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Forums - General - Student Arrested for Plotting Gas Attack on Anti-Pope Crowd

sapphi_snake said:
Kynes said:

Read again the edited post, the Catholic Church isn't the only one with benefits, any religion with a high enough number of followers has in some way or another public funding.

This isn't the first time the Pope has gone to any country, and it always is partly funded via taxpayers money. Do you really believe that when the Pope went to the USA, the Vatican paid everything? If you believe so, then you're less clever than you seem to believe you are.

It's discriminatory to offer benefits based on the number of followers. This concession was obviously made to benefit the Catholic Church, and should be removed.

Also, the Vatican is sadly recognized as a state (which it obviously shouldn't be), so the Pope is considered a foreing official and can say his visits are 'state visits' rather than pastoral visits, which is the reason why the Pope often winds up visiting countries for free. Obviously the Vatican should no longer be considered a state, and the Pope should pay for his own visits.

Oh, and if the Catholic Church solicits any fees for the services it provides (marriages, funerals etc.), then it is not a NPO.



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Kynes said:
sapphi_snake said:
Kynes said:

Read again the edited post, the Catholic Church isn't the only one with benefits, any religion with a high enough number of followers has in some way or another public funding.

This isn't the first time the Pope has gone to any country, and it always is partly funded via taxpayers money. Do you really believe that when the Pope went to the USA, the Vatican paid everything? If you believe so, then you're less clever than you seem to believe you are.

It's discriminatory to offer benefits based on the number of followers. This concession was obviously made to benefit the Catholic Church, and should be removed.

Also, the Vatican is sadly recognized as a state (which it obviously shouldn't be), so the Pope is considered a foreing official and can say his visits are 'state visits' rather than pastoral visits, which is the reason why the Pope often winds up visiting countries for free. Obviously the Vatican should no longer be considered a state, and the Pope should pay for his own visits.

Oh, and if the Catholic Church solicits any fees for the services it provides (marriages, funerals etc.), then it is not a NPO.

How mature of you. Then again, all things considering, I'm not surprised.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

sapphi_snake said:
Kynes said:
sapphi_snake said:
Kynes said:

Read again the edited post, the Catholic Church isn't the only one with benefits, any religion with a high enough number of followers has in some way or another public funding.

This isn't the first time the Pope has gone to any country, and it always is partly funded via taxpayers money. Do you really believe that when the Pope went to the USA, the Vatican paid everything? If you believe so, then you're less clever than you seem to believe you are.

It's discriminatory to offer benefits based on the number of followers. This concession was obviously made to benefit the Catholic Church, and should be removed.

Also, the Vatican is sadly recognized as a state (which it obviously shouldn't be), so the Pope is considered a foreing official and can say his visits are 'state visits' rather than pastoral visits, which is the reason why the Pope often winds up visiting countries for free. Obviously the Vatican should no longer be considered a state, and the Pope should pay for his own visits.

Oh, and if the Catholic Church solicits any fees for the services it provides (marriages, funerals etc.), then it is not a NPO.

How mature of you. Then again, all things considering, I'm not surprised.


I'm not the one who just sent an insulting private message. How mature of you.



sapphi_snake said:
TadpoleJackson said:
Before I get in a discussion. since I have already seen a thread like this on VGC. Did Spain invite the Pope, or did the Pope invite himself to Spain and expect them to pay everything?

The Pope 'choose' Spain, so I assume he invited himself.

I'd announced my visit to Spain and asked them to fund my visit but I hadn't heard back from them :(



Kynes said:


I'm not the one who just sent an insulting private message. How mature of you.

I don't know what you're talking about. I do know that you can be banned for revealing PMs though.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

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Galaki said:
sapphi_snake said:
TadpoleJackson said:
Before I get in a discussion. since I have already seen a thread like this on VGC. Did Spain invite the Pope, or did the Pope invite himself to Spain and expect them to pay everything?

The Pope 'choose' Spain, so I assume he invited himself.

I'd announced my visit to Spain and asked them to fund my visit but I hadn't heard back from them :(

See, it's discrimination. I'd much rather your visit be funded than the Pope's.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

sapphi_snake said:
Kynes said:
sapphi_snake said:
Kynes said:


Because I reckon how this unfolds. This is the typical situation where something gets a lot of exposure, then it ends in almost nothing, but we don't get the same exposure of the real facts in the mainstream media. I live in Spain, I read Spanish newspapers and watch Spanish tv, and this has been used by most tv stations (TVE, Tele5, La Sexta and Cuatro) and some newspapers and radio stations to incite the hate towards the Catholics and the Pope. This has been used to incite the rage and justify the parade against the Catholics and the Pope, where anarchists threw lots of one litter beer glass bottles against the pilgrims and the police. It seems that there are some politicians who need this confrontation and anger to propel their opportunities in the next elections.

You are aware that the reason protesters are angry is that taxpayer money are used to fund the Pope's visit, no? This greately angers people who respect freedom of religion (plus, there's also Spain's economic situation to be taken in account). The protesters are right to be angry. I'm sure the Pope can pay for his own visit to Spain.

Check your facts before spreading fud:

 

http://www.larazon.es/noticia/5096-blanco-admite-que-la-jmj-no-supondra-un-gasto-para-el-estado

 

The Spanish government's (Socialist) spokesman admits that the net result will be positive.

Taxpayer money was used to fund this religious event. Whatever benefit that this even allegedly brings is outweighted by this travesty against freedom of religion and secularism. How would Spanish catholics like it if their tax money was used to fund trips to Mecca for muslim Spaniards?

The bolded part is ridiculous and the money from Spanish catholics and non catholics also goes for exemple to the Gay Pride Day. Will you write the same when the next Gay Pride Day arrives?

Why can't peopIe live and let live?

Edit: Fixed (sorry for my silly mistake)



Bruno Muñoz said:
sapphi_snake said:

Taxpayer money was used to fund this religious event. Whatever benefit that this even allegedly brings is outweighted by this travesty against freedom of religion and secularism. How would Spanish catholics like it if their tax money was used to fund trips to Mecca for muslim Spaniards?

The bolded part is ridiculous and the money from Spanish catholics and no catholics also goes for exemple to the Gay Pray Day. Will you write the same when the next Gay Pray Day arrives?

Gay 'Pray' Day? Don't you mean Gay Pride Day?

And in most places Gay Pride events are funded by NPOs, not the Government. Don't know if the Government funds them in Spain. I don't really see the comparison though. 'Gay' isn't a religion, so no religious freedoms are broken (like in the case of the Government using taxpayer money to finance the Pope's visit). Homosexuals are a minority, and Governments always fund programs meant to lessen discrimination on minority groups, since this is in the interest of society as a whole (and of the minority group in particular).

Why can't peopIe live and let live?

When the Pope will pay for his own trips and stop expecting free meals, everything will be OK.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

Man all the belly-aching Athiests on this forum are hilarious.

As I said earlier this event will bring in 1.5-million pilgrims who will spend over 100-million euro's every day for the four day visit. Thats insain and it will benefit Spain immensly. Its bigger then the Olympics for crying out loud. So the Government spends almost 100-million Euro's in security expenses and ensuring the visit goes alright, the tax payers and buisnesses will make four times that at least.

Think of it these tourists are spending likely more then 100 Euro's a day on hotel alone. Thats a shit load a day on hotel alone. Then throw in all the buisness resteraunts will get and souvenier shops and local buisnesses.

Other countries would kill for this kind of tourism. This is a shit load of money being pumped into Spains economy.

Those protesting are not doing so because they are upset Spain is spending a hundred million euro's to make four times that in return. They are protesting simply because they are biggotted towards the Catholic Church. The biggest protest according to the CBC was a big kissing protest done by the gay rights groups.

Athiests need to be logical in their protests. We all know the real reason they are protesting theirs no reason to go lying to everyone. We get it you hate Catholics and other religions. But don't let your blind hatred loose your country millions in tourist dollars.

The Spanish Government knows how important this trip is to their economy. Thats why they are doing it. Also the comparison of this trip to Spain paying for Muslims to visit Mecca. How could that possibly relate the the Government bringing in millions of euro's and helping foster tourism for years to come.

Now if millions of muslims would come to Spain and spend millions of euro's to hear their spiritual leader speak. Then yah that would be great. But the idea of sending Muslims to Mecca is just idiotic, it wouldn't benefit Spain at all. Where as this visit from the Pope will save people's job's create more jobs and pump hundreds of millions of euro's into the economy!



-JC7

"In God We Trust - In Games We Play " - Joel Reimer

 

Joelcool7 said:

Man all the belly-aching Athiests on this forum are hilarious.

As I said earlier this event will bring in 1.5-million pilgrims who will spend over 100-million euro's every day for the four day visit. Thats insain and it will benefit Spain immensly. Its bigger then the Olympics for crying out loud. So the Government spends almost 100-million Euro's in security expenses and ensuring the visit goes alright, the tax payers and buisnesses will make four times that at least.

Think of it these tourists are spending likely more then 100 Euro's a day on hotel alone. Thats a shit load a day on hotel alone. Then throw in all the buisness resteraunts will get and souvenier shops and local buisnesses.

Other countries would kill for this kind of tourism. This is a shit load of money being pumped into Spains economy.

Those protesting are not doing so because they are upset Spain is spending a hundred million euro's to make four times that in return. They are protesting simply because they are biggotted towards the Catholic Church. The biggest protest according to the CBC was a big kissing protest done by the gay rights groups.

Athiests need to be logical in their protests. We all know the real reason they are protesting theirs no reason to go lying to everyone. We get it you hate Catholics and other religions. But don't let your blind hatred loose your country millions in tourist dollars.

The Spanish Government knows how important this trip is to their economy. Thats why they are doing it. Also the comparison of this trip to Spain paying for Muslims to visit Mecca. How could that possibly relate the the Government bringing in millions of euro's and helping foster tourism for years to come.

Now if millions of muslims would come to Spain and spend millions of euro's to hear their spiritual leader speak. Then yah that would be great. But the idea of sending Muslims to Mecca is just idiotic, it wouldn't benefit Spain at all. Where as this visit from the Pope will save people's job's create more jobs and pump hundreds of millions of euro's into the economy!

The protest is very logical. The Government is funding a religious event using taxpayer money. It's quite irrelevant what alleged benefits it brings to the economy. If they're going to endorse religious events for christians, they should endorse religious events for other faiths also. The only biggots here are catholics and their Church, who think that everyone should finance their religious events.

Oh, and there's no way this event brings in more money than the Olympics (LOL, what are you smoking?). The event costs $72 million, and is allegedly bringing in $100 million from pilgrims. The profits aren't that big compared to what is invested.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)