If this isn't just about third parties shifting all their resources to the Wii, then I stand corrected and agree.

I absolutely agree with your assessment, Talon. Yes, I have seen it for myself; Nintendo is warping the entire industry around themselves. There's no question at this point. The best examples are EA Casual and Ubisoft Casual: two of the biggest third party companies in the world aren't just focusing their developers on the Wii, they're creating divisions -- entire divisions -- pretty much as a direct result of the DS/Wii success.

But these supreme examples should only emphasize the common ground between Legend and other posters here. EA, Ubisoft, and other companies (I know Activision has a casual-like division now, too) aren't just telling their Assassin's Creed or Metal Gear developers to start making Assassin's Creed or Metal Gear for the Wii; instead, those Assassin's Creed style games are still being made for the PS3/360/PC -- and I think that will be true for the forseeable future -- and new teams and creative input are being harnessed for Wii/DS development.

In other words, Legend (if I'm understanding him correctly) is probably right that these major, traditional third party games -- particularly the "grittier" ones that focus on shooting and sports -- will likely continue to be published primarily on the other consoles, and the new, innovative, and sometimes more casual stuff will be published on the Wii. At the same time, the very fact that these new divisions and developers are all being focused on the Wii automatically means that the industry is warping around Nintendo at the same time that these more traditional enthusiast games are being made. In essence, I still think we agree, we're just coming at this from different angles.

Publishers don't generall care how many of the top 10 are Nintendo games - they care how many 3rd party titles (esp their titles) make money. Last gen, most companies would rather be the #20 PS2 game than the #5 GameCube game. As the overall base grows larger, overall software sales will increase, and profitablity of all titles will increase, which will continue third party support.

 This is nothing new for Nintendo.... even in glory days when 4rd parties did very well, the NES, SNES, and some N64 days, 3rd parties will ALWAYS be dwarfed by Nintendo 1st/2nd party games.

Basically EA is making money off the systems it takes seriously. It is not taking the Wii seriously, so it is not making money off it. Simple really.

So far Capcom and Namco are the ony real developers taking the Wii seriously right now and even that effort has been half hearted so far. Ubisoft is making a modest effort, but not a serious one. Nintendo games sell on Nintendo consoles because they're some of the few franchises that have been handled seriously thus far on the Wii.

Don't mistake this for the Wii not being able to handle serious franchises, RE4 has proven that dead wrong. It's easy to say there are no successful serious third party games on the Wii when no one puts serious third party games on the Wii to begin with. Right now anti-Wii fanboys try to spin the Wii as a one trick pony half hoping it will become true and half trying to rationalize their concern with the 360's and PS3's obvious place behind the Wii. As the gap grows and as what few serious third party games make it to the Wii and succeed grow it'll be increasingly difficult for developers to ignore it as the flagship console of this generation.

How long were we told to forgive the 360's rough start because it was only its first year? How many times did you try and tell us that it was only the PS3's first year and things would be different in 2008? Yet now oh so conveniently you want us to believe the Wii's first year is its set in stone trend from here on out and things won't improve? You want us to believe that a console which took the gaming world by storm won't makes its own equilibrium?

I think Legend is right to an extent, as a lot of publishers are risk aversive and would rather stay with what they know works despite the deminishing returns.

But I think a game like TimeSplitters 4 or Monster Hunter 3 coming to the Wii and doing very well, will change a lot of other publishers minds.  Inevidably some publishers with some vision will blaze a trail on Wii and others will follow.  Wii will become the main focus for 3rd parties (in general) but PC/360/PS3 support will never go away entirely.  However they'll get doomed to even more of the same as, again, 3rd parties would rather drop CoD5 - 7 on them knowing it'll sell, than do anything like NiGHTS and risk huge losses.

BTW I think NiGHTS will do fine on Wii long term like many other games that started slow (Carnival Games, My Sims, Zack & Wiki, etc.)

This is what I have been saying all along - developers were "afraid" to invest in a Nintendo system heavily , to start with. Its clear that the N64 and the GC paled in comparison (sales wise most notably) to the PS1 and the PS2. Now the Wii has taken the top spot, and developers are going to have no choice but to release games on it. They have to make a profit, and if they can do so by releasing games on the Wii, it's going to happen, I can guarentee if the Wii continues the path it's on, 3rd parties are going to follow a process of - porting PS3/360 games over, and adding on games that can only be found on the Wii.

Suggesting that the Wii, if it continues to dominate in sales, will NOT also dominate in 3rd party support is the argumentative equivalent of plugging your ears and screaming "NAAAH NAAHH NAAHH! CAN'T HEAR YOU!!!"

I'm not trying to be mean. I'm trying to point out the economic fallacy in your logic. It outsold the 360 in less than half the time and burned the PS3 right out of the gate. I realize that zealous fanbots will pluck any excuse they can from their rear ends in an attempt to reassure themselves in their decision to purchase a PS3/60, but really, it's starting to become embarrassing.

Even as a zealous GC owner, I didn't have any illusions that the GC was going to somehow surge ahead and take first in the console race. None whatsoever. It's time to wake up and take the situation for what it is: the Wii wins, end of story. I could understand if the Wii had JUST stopped selling out like crazy and sales of the console were starting to taper off, but at this rate, there's nothing to suggest that the Wii won't be the hot item NEXT Xmas as well (it's done it for two, why not three?).

And if current 3rd party devs decide to be curmudgeons and not develop for the Wii, fine, fuck 'em. Wiiware is coming out soon and boasts a crop of starry-eyed new development blood with new ideas and a fresh perspective on the market. If devs won't develop for the Wii, they're going to be left behind.

There's something that your're missing though...  The PC, 360, and PS3 all have gamers that have relatively similar tastes in games.  I'm not saying that every PC game would be a hit on console or vice-versa but that there is definitely a lot in common between them.  The Wii on the other hand has a much more diverse audience in which the hardcore are not the majority.  Add into that the fact that the Wii has significantly less power than the other two consoles and a unique controller and it adds even more differences between them. 

So why is all that important?  Well because third parties are making a lot of multiplatform games and they can pretty much treat the PC/360/PS3 audiences as the same and development as pretty similar between them (especially with popular engines like Unreal Engine 3).  Sure there are some differences like some 360s not having a harddrive but that pales in comparison to the Wii's differences (88 megs of ram, motion controller, etc).  So basically that adds to the decisions that third parties have to make when deciding what platforms to put games on and what they want the game to achieve.

Now I'm sure someone will mention the development budget on the Wii being lower but that isn't the whole picture.  Multiplatform games can spread costs among the different versions (level designers, artists, etc).  Also because of the very nature of the PC/360/PS3 audiences it's likely easier to know what games are almost a sure thing with them.  Not only that but some successful third party multiplatform PC/360/PS3 games are hitting 3-5+ million right now.  That's several million copies of pure profit once the initial cost is paid off.  You can bet that third parties planning AAA games take that into consideration.

I feel like Tom Cruise and you're my new publicist trying to explain away some wacky Scientology statements I've made (I'm not a Scientologist for anyone wondering).  Anyways you don't have to keep defending my remarks or explaining them away.  Anytime I post something I usually provide reasons and sometimes evidence for my reasoning and the people who dismiss it outright or treat it as crazy and/or completely wrong are usually those that have a particular belief and are unwilling to listen to or look at anything that may dispel that belief.