing as I live in Toronto, I have no territorial allegiance to any team in my favorite sports.

Those same analysts you referenced earlier used that rule book to determine he had two feet down and made a football move by turning upfield. I never said it would have been overturned by a call but that it should have been called a TD, if it was called a TD it wouldn't have been overturned either. 



I have lived as a warrior. I have died as a god. Having suffered the ultimate sacrifice, I have been denied release. I...I will defeat Olympus. I will have my revenge

--Kratos

ljigga said:

The Falcons don't have the OL that the Pats do and Matt Ryan is useless. It was a move that took alot of heart and balls id say that especially seeing how Ray Lewis flipped him over.

Yes but how many interceptions did Brady throw? How many td passes? Now what about Flacco. Men Lie, women lie, numbers don't.

I like how you know nothing about me but automatically assume because I call it how I see it that I am a Patriot's hater, relax kid. The Patriots are one of my top 3 favorite teams in the league.

I know Boston's won alot of recent championships, but I the last I recall in sports I follow was '08 Celtics....we all see how you guys are doing this year though in bball. I dont follow hockey but maybe you won that last year? this year? Baseball was the meltdown this year because I remember reading about the coach dude.

I do remember there was a year when Bos teams took  almost all professional league 'ships, but seeing as I live in Toronto, I have no territorial allegiance to any team in my favorite sports.

Those same analysts you referenced earlier used that rule book to determine he had two feet down and made a football move by turning upfield. I never said it would have been overturned by a call but that it should have been called a TD, if it was called a TD it wouldn't have been overturned either. 

You don't seem to understand what I'm saying so read slowly and carefully what I'm about to write. Brady did not have a good game, in fact he had a bad game. With that said, does that automatically mean that Flacco had a good game, no. He played decent on paper but made crucial mistakes in the game that kept his teammates from scoring touchdowns. Hence why I said he did not play well either. Why is that so hard for you to accept?

If the Patriots win the Superbowl it will have been 8 championships in the last decade for the 4 major sports combined.

Football- 4

Baseball- 2

Basketball- 1

Hockey- 1

Thats not counting the other Boston teams like the Cannons (Lacrosse) which just won a championship and the Revolution soccer team which won a championship in 2007. So in total without this superbowl that would be 9 championships in the last decade. 

As for the Celtics this year, I'm proud of how they are playing despite all the injuries they have at the moment. If you followed them at all you would know they just strung together two historic performances against the Magic and are coming together nicely. I don't think they will make the championship with such a strong Bulls and Heat team in the east but the next few years are looking good for the team.

Please show me an analyst that said that was a touchdown. Every sports writer and analyst I have seen have all said it wasn't a touchdown. The only admonishment I have heard from any commentator was that the play should have been reviewed. But even they admit that the call would have been upheld if it had gone under review.

Also don't call me kid. Its a backhanded way of trying to diminish my argument by implying I'm a child.



                                           

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I'm going with the Patriots over the Giants in a close game but will not be mad or surprised if the Giants win again. Also I'm glad that I predicted the semi finals correctly since both games could have went to overtime and it could have easily been the 49ers vs the Ravens in the super bowl.



Mendicate Bias said:
ljigga said:

The Falcons don't have the OL that the Pats do and Matt Ryan is useless. It was a move that took alot of heart and balls id say that especially seeing how Ray Lewis flipped him over.

Yes but how many interceptions did Brady throw? How many td passes? Now what about Flacco. Men Lie, women lie, numbers don't.

I like how you know nothing about me but automatically assume because I call it how I see it that I am a Patriot's hater, relax kid. The Patriots are one of my top 3 favorite teams in the league.

I know Boston's won alot of recent championships, but I the last I recall in sports I follow was '08 Celtics....we all see how you guys are doing this year though in bball. I dont follow hockey but maybe you won that last year? this year? Baseball was the meltdown this year because I remember reading about the coach dude.

I do remember there was a year when Bos teams took  almost all professional league 'ships, but seeing as I live in Toronto, I have no territorial allegiance to any team in my favorite sports.

Those same analysts you referenced earlier used that rule book to determine he had two feet down and made a football move by turning upfield. I never said it would have been overturned by a call but that it should have been called a TD, if it was called a TD it wouldn't have been overturned either. 

You don't seem to understand what I'm saying so read slowly and carefully what I'm about to write. Brady did not have a good game, in fact he had a bad game. With that said, does that automatically mean that Flacco had a good game, no. He played decent on paper but made crucial mistakes in the game that kept his teammates from scoring touchdowns. Hence why I said he did not play well either. Why is that so hard for you to accept?

If the Patriots win the Superbowl it will have been 8 championships in the last decade for the 4 major sports combined.

Football- 4

Baseball- 2

Basketball- 1

Hockey- 1

Thats not counting the other Boston teams like the Cannons (Lacrosse) which just won a championship and the Revolution soccer team which won a championship in 2007. So in total without this superbowl that would be 9 championships in the last decade. 

As for the Celtics this year, I'm proud of how they are playing despite all the injuries they have at the moment. If you followed them at all you would know they just strung together two historic performances against the Magic and are coming together nicely. I don't think they will make the championship with such a strong Bulls and Heat team in the east but the next few years are looking good for the team.

Please show me an analyst that said that was a touchdown. Every sports writer and analyst I have seen have all said it wasn't a touchdown. The only admonishment I have heard from any commentator was that the play should have been reviewed. But even they admit that the call would have been upheld if it had gone under review.

Also don't call me kid. Its a backhanded way of trying to diminish my argument by implying I'm a child.


I guess in Boston reading comprehension isn't your strong suite, I am glad that Boston has all those championships, Boston is a sports town that draws big names, no doubt.

Now I think this is where I lost you last time so ill put it in big letters to make it stick better... JOE FLACCO PLAYED BETTER THAN TOM BRADY IN THAT GAME. If you can somehow find some way to deny this then you sir are clearly delusional, it must be very hard for you to accept that Tom Brady isn't god or something, you defend this guy like he is your father. It is pretty pathetic. When you come back to reality let me know.

The Celtics were playing garbage prior to the injuries ( other than Jeff Green ofc). I do follow the Celtics as a matter of fact, I follow the whole league. They beat a terrible Orlando team, the Celtics play team ball and that can overcome the selfish play of the Magic anyday. You clearly dont follow the Celtics, because if you did you wouldn't have the audacity to make a comment like the next few years look good....Are you even serious?? Ray Allen, KG and Pierce are pretty much done. Ray allen is a free agent and will be turning 37, KG is a free agent and will be 36 or 37 and pierce will be 35...please explain this magical future of yours? You know what, maybe I am mistaken and good to you means finishing in the bottom half of the conference. In that case your right and carry on.

Go to espn.com, not the boston website, with just boston writers, but the actual website, go look at some of the articles posted, go watch espn first take or download the podcast and listen to the episode that was the monday after the game and listen to them say that the play was a touchdown and should have at least been reviewed. Heck if your even up to it google coach harbaugh saying that he was suprised that the play wasnt even reviewed.

Its funny, Tom Brady said he played "Shitty" and that is a direct quote, he knows he got outplayed at the QB position. Flacco played way better than him that game. That's why I like Brady, he can man up and say I messed up and my team pulled that game out for me, that's what makes him an admirable athlete and one whom other players can look up to. He didn't play bad, Flacco played bad, Brady played terrible. End of story. Your man said it himself. 

Pop Quiz: How many superbowls have the Patriots one since being caught with one of there guy's on the opposing teams sideline telling Bellicheck what plays there running? They got alot to prove and this is redemption for Brady and Bellicheck after '07, they better come prepared, since they cant have anyone spying on the sidelines anymore.



I have lived as a warrior. I have died as a god. Having suffered the ultimate sacrifice, I have been denied release. I...I will defeat Olympus. I will have my revenge

--Kratos

Might seem weird for me, but I hate this Superbowl matchup so much I am skipping and going snowboarding and to my cabin again. Most of the nation wanted San Fran to win it by the polls and also considering the way the Ravens lost with that complete choke makes the fact that New England is in it even more annoying.