"Or are you telling me you can't imagine a group of people huddled around that system laughing their ass off and chatting as they are playing Wii Chase or Battle Mii."

I can, because being a party game is not enough, even when Nintendo makes it.

"I certainly don't see how a controller with a hardcore revolution that also simplifies learning a game can be considered bad."

How could slapping on a screen simplify learning a game? Touch screens have not made niche games on the DS stop being niche. And motion controls did not make Wii niche games stop being niche. It was just developers and fans that couldn't grasp that those games wouldn't sell huge on any system.

"We aren't talking about waving your arms around even more now, we are talking about more in depth gaming with less motion involved."

That kind of wording shows you think "casuals are dumbed-down gamers", which shows you don't get the real appeal of the Wii over the other systems, and why this won't appeal to them.

There are no "gamers in general", and there was definitely a buyer split - which, yes, was partially caused by developers, but only because about half the home console gamers on the planet followed the games they wanted to play. Pretending that the third parties don't know their own audience is preposterous, and it's even more preposterous to suggest that they don't go (too far) out of their way to serve that audience.

That's a very dubious number claim.

And third paerties have been loosing money, and few games that sell with any legs, which does mean they don't know their audience. Plus thinking they didn't go out of their way is the truth, or else they would have supported the Wii audience as well as the audiences on the other systems, instead of releasing games with increasing sameness, increasing budgets, and/or increasing development time, when the games with any legs have shown that is not what gamers want.

I wonder why a lot of third party companies went under during this generation?  How come barely any third party companies are seeing profit right now?  If they knew their audience then you would think they would at least be able to make a profit.

I do think a split was created simply because a new market was created, or unearthed after having been gone a long time. So then all of a sudden there are two markets.

I think Nintendo first party titles have always been an excellent hybrid between the depth of hardcore and the breadth of casual/accessible gameplay. The problem is that they have always been showcased on a console that hardcore people abhor.

WiiU will inevitably lose a decent amount of the new expanded market that the wii created with it's accessible gameplay, but that is the price for making yourself attractive to a hardcore audience. They'll achieve the middle ground they want, just it probably won't strike as big as the Wii did.

But potentially having a middle ground platform for the first time is more of an achievement in the medium than sales numbers are

Except the NES and SNES already did that.

how is it a dubious claim?? HD consoles have a higher install base than Wii does. And the gamers dont want sameness, tell that to COD

hmmm...  maybe....   I see your point, but I'm on the fence.  They had plenty of awesome accessible and games for casual play that could be enjoyed by a bunch of people in the same room, like Wii.  And they had some intense games that you really had to devote yourself to for many hours in order to beat... but I'm not sure they had a hardcore audience that rivals something like that of Halo or Modern Warfare.  I think those games are some prime examples of the pinnacle fo a "hardcore" audience.  I'm not sure where difficulty factors in because I openly admit that some NES and SNES games were harder, but none of them had such a devoted and narrow following.

But the Wii U at least has the potential of being one of the first middle ground platforms in a long ass time if the concept follows through.

So what I get from this is that Iwata & co. caved in to public pressure? Sure looks like they did.
How is it that they miss the fact that the third parties need them more than they need the third parties?

"Evolve", hah. They're just trying to capture both audiences, and as I see it now, this will only end up in alienating them.

PS3 has 50 mil worldwide and 360 has 54, thats 104 to 86 for Wii. I see what your saying but lets be real here. most of the multiplat games are available to both PS360 and not Wii. THere called the HD twins for a reason. I was looking at it from the perspective of a third party. THe PS360 are so close to each in terms of dev kits and capabilities im sure when Valve trys to sell, Portal 2 there not looking at we need to sell this much on PS3 or 360, we need to sell this much period. Its not the devs fault that Ninty decided to make a system that would not be compatable with most games they were making. If i want to make an HD game i do have more to work with PS360. I have Wii and PS3, and while i prefer SOny over Ninty, if i was a Ninty fan i would still probably game on PS3 more, simply because they have those 3rd party games that are a no show on Wii