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Forums - General - What do you think of Black Holes,Worm holes?

 

What do you think of Black Holes,Worm holes?

Forward Time Travel 5 11.63%
 
Time travel back and forth 2 4.65%
 
Different universes 5 11.63%
 
Exit to virtual world 0 0%
 
Disintegration 31 72.09%
 
Total:43

I hope you don't mind me commenting on this.

maverick40 said:

This is the way I see it. I am a physicist so I probably look at things a bit differently. Basically, I think our only purpose to continue, is to repopulate and continue our race. IMO I think there may not be an afterlife but more so we live our life through our kids when we die, continuing on our bloodline. We further our knowledge of science so we can provide a better and safer life for our kids. Protecting our bloodline and thus continuing and protecting the race of man.

This is only my opinion

''I am a physicist so I probably look at things a bit differently.''

As far as I'm aware the centre-of-mass of the intelligenzia has been gravitating towards this world view steadily in modern times. This necessitates a mass acceptance of this viewpoint as fact. Fact, in fact, is simply defined as what is commonly agreed upon by a group of experts. 

''I think our only purpose to continue, is to repopulate and continue our race''

Here is where a major contradiction arises in the modern, objective man. You claim yourself as an interacting mechanism with this world, and nothing more than the temporary combination of several inter-dependent parts. WHAT therefore could possibly be your motivation for leaving something behind? WHERE does this desire poluted with ignorance come from? Surely a man proud of his intelligence would recognize the extention of himself in his bloodline is nothing more than empty illusion?

''we live our life through our kids when we die, continuing on our bloodline.''

I find absolutely no sense in this statement. What does it mean? Can you quantify this feeling you have or is it simply an impulse caused by random genetic mutations ultimately resulting in a beneficial psychological make-up?

'' I think there may not be an afterlife ''

In so-called respected academic circles - high seats of learning - this is certainly the most prevailent of philosophical attitutes. This has become the norm. Richard Dawkings being applauded on TED for (basically) stating that he's actively against religion must be noted. In all the leading physics and microbiology apartments conversations always follow this belief-system.

''We further our knowledge of science so we can provide a better and safer life for our kids''

We are failing hard then. 

''Protecting our bloodline and thus continuing and protecting the race of man.''

There it is again - a blind abondonment of your empiricism for the sake of...? If you die and that's it then there should be absolutely no  motivation for you to find solace in any of these mythical elixirs.



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None of the above here is why:

Forwards Time Travel is nothing special and independed of black holes and wormholes. We have already several time travlers that traveled into the future. Traveling into the future in the context of trying to enter a black hole is senseless.

For forwards time travel you dont need exotic space configurations like wormholes and black holes. You just need Speed the faster you get the slower time moves at lightspeed you travel infinetly far into the future. At 99.99999999999999999999% you can pass whole Millions of Lightyears in just a year from your perspective. On earth ofcourse Millions of years would pass.

Blackholes are not qualified for time travel backwards in time. And if you think they are portals you are mistaken. A portal enables you to go through black holes dont. What happens in a Singulatity cant be determined because no information escapes. But what we now is that you cant reach a black hole EVER. Time is warped in a certain radius around a black hole. It takes forever to reach a black hole you will just freeze in time before ever reaching the hole itself (which isnt a real hole btw)

Black holes could be a gateway to other universes but not like you imagine it. The Big Bang was a Blackhole a Singularity. What happens really in a black hole is not to determin but everything very near to a black hole is caught in time and crushed so that nothing remains. No matter nothing everything becomes one. Maybe this potential causes a reaction on the other "side" like our Big Bang.

Time travel back and forth can be done through wormholes you could make a wormhole and then take one end and speed it up. One end would then be in the future another in the past and you could travel forwards and backwards in time. But if wormholes exist is uncertain. Just because it cant be ruled out doesnt mean that they exist. Besides if they really are practically usable is more then doubtful. No amount of technology can help you over some things. First the predicted wormholes are tiny not even big enough for one atom. You need to increase their size with negative Energy you would need a jupitermass of negative energy that is 300 earths. And we dont even know if negative energy exists we cant grasp it never detected once not even with the Billion Dollar microscope CERN.

Desintegration happens DEFINETLY on the way to the black hole. Whats happening inside is impossible to say at the moment.

An exit for a virtual reality is unlikely because it makes no sense to make an exit like a black hole. Your informations would be scrambled on the way to the black hole and you would need to be restored before you came near the black hole . Besides outside of the virtual reality you dont exist your conciousness developed in the program it means you are the program the same as Nathan Drake (if he was concious) could never leave Uncharted unless we (Gods that control his reality) enable him somehow.

Or are you talking about a Matrix like concept ? That would also be senseless either the beeings that put us there dont want us leaving that means they wouldnt design a way for us to leave. And if they want us to leave then why put the exit lightyears away and make it serm like a 100% way to die. If we are even able to travel so far its really damn hard there is actually no logical reason to think we will travel space like in the movies actually it will NEVER be like in the movies not even close. Not as humans anyway.



Fir all the people that think black holes are a threat I can promise you they arent a bigger threat then all the other things in the Universe. People cant imagine how big everything is. We will most likely never get near to a blackhole. Even if a blackhole would pass our solarsytem in relative short distance (1 Lightyear) NOTHING would happen Black holes are like dark stars . If for example our Sun would switch places with a blackhole of the same mass nothing would change exept that there wouldnt be light. The chance of a black hole entering our solar system is tiny. Its less likely then a Star coming into our solar system. If one day Milkyway and Andromeda collide . They will just melt together there is so much space between the stars that they wont bumb into each other. IWe are so isolated in iur solar system its unimaginable. The chances for an object that is catapulted out of the solar system to meet another big object (bigger then a grain of sand) is almost zero. Even a grain of sand would be a once in thousends of years occasion. Space is vast and empty.



Netyaroze said:
None of the above here is why:

Forwards Time Travel is nothing special and independed of black holes and wormholes. We have already several time travlers that traveled into the future. Traveling into the future in the context of trying to enter a black hole is senseless.

For forwards time travel you dont need exotic space configurations like wormholes and black holes. You just need Speed the faster you get the slower time moves at lightspeed you travel infinetly far into the future. At 99.99999999999999999999% you can pass whole Millions of Lightyears in just a year from your perspective. On earth ofcourse Millions of years would pass.

Blackholes are not qualified for time travel backwards in time. And if you think they are portals you are mistaken. A portal enables you to go through black holes dont. What happens in a Singulatity cant be determined because no information escapes. But what we now is that you cant reach a black hole EVER. Time is warped in a certain radius around a black hole. It takes forever to reach a black hole you will just freeze in time before ever reaching the hole itself (which isnt a real hole btw)

Black holes could be a gateway to other universes but not like you imagine it. The Big Bang was a Blackhole a Singularity. What happens really in a black hole is not to determin but everything very near to a black hole is caught in time and crushed so that nothing remains. No matter nothing everything becomes one. Maybe this potential causes a reaction on the other "side" like our Big Bang.

Time travel back and forth can be done through wormholes you could make a wormhole and then take one end and speed it up. One end would then be in the future another in the past and you could travel forwards and backwards in time. But if wormholes exist is uncertain. Just because it cant be ruled out doesnt mean that they exist. Besides if they really are practically usable is more then doubtful. No amount of technology can help you over some things. First the predicted wormholes are tiny not even big enough for one atom. You need to increase their size with negative Energy you would need a jupitermass of negative energy that is 300 earths. And we dont even know if negative energy exists we cant grasp it never detected once not even with the Billion Dollar microscope CERN.

Desintegration happens DEFINETLY on the way to the black hole. Whats happening inside is impossible to say at the moment.

An exit for a virtual reality is unlikely because it makes no sense to make an exit like a black hole. Your informations would be scrambled on the way to the black hole and you would need to be restored before you came near the black hole . Besides outside of the virtual reality you dont exist your conciousness developed in the program it means you are the program the same as Nathan Drake (if he was concious) could never leave Uncharted unless we (Gods that control his reality) enable him somehow.

Or are you talking about a Matrix like concept ? That would also be senseless either the beeings that put us there dont want us leaving that means they wouldnt design a way for us to leave. And if they want us to leave then why put the exit lightyears away and make it serm like a 100% way to die. If we are even able to travel so far its really damn hard there is actually no logical reason to think we will travel space like in the movies actually it will NEVER be like in the movies not even close. Not as humans anyway.

''We have already several time travlers that traveled into the future''

Yes, I am one of them. I'm doing it right now. There's also Michael Schumacher who would be a full 3 seconds younger than anyone born the same instant as him. Point is, this applies ALL the time, not just when going really fast. The effects only become noticible then, but the energy required is impracticle.

'' Time is warped in a certain radius around a black hole. It takes forever to reach a black hole you will just freeze in time before ever reaching the hole itself (which isnt a real hole btw)''

This isn't correct. You will certainly reache the hole and be crushed.

So, time to go through that crash course in Special Relativity again?



Netyaroze said:
Fir all the people that think black holes are a threat I can promise you they arent a bigger threat then all the other things in the Universe. People cant imagine how big everything is. We will most likely never get near to a blackhole. Even if a blackhole would pass our solarsytem in relative short distance (1 Lightyear) NOTHING would happen Black holes are like dark stars . If for example our Sun would switch places with a blackhole of the same mass nothing would change exept that there wouldnt be light. The chance of a black hole entering our solar system is tiny. Its less likely then a Star coming into our solar system. If one day Milkyway and Andromeda collide . They will just melt together there is so much space between the stars that they wont bumb into each other. IWe are so isolated in iur solar system its unimaginable. The chances for an object that is catapulted out of the solar system to meet another big object (bigger then a grain of sand) is almost zero. Even a grain of sand would be a once in thousends of years occasion. Space is vast and empty.


While I agree with your general idea, I certainly don't agree with this:

''Even if a blackhole would pass our solarsytem in relative short distance (1 Lightyear) NOTHING would happen''

Even worse than that one is this:

''If for example our Sun would switch places with a blackhole of the same mass nothing would change exept that there wouldnt be light.''

There's no real sense there since a black hole only forms at much,much heavier masses than our sun. And that's the whole point, the gravity in that case would swallow our solar system whole...



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maverick40 said:
JEMC said:
maverick40 said:
Blackholes actually exist, where as wormholes not so much as I can tell. As an astrophysicist, I spent half a year studying the mechanics, temperature profiles and evolution of blackholes. They are fascinating things and I think is reassuring to know that we have one gigantic black hole at the center of our galaxy.

Sorry to ask, but, why is it reassuring?


ha it isn't really but hey the blackhole is what is keeping the galaxy together so I suppose you could say that is reasuring to know.  Although a lot of people don't know what a black hole really is. It is the remnants of collapsed star that has a frozen event horizon. If ye guys are interested I could explain what would happen if someone theoretcially entered a black hole but I understand if ye think it is boring.

Question: How can you say that with such certainty if you have no idea what the interaction of the so-called dark-matter is with our galaxy? Even stranger is dark energy - which (the learned tell us) tend to push space apart.

I'm really flumoxed by how cosmologists and astrophycisists can speak in factual terms when there is much more they don't know than they do know...



Dr.Grass said:
maverick40 said:
JEMC said:
maverick40 said:
Blackholes actually exist, where as wormholes not so much as I can tell. As an astrophysicist, I spent half a year studying the mechanics, temperature profiles and evolution of blackholes. They are fascinating things and I think is reassuring to know that we have one gigantic black hole at the center of our galaxy.

Sorry to ask, but, why is it reassuring?


ha it isn't really but hey the blackhole is what is keeping the galaxy together so I suppose you could say that is reasuring to know.  Although a lot of people don't know what a black hole really is. It is the remnants of collapsed star that has a frozen event horizon. If ye guys are interested I could explain what would happen if someone theoretcially entered a black hole but I understand if ye think it is boring.

Question: How can you say that with such certainty if you have no idea what the interaction of the so-called dark-matter is with our galaxy? Even stranger is dark energy - which (the learned tell us) tend to push space apart.

I'm really flumoxed by how cosmologists and astrophycisists can speak in factual terms when there is much more they don't know than they do know...

What are you trying to get at? 

Do not put down what you do not understand. It is very easy to look up wikipedia and to find general information about cosmology to sound smart. So you trying to sound intelligent to undermine a physicist does not bode well with me.  I am sorry, I deal with your type of people at my university the whole time.

I have studied the mathematics and mechanics of black holes, and I have seen the effect black holes have within other galaxies. Dark matter has little to no interaction with galaxies. It only makes up 1% of the universe mass. Dark energy is an unknown quanity but we do know that it makes up 90 % percent of the universe. Physicist do not claim to know information about dark energy, an experiment was sent up to the ISS last month which should hopefully shed some light on this problem.  





@Dr.Grass

Ok I should have said you ente the Schwarzschild Radius from your own perspective. From outside it looks like that someone/something never enters. But the Schwarzschild Coordinates say time ends inside. Yeah with the Kruszal Coordinates you could have a white hole but can a conciousness possibly pass a black hole without dying if there would be a hypotetical white hole on the other side ? "You will certainly enter the black hole and be crushed" Not if you die before entering the Schwarzschild Radius. And i am not sure how to survive the forces around a black hole.

To the black hole passing in 1 Ly SURE SOMETHING WOULD HAPPEN IT WOULD STIR UP THE OORT CLOUD AND POSSIBLY SEND SOME COMETS IN THE INNER SOLARSYSTEM. But that wouldnt happen because it is a blackhole it would also happen if a Star passes through the oort cloud.

To the minimum mass of the black holes. I know they dont develop from small Stars like the sun. You think people now how much mass you need so a star collapses under its own gravity when the fusion stops ?

I havent written those posts for a physicist but posted them in a game forum. Black holes are no reason for fear they are no bigger threat to us then stars in general.





maverick40 said:
Dr.Grass said:
maverick40 said:
JEMC said:
maverick40 said:
Blackholes actually exist, where as wormholes not so much as I can tell. As an astrophysicist, I spent half a year studying the mechanics, temperature profiles and evolution of blackholes. They are fascinating things and I think is reassuring to know that we have one gigantic black hole at the center of our galaxy.

Sorry to ask, but, why is it reassuring?


ha it isn't really but hey the blackhole is what is keeping the galaxy together so I suppose you could say that is reasuring to know.  Although a lot of people don't know what a black hole really is. It is the remnants of collapsed star that has a frozen event horizon. If ye guys are interested I could explain what would happen if someone theoretcially entered a black hole but I understand if ye think it is boring.

Question: How can you say that with such certainty if you have no idea what the interaction of the so-called dark-matter is with our galaxy? Even stranger is dark energy - which (the learned tell us) tend to push space apart.

I'm really flumoxed by how cosmologists and astrophycisists can speak in factual terms when there is much more they don't know than they do know...

What are you trying to get at? 

Do not put down what you do not understand. It is very easy to look up wikipedia and to find general information about cosmology to sound smart. So you trying to sound intelligent to undermine a physicist does not bode well with me.  I am sorry, I deal with your type of people at my university the whole time.

I have studied the mathematics and mechanics of black holes, and I have seen the effect black holes have within other galaxies. Dark matter has little to no interaction with galaxies. It only makes up 1% of the universe mass. Dark energy is an unknown quanity but we do know that it makes up 90 % percent of the universe. Physicist do not claim to know information about dark energy, an experiment was sent up to the ISS last month which should hopefully shed some light on this problem.  

1. I have a degree in Theoretical Physics and I'm doing MSc in Nuclear Physics so please don't try and patronize me with the 'anyone can look it up in Wiki' nonsense.

2. You have coyly avoided my first response to your statements. That was certainly the most important one as far as I am concerned and I would prefer you to comment on that as a future doctorate of science.

3. Comment #2 (quoted above) wasn't made in any accusative way; I assume you took it that way due to my 1st Comment. Note, that first comment isn't directed at you, but at the statements you made. They are in no way unique or out of the ordinary.

4. For a Astrophysicist you seem to not now that (drumroll as quote from wikipedia gets copied and pasted) ''...From these figures, dark matter constitutes 83%, (23/(23+4.6)), of the matter in the universe, whereas ordinary matter makes up only 17%''  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_matter As everyone can see now you are quite far from the actual accepted fact above.

Q.''What are you trying to get at?''

A. Something very simple really; I observe more and more that the scientific world view is impregnating general society due to the average man being intimitated by complicated terms and guys with PhD's, not because that model that you have built up with your sketchy data is fail-safe.

This is an important topic for me since there are less and less intelligent people willing to stand up to the ego-fuelled Dawkins and co - therefore I must go down this route.

Here's a cosmology question for you (in all seriousness): How are the distances between stars measured?

EDIT: Because anyone following religion these days is considered a lesser mortal by above mentioned scientist and his many followers. So-called disciples of rational thought.