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Forums - Nintendo - What Project Café means for a core Nintendo fan

CGI-Quality said:
scottie said:
CGI-Quality said:
scottie said:
CGI-Quality said:
uno said:

 

 

I didn't say they needed the most power, just power that could keep up with it's competitors.


The Wii had enough power to keep up with it's competitors. If it didn't, it would not have sold well.

 

Ignoring insignificant developers like id and crytek, find examples of developers or publishers saying that they are scaling back or stopping development for the Wii because it is not powerful enough.

 

Trust me, you will not find any. You will find all the big developers that stopped supporting the Wii did so because their shitty games weren't selling.

You're missing the point, it didn't have the particular power needed to satisfy 3rd party companies. Of course it had "enough" power to compete, but it was Nintendo's games that single-handily carried the system, not 3rd party support (unlike it's competitors where it helped in a tremendous way). We can argue about "shitty" games all day, but it's lack of power in conjunction to it's competitors played a role in it being next to ignored the whole gen.

Nintendo obviously understands this and the appropriate measures are being taken.


Provide a single link to a developer other than Crytek or ID saying that they are reducing support for or not supporting the Wii on the basis of its lack of power.



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scottie said:

Most power

Mega Drive

This is tangential, but I do want to correct this minor point: contrary to popular belief, the Genesis did not in fact contain more horsepower than the SNES. Yes, a comparison of the two base units will lead to that conclusion, but the SNES, like the NES before it, was not intended to have the full RAM and processor in the base unit. Instead, SNES game cartridges, like NES cartridges earlier, often contained a co-processor and additional RAM, which boosted the system's capabilities beyond those of the Genesis. In essence, with some games you upgraded your SNES much like you do your PC, but you never realize that you're doing it!

This is why late SNES games like Donkey Kong Country and Yoshi's Island had far more advanced graphics than anything that the Genesis, or even earlier SNES games, could muster. This is also why the FX chip is so special: the 3D graphics featured in games like Starfox and that racing game who's name escapes me right now needed far more power than the base unit could offer, but the FX chip had the additional processor might and added RAM needed. There were multiple chips released in this manner, starting at launch (Pilotwings). You can read about the list of SNES enhancement chips here.

As a final addendum, the Genesis did technically employ a similar system, called the Virtua Processor Chip, but the Genesis was not intended to employ the same cartridge-based add ons as the standard, like the SNES did, so only one game was ever made with this method (Virtua Racing), and it was extremely cost-prohibitive.

Okay, I'm done with my tangent now.



CGI-Quality said:
scottie said:


Provide a single link to a developer other than Crytek or ID saying that they are reducing support for or not supporting the Wii on the basis of its lack of power.

Call it a hunch, but I think it'd be naive to assume otherwise. The system wasn't singled out for "shitty" games because 3rd parties just didn't like Nintendo, hardware specifications surely played a role.

You also ignored my last bit, if Nintendo sees the issue, why will you ignore it?


I already explained why (imo) the Wii was given bad support, see my posts above.

 

As for Nintendo addressing the issue, the 3DS is more than a generation ahead of the DS because there was a specific thing it needed to do (3D), we know nothing about project cafe yet. Why do you say that Ninty sees the issue?



You say so much and source so little

 

Examples of companies that believe that my argument is correct

EA - http://www.develop-online.net/news/37298/Nintendo-must-heed-third-party-warning-EA-says

Nintendo - http://www.next-gen.biz/features/gdc-iwata-how-succeed-wii-ds

Ubisoft - http://au.gamespot.com/forums/topic/26027796/ubisoft-well-have-nintendo-like-quality-on-the-wii-in-2008?page=0

Miyamoto-san himself “If there’s only one piece of advice that I could give to the managers of third party companies, it would be that a lot of times it seems that when they’re putting games out on Nintendo hardware, those games are being developed by their third-string team or their fourth-string team. Maybe that’s because they see those products as being unique projects or somewhat smaller-scale projects. But when Nintendo puts out a title that is designed to really support and sell its hardware, that title is always developed by one of our number one teams. And so I think that when it comes to the question of trying to compete with our software, I would really like to see them try to do that with their number one teams rather than with the third- or fourth-string teams.” 

 

Can you please provide a link to why you think third parties aren't supporting the Wii based on its power, or how Nintendo believe this to be the case.



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hm, yeah, I like the idea of zelda and mario being in hd BUT Zelda SS hasn't even released. 

Time to rant: SS will be the first zelda game to be developed purpusely for the wii. It will release 5 years after the last console zelda game, so by that reckoning, we won't see Zelda HD until 2016. oh..the joys of being a Nintendo/Zelda fan. 



scottie said:
CGI-Quality said:
uno said:

wait...graphics = gameplay??

where have I been??

If you know anything about Nintendo, it would be that no matter how much power they have, their games are still fun and engaging to pick up and play.

The author wasn't trying to say that graphics = gameplay. He just emphasizes his excitement that Nintendo may finally be back in the game next gen. By "back in the game", he means not ignored by 3rd party companies and high-def graphics may just be what gets the foot in the door.


Lets look at where the 3rd parties flocked.

 

NES, Snes, PS1, PS2, DS

 

Most power

Master System, Mega Drive, N64, Xbox, PS3

 

Correlation does not imply causation, but lack of correlation does not imply causation either.

 

Fact is, the Wii's lack of 3rd party support had nothing to do with lack of power, and it will not be rectified by an increase in power. The Wii was initailly given only token support because the consensus amongst analysts was that it would bomb, selling less than the GC. After it took off (well, a few years after, analysts and producers are pretty unwilling to admit their mistakes), 3rd parties brought a lot of games to the Wii. Unfortunately, developers didn't have a clue who actually owned a Wii, or what sort of games they wanted. They lacked the intelligence required to even copy Nintendo, and so their attempts to do so failed. Seeing poor sales, most developers did not want to put effort into Wii games, so they didn't. As a result, sales continued to stay low.


Master System more powerful than NES, that was basically a tie I'd say... I should know I had one.

Mega Drive (Sega Genesis) was not in its wildest dreams more powerful than SNES. Get your facts straight.  I had both of them too.

Nintendo 64 more Powerful than PSone IN A SENSE. Yeah, it produced very pretty polygon graphics, but it also had a  serious limitation by those stone-age era cartridges, lol. It was the decision that BROKE NINTENDO and served the market to Sony almost in a silver platter.

But yeah, it's not all about being powerful, it's also about having the right content and the right marketing. Hardware is not only about power, there's also innovative features or different options that could appeal to many gamers. There's also the price tag, which is not the most important factor but it certainly counts.

There's also the company relationship with the developer and publishing partners. Nintendo was a monopolist bitch back in the day, look where that got them to, and I don't think they changed that much with the Wii...I could be wrong. But yeah, nobody likes a bully publisher trying to squeeze every dime out of your software to get their "seal of quality" just because they command the market.



Albion said:
gumby_trucker said:

HELL YEAH!!

BRAIN AGE... IN HD!! WII FIT...IN HD!!

VITALITY in...you guessed it: AITCH-DEEE

/Face Palm



LOL you know I was joking, right?

(you probably did, but I'm adding this gif anyway cause it's hilarious )



Until you've played it, every game is a system seller!

the original trolls

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MHTri: name=BOo BoO/ID=BZBLEX/region=US

mini-games on consoles, cinematic games on handhelds, what's next? GameBoy IMAX?

Official Member of the Pikmin Fan Club

gumby_trucker said:
Albion said:
gumby_trucker said:

HELL YEAH!!

BRAIN AGE... IN HD!! WII FIT...IN HD!!

VITALITY in...you guessed it: AITCH-DEEE

/Face Palm



LOL you know I was joking, right?

(you probably did, but I'm adding this gif anyway cause it's hilarious )

LOL. Ya i was face palming more at the thought of all thos games being HD.

=)



HD makes no difference to me. Games on Wii look good, adding HD isn't going to make any of the other elements (gameplay, accessability, music, art design, level design etc) better. If anything it takes anyway time and money from those elements which are all far more important than graphics.

I also don't understand the comparision to the SNES-N64 transition. Going from SNES - N64 was huge because it was going from 2D to 3D. Unless Project Cafe can provide games in 4D/5D its not the same transtition as that but rather the same as Xbox to X360 - the same thing it just looks a bit nicer.