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Forums - General - Church forced girl, 15, to apologize for pregnancy by rape

highwaystar101 said:
sapphi_snake said:
highwaystar101 said:

I don't think this has anything to do with the church, just one man with a distorted view on the world (and a congregation that will be sympathetic towards his manner of dealing with things).

Isn't that essentially the Church?

It's more of a cult to be honest.

Are't all religions "cults"?



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

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sapphi_snake said:
highwaystar101 said:
sapphi_snake said:
highwaystar101 said:

I don't think this has anything to do with the church, just one man with a distorted view on the world (and a congregation that will be sympathetic towards his manner of dealing with things).

Isn't that essentially the Church?

It's more of a cult to be honest.

Are't all religions "cults"?

I wouldn't say so, religions are formed of a wide variety of beliefs and interpretations. One Christian is not the same as the next, for example. Where as a cult, this disparity in thinking across the group is almost non-existant.



sapphi_snake said:
The Fury said:

Sadly true, it still stands that an individual's morals as based on teachings and their views on them. If not scewed by their owns perceptions. In majority of cases it helps the person become better.

Whether this is true, religion is the basis for nigh on all man's perceptions on what is right or wrong by the commandments and teachings, and from these our morals are based around them.

I'm not religious, and my morals don't come from any religion. And Christianity actually borrowed most of it's moral principles froom the Greek phislosphers, Confucianism was a philosiphical system that was turned by it's adepts into a religion etc. Morals come from philosophy, and are reflections on the best way to behave, in order for society to work. They have nothing to do with supernatural forces.

Your morals might not but society's as a whole does. It's religion that established the morals, religious spread was/is far stronger then common thinking or philosphy. Christianity might have borrowed views on western morality choices but what of the rest of the world? Many regions have their own views on morality unconnected to Christianity yet these areas do have faiths which contain those definitions of right and wrong.



Hmm, pie.

highwaystar101 said:
sapphi_snake said:
highwaystar101 said:
sapphi_snake said:
highwaystar101 said:

I don't think this has anything to do with the church, just one man with a distorted view on the world (and a congregation that will be sympathetic towards his manner of dealing with things).

Isn't that essentially the Church?

It's more of a cult to be honest.

Are't all religions "cults"?

I wouldn't say so, religions are formed of a wide variety of beliefs and interpretations. One Christian is not the same as the next, for example. Where as a cult, this disparity in thinking across the group is almost non-existant.

This is true, but in a small, tight community, doesn't the religion become a cult? For example, Christianity at large is a religion, but doesn't each individual local Church congregation act as a cult?



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

The Fury said:
sapphi_snake said:
The Fury said:

Sadly true, it still stands that an individual's morals as based on teachings and their views on them. If not scewed by their owns perceptions. In majority of cases it helps the person become better.

Whether this is true, religion is the basis for nigh on all man's perceptions on what is right or wrong by the commandments and teachings, and from these our morals are based around them.

I'm not religious, and my morals don't come from any religion. And Christianity actually borrowed most of it's moral principles froom the Greek phislosphers, Confucianism was a philosiphical system that was turned by it's adepts into a religion etc. Morals come from philosophy, and are reflections on the best way to behave, in order for society to work. They have nothing to do with supernatural forces.

Your morals might not but society's as a whole does. It's religion that established the morals, religious spread was/is far stronger then common thinking or philosphy. Christianity might have borrowed views on western morality choices but what of the rest of the world? Many regions have their own views on morality unconnected to Christianity yet these areas do have faiths which contain those definitions of right and wrong.

I already gave Confucianism as an example. Confucius wasn't a religious leader, but after his death the followers of his philosophical belief created a religion around him. All morals are a result of philosophy, they are not dictated by some supernatural force. Religion may perpetuate some morals, but the problem with religion as a source for morals is that it takes the morals from the logical system in which they were created. It demands it's adherents to blindly follow those morals, considers them absolute, and rejects any change (a serious flaw, because as human knowledge advances, some morals become irrational and even dangerous).

Nowadays people think more than they used to, and lots of them choose what morals to follow based on rational thought, rather that it was written in some book.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

Around the Network

Thats why religion sucks (IMO!), if ya dont have one, the only person you have to comfort is yourself. (And of course those who are kind to you, but thats obvious.)



I'm a Foreigner, and as such, i am grateful for everyone pointing out any mistakes in my english posted above - only this way i'll be able to improve. thank you!

sapphi_snake said:
highwaystar101 said:
sapphi_snake said:

Are't all religions "cults"?

I wouldn't say so, religions are formed of a wide variety of beliefs and interpretations. One Christian is not the same as the next, for example. Where as a cult, this disparity in thinking across the group is almost non-existant.

This is true, but in a small, tight community, doesn't the religion become a cult? For example, Christianity at large is a religion, but doesn't each individual local Church congregation act as a cult?

There are certainly inclusive local churches that do act like cults (such as WBC). But typically I think most churches can associate themselves with a larger group (Catholic, protestant, Lutheran, etc) so they have a link to a larger organisation.



sapphi_snake said:
The Fury said:

Your morals might not but society's as a whole does. It's religion that established the morals, religious spread was/is far stronger then common thinking or philosphy. Christianity might have borrowed views on western morality choices but what of the rest of the world? Many regions have their own views on morality unconnected to Christianity yet these areas do have faiths which contain those definitions of right and wrong.

I already gave Confucianism as an example. Confucius wasn't a religious leader, but after his death the followers of his philosophical belief created a religion around him. All morals are a result of philosophy, they are not dictated by some supernatural force. Religion may perpetuate some morals, but the problem with religion as a source for morals is that it takes the morals from the logical system in which they were created. It demands it's adherents to blindly follow those morals, considers them absolute, and rejects any change (a serious flaw, because as human knowledge advances, some morals become irrational and even dangerous).

Nowadays people think more than they used to, and lots of them choose what morals to follow based on rational thought, rather that it was written in some book.

Is there no such thing as religious philosphy? Philosphy is just the study of lifes problems and answering them, religion can do it all. I just believe that most of the worlds ethics are based on early religious establishment. 

I agree with your last statement though.



Hmm, pie.

sapphi_snake said:
The Fury said:
sapphi_snake said:
The Fury said:

Sadly true, it still stands that an individual's morals as based on teachings and their views on them. If not scewed by their owns perceptions. In majority of cases it helps the person become better.

Whether this is true, religion is the basis for nigh on all man's perceptions on what is right or wrong by the commandments and teachings, and from these our morals are based around them.

I'm not religious, and my morals don't come from any religion. And Christianity actually borrowed most of it's moral principles froom the Greek phislosphers, Confucianism was a philosiphical system that was turned by it's adepts into a religion etc. Morals come from philosophy, and are reflections on the best way to behave, in order for society to work. They have nothing to do with supernatural forces.

Your morals might not but society's as a whole does. It's religion that established the morals, religious spread was/is far stronger then common thinking or philosphy. Christianity might have borrowed views on western morality choices but what of the rest of the world? Many regions have their own views on morality unconnected to Christianity yet these areas do have faiths which contain those definitions of right and wrong.

I already gave Confucianism as an example. Confucius wasn't a religious leader, but after his death the followers of his philosophical belief created a religion around him. All morals are a result of philosophy, they are not dictated by some supernatural force. Religion may perpetuate some morals, but the problem with religion as a source for morals is that it takes the morals from the logical system in which they were created. It demands it's adherents to blindly follow those morals, considers them absolute, and rejects any change (a serious flaw, because as human knowledge advances, some morals become irrational and even dangerous).

Nowadays people think more than they used to, and lots of them choose what morals to follow based on rational thought, rather that it was written in some book.

Religion is the sole reason for morals. Philosophy is about doing what is smartest and thinking about the consequenses. In religion, bad actions are met with bad consequenses. Its also a way to explain the unexplainable, and to keep peace of mind. Philosiphy, does neither really. And the bolded is just ridiculous. Religion demands nothing but faith. By religion i mean christianity. 



No worse than the woman that was stoned to death for having sex outside marriage (she was also raped)

Words fail me.