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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - My impressions of SMG and MP3:C

Game_boy said:

Metroid Prime 3's gameplay looks to be similar to Metroid Prime 1 and 2, but controls are a disappointment. No; they are a catastrophe which ruins the entire game. All of the modes including No Free Aim are loose and inaccurate; when I want it to lock on I want the shots to go where I want like on the Gamecube! Easy enemies can just dodge and shoot at me as I bump into walls and shoot over their heads. The Wii Remote additions are indeed tacked on and clunky while breaking up the atmosphere of places into something more like Wario Ware. The viewpoint doesn't seem to be much different from Metroid Prime 1 and 2, but somehow the controls make me feel it is small and constrained. Weapon and visor switching is slow and complicated while making me press the wrong buttons and enter Hyper Mode/open the Map/Jump/Morph Ball/waste Missiles/etc. The whole game might be better than Metroid Prime, but I'll never realise that if I constantly think "Why can't I have a Gamecube controller?". In conclusion, I feel they have tried to make the game appeal more to core FPS fans and casual gamers at the same time: destroying the experience for both these and players from the core Nintendo audience such as me. 6/15

 

 


So you're telling me that, because you suck at FPS games, the controls are horrible?

MP3 has the best controls of any console FPS i've ever played. I'm no uber pro FPS player, but I had no problem getting used to MP3's control scheme. But maybe that's becuase i'm a PC gamer(mostly).



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I don't think having an HDTV will necessarily guarantee lag. I have a friend in Texas who has a pretty high-end HDTV, and he's never once complained that the controls in Prime 3 were loose, lagging, or any of that. But an HDTV most likely does require a more specific sensitivity setting than an SDTV would. I've noticed that my own SDTV is lag-free with the Wiimote at all but the lowest sensitivity settings.



Sky Render - Sanity is for the weak.

heres a hint for you with prime...turn the control up--if yuo leave them at standard you will not like them, they are the best FPS controls you will fine any where--i think better even then Medal of Honor Heroes 2



 

I'm pretty sure the Space Pirates dodge a LOT more than they did in MP1. (only played 1 & 3, forgive me.) Definitely more FPS than the previous episodes. And yes: "Okay, you have to follow these instructions or we can't open the door. Ready? Pull, twist push! Good job doing the same thing you've done for the last 15 hours! But we put a cutscene behind it YEAH!" *headdesk*

2-player SMG is fantastic for anyone who isn't good at games in general, or a friend who likes to "watch" people play games. Don't count it out just yet.



There is no such thing as a console war. This is the first step to game design.

famousringo said:
Entroper said:
Game_boy said:
What do you think of my comments on Metroid? They wrecked the controls in my opinion.

Diametrically opposed. The controls worked beautifully for me. I had no problems with accuracy; I felt the pointer tracking was absolutely razor sharp. It almost makes me think you have a problem with your setup that's causing the IR camera and sensor bar not to work the way they should. Especially in light of most reviewers saying things like "this is how FPS controls should be done on the Wii."


Agreed.

 

Honestly, if you had a tough time playing MP3 and you hate games like WarioWare, I think you may have bought the wrong console...


Yep; would you like the Wii itself aiming for you?



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Something to consider is that with analog sticks you have to:

-approximate the location of your target by 'getting close'...
-and then precision aim and fire

The same goes with the Wii-mote, you have to

-easily get "almost' targeted precisely where you move to,...
-And then you catch up near instantly and are able to shoot.


Except I honestly feel that the Wii-mote targeting is greatly better than the analog control of, say Halo, where speed seems to work better on Wii.


I do understand the lag issue on some games, some games worse than others... but you have to remember, with a Wii-mote, it's easier to know exactly where you have to move your reticle to... I played countless hours of Halo1/2, and even then I had issues with trying to get the analog sticks to work out perfect.


Wii-mote movement is hands down better. Speed, accuracy, sometimes a bit of lag, but the pluses out weigh the negatives by a landslide. Obviously dual analogs have their issues. But I'd say Wii-mote has less issues, more positives.



Numbers: Checker Players > Halo Players

Checkers Age and replayability > Halo Age and replayability

Therefore, Checkers > Halo

So, Checkers is a better game than Halo.

And there's a lot of complaints about having to shoot at doors that don't open immediately.... most people don't understand that Metroid 'doors' are a way of masking load times and memory issues.

Compare to Halo. While you have checkpoints, the same are said for Metroid. The checkpoints are similar to doors. The cutscenes in Halo are similar to elevators in Metroid. Except, loadtimes in Halo seem to be a bit higher in general, when dealing with levels... quite higher.

All in all, you have to consider what's going on with the system, and then guess how the programmers are trying to mask the need to process information and disguise against the user.

It's a lot like original Zelda. One screen at a time, to load and display things fluidly. You couldn't load the entire overworld map, but could display the neighboring room, and THEN display the enemies. Same concept.


If you have a better idea for how to make a game more fluid, I'm sure they'd pay you for your ideas



Numbers: Checker Players > Halo Players

Checkers Age and replayability > Halo Age and replayability

Therefore, Checkers > Halo

So, Checkers is a better game than Halo.

Whoa give him a chance to respond about the settings before you guys lay into him. I think we should make sure he has the controls set up properly and then even if he does have them set up right, he is still entitled to his opinion just like anyone else.



To Each Man, Responsibility

The best way to mask load times (and I've seen a few games do this) is to do a form of pre-emptive loading. You have the program make an educated guess on where the player will go next, and load accordingly as they approach. Alternately, you can have the game pre-load each potential area the player can reach from their current area while they're in said current area. It doesn't eliminate load times entirely, and really doesn't work if the player suddenly turns around and goes back the way they came (unless you use cache loading, which some systems lack the available RAM to do effectively), but it works well enough.



Sky Render - Sanity is for the weak.

Game_boy said:

I recieved Super Mario Galaxy and Metroid Prime 3: Corruption for Christmas. These were my two most anticipated games ever, because Super Mario 64 (Though Sunshine was great too) and Metroid Prime were the best games ever in my opinion. I had previously played every notable Mario and Metroid game up to that point and enjoyed all of them. Alternating between playing through one and the other yesterday, my impressions were very different from one another.

GRAPHICS:

Super Mario Galaxy's graphics are great - not perfect; I could have done with more shiny and reflections, but overall they match Sunshine while increasing the draw distance to have all of the planets. Galaxy looks much better in motion; flying between planets is the best use of 3D graphics I have ever seen in any game, "next-gen" or not. The art direction is awesome: it fits perfectly with the level design. Sunshine had a more suitable atmosphere and Mario 64 pushed the console more, but on Galaxy it doesn't matter because you'll have left the planet before tiring of the graphics there. The best graphics to be found are the boss models and the Black Holes. 7/10

Metroid Prime 3's graphics, however, are perfect. There is so much detail and unique work in each room; the cutscenes are some of the most natural I've seen; and the "extreme" environments are indeed extreme because of the superb art direction. When the base is under attack in the first area of the game; you feel actually in danger as if Pirates were going to come through the walls because of the battles outside and the vibration/particles. The downside is that sometimes there are insufficient environments to express the potential of the graphics (that problem was worse in Metroid Prime 2: purple swamp or purple desert?) and the loading times have noticeably increased. 9/10

SOUND:

Super Mario Galaxy has great sound. The orchestrated music is all great, and there are a few themes (less than Super Mario 64, but...) that are truly memorable. The sound effects are perfect, they removed the voice acting that detracted from Sunshine, the music notes playing classic tunes are genius, and when they start doing remixes of classic remixes you know it's perfect. 5/5

Metroid Prime 3 has unremarkable sound. Some of the environmental tracks are quite good, especially the fire and ice planets, but for the most part they fade into the background like Metroid Prime 2's did. I wanted a new Tallon Overworld or Chozo Ruins, but there's no attachment between music and place. Again, the sound effects are adequate, but the very best ones are ripped drectly out of the Gamecube games or are remixes of NES or SNES Metroids. Well, I can say it doesn't damage the game. 3/5

UN-STORY:

Super Mario Galaxy could have done without a story like all Mario games, but the heavy prose is optional and so not intrusive. If Galaxy had no story beyond a kidnapped princess it would have been perfect, but occasionally the plight of a random woman in green jumps out at you so it cannot be. 4/5

Metroid Prime 3 certainly has an epic story, but it was at the expense of exploration and imagination in level design. In every other Metroid game, there has been little real reason to be running around the planets looking for the Ice Beam, but here we have to save some Federation guys I don't care about instead of exploring. The addition of other Hunters in MP:H was the perfect thing to make the game boring and repetitive; and so this mechanic returns in MP3:C just to irritate me. 3/5

DESIGN:

Super Mario Galaxy's best feature is its level design. The balance and timing is perfect to captivate the player, and each planet is so different that nothing is ever reused. It is a linear game; nevertheless the path taken is never obvious until you reach a given planet. You feel like you're making a decision to turn left, while in reality that is the intended path. You're never lost, but you're never sure where you'll end up. Each star in a galaxy is so different that every one might as well be in a brand new galaxy - it's that good. Finally, the comet stars give variety to an already strong premise by carefully selecting a unique aspect of a level to challenge you. For example, the only star which I've encountered where the difficulty was the speed of the enemies was #3 of the Beach Bowl Galaxy. As soon as I completed that, a comet appeared to challenge me to only the hard part of that star - with much faster enemies. There is only one issue and that is that the hub wasn't well developed enough - however this is easy to ignore because of the depth elsewhere. To be honest spending most of your time in the overworld (Super Mario 64 DS had 1/5 of the stars there) merely backtracking or doing mini-puzzles is bad anyway. 9/10

Metroid Prime 3 has good level design comparing well with its predecessors. There is effective use of puzzles and the limited extent of exploration is adequate. It is never repetitive but some mechanics are reused from earlier games with the new weapons not being used to a great extent to solve puzzles. The Wii Remote as explained in the Controls section also has its potential wasted through menial tasks like locks. The Grapple Beam is perhaps the best used motion-sensing tool, but its use in the levels is again limited. 7/10

GAMEPLAY/CONTROLS:

Super Mario Galaxy's gameplay is faithful to Super Mario 64: every control from sliding down poles to side somersaults was the same. The addition of the spin is so natural - when I am frustrated with a situation or obstacle, waving the remote is the instinctive reaction and it just works; the same is true for the Star Bit gathering. Every puzzle can be solved exactly like you would predict from Super Mario 64, but the gravity mechanic introduces enough complexity to keep it interesting and fresh. The Wii Remote is not necessarily superior to the Gamecube controller except for the spin and collecting moves, but the controls are in the best places at least. 13/15

Metroid Prime 3's gameplay looks to be similar to Metroid Prime 1 and 2, but controls are a disappointment. No; they are a catastrophe which ruins the entire game. All of the modes including No Free Aim are loose and inaccurate; when I want it to lock on I want the shots to go where I want like on the Gamecube! Easy enemies can just dodge and shoot at me as I bump into walls and shoot over their heads. The Wii Remote additions are indeed tacked on and clunky while breaking up the atmosphere of places into something more like Wario Ware. The viewpoint doesn't seem to be much different from Metroid Prime 1 and 2, but somehow the controls make me feel it is small and constrained. Weapon and visor switching is slow and complicated while making me press the wrong buttons and enter Hyper Mode/open the Map/Jump/Morph Ball/waste Missiles/etc. The whole game might be better than Metroid Prime, but I'll never realise that if I constantly think "Why can't I have a Gamecube controller?". In conclusion, I feel they have tried to make the game appeal more to core FPS fans and casual gamers at the same time: destroying the experience for both these and players from the core Nintendo audience such as me. 6/15

VALUE

Super Mario Galaxy is long enough to provide excellent value, and while the co-op feels tacked on, multiplayer wasn't really an option for this kind of game. Getting all 241 stars will take quite some time too if you want to. This game also has value because everyone in your family can play it. 4/5

Metroid Prime 3 is a long game which does provide value for money. It has several types of collectible items the player can find, as well as coloured tokens for certain achievements, some of which can be traded online and all of which unlock rewards such as concept art. One problem is that if you don't have many Wii-owning friends it can be very hard to fairly trade vouchers, making some of the content inaccessible. However, the main issue is the lack of online multiplayer - a huge missed opportunity. Metroid Prime 2's multiplayer was at its core great: it just needed expanding with more weapons, maps and modes. Hunters was great but limited by the DS's capabilities and my dislike of the single-player game there. MP3 could have solved all of these issues and added online play to match the other great console sci-fi shooter series. So, despite the core game having good value, that omission detracts from the score. 3/5

TOTALS:

Super Mario Galaxy 42/50 (A* Grade)

Metroid Prime 3: Corruption 31/50 (C Grade)

40+ A*

36+ A

32+ B

28+ C

24+ D

20+ E

Less than 20 U

 

EDIT: Just ignore this post, brother got on my account, probably trying to get me a ban

Crusty VGchartz old timer who sporadically returns & posts. Let's debate nebulous shit and expand our perpectives. Or whatever.