• It tastes delicious. Call me a savage, I don't care.

The point is that what reality has nothing to do with what we would describe as 'plausible'. You cannot dismiss something simply because it sounds too fantastic to be true - none of the great minds of our time have done that.

I agree with that. You know, all I don't like is when people are so chauvinistic that they just dismiss everything religious because they ''adhere to science''. Usually these people know jack about science anyway. 

Mostly its very hard to reach a conclusion in an argument on these topics. I agree with what you say and understand why you pointed it out.

:)

I know you agree with me really.

And I understand what you mean about the atheists who reject religion because they "adhere to science", and I think they're pretty much the same ones I said annoy me too in my first post in this thread. (I have to admit though, I think I used to be a bit like that ).

You can, however, dismiss it (but not forget it altogether) when there is an alternative with considerable amounts of scientific evidence that makes a lot more sense (at the macroscopic level, please don't go into quantum theory and how nothing makes sense anyway).

There is about as much evidence for Noah's Ark as for the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Are you willing to consider the latter as a scientific theory?

You can, however, dismiss it (but not forget it altogether) when there is an alternative with considerable amounts of scientific evidence that makes a lot more sense (at the macroscopic level, please don't go into quantum theory and how nothing makes sense anyway).

There is about as much evidence for Noah's Ark as for the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Are you willing to consider the latter as a scientific theory?

I've left in the points about which I feel strongest.

If something is enjoyable, that's one of the strongest arguments in the world for doing it. The exception is, of course, when doing something enjoyable harms someone else to an extent that is greater than your enjoyment. In my view, however, the full diet and nutrition of human beings is more important than the life of farm animals. Again, perhaps this makes me a savage. If one of the prerequisites of civilisation is that you have a deep respect for all life, then I am not civilised, and will not pretend to be. And I certainly hope that all of my fellow omnivores feel the same way, because if they don't, that is a sure sign that they have never even thought about it.

I have no proof for this, but I highly doubt that a lioness is feeling remorse when she kills a deer to feed herself and her children. She recognises that she is biologically superior to that deer, and that it is her right to kill the deer. By what I'm getting from your ideology, then, she isn't civilised. Indeed, no animal is civilised, because the only reason an animal avoids meat is that it cannot manage to find, subdue and consume an organism that will give it nutrition. This applies to dolphins, too. Do they care about the lives of the fish they eat? Again, I highly doubt it. If you say that we as humans are superior to those organisms because of our ability to pity other species, then you are admitting that we are not like other animals, and so animals are not deserving of the same quality of treatment as we are. If pigs managed to form a political party, and one of them dressed up in a suit and gave a speech on porcine-human equality, perhaps then I would consider swearing off pork. I would, however, continue to eat beef, mutton, chicken and so on.

You're getting perilously close here to using that awful cliché line: "Would you want a superior organism to eat you?". Well, of course I bloody well wouldn't. I have no desire to be shot and eaten. But from an objective point of view, they have that right. Why don't we have the right to eat other people, then, you ask? Because we are equal. We are not, however, equal to cows, and nor are we on the same standing as these superhumans who are apparently going to eat us in the future.

As for the conscious thought, as I've mentioned above, they've shown no real signs of it. I have never seen a chicken protest about living conditions or genocide, but perhaps it's one of those government coverups and WikiLeaks will have something on it soon.

@pizzahut451:

But no Christian chinese person died in that riot because he/she was a christian, right? The diffrence is, people tried to froce their beliefs on eachother by violence back than. And today, we are seeing a peacefull rise of Christianity in China with no violence whatsoever.

No violence yet. You can be sure they'rr become opressive if they ever try to get power.

Just a dumb, baseless assumption with no evidence whatsoever. From the behaviour of MOST of atheists on internet, i can say the same thing about them and with much more justification.  And WTH kind of power are you even talking about? Stop living in a fansaty world where you picture christianity or any religion i shoved down your trought. There is no violent religious spreading today, at least not in the christian side.

Not if its rising in the country where atheism is a majority

Atheists are not the majority.And you claim you don't insult atheists, yet you want them to be wiped out.

I dont want them wiped out, its just that you hate christianity so much, and are so incredibly ignorant of it, you see rising of christianity as an extermination of atheists. There is nothing i can do about that. I already explained 3 times what I meant, but you just keep bashing the same word son your keyboard. I'll tell you this for the last time: I would like to see christianity grow in China, I DO NOT wish for other religions to fall apart, I DO NOT wish for your beloved atheists to be whiped out and killed, I DO NOT wish christianity to be forced on anyone

Whatever makes you sleep at night buddy. I can only respond insults with insults, and if i do that a certan mod will ban me. you just keep telling yourself that. I just wonder where zexen is to teach us about religious intolerance now...,

This isn't meant to be an insult, it's just a plain fact. Christianity is intolerant (it claims to be the "one true religion" and all other religions are wrong and evil Atheism is intolerant, it claims all religions are wrong. see what i did there ??? And NO WHERE does jesus nor God say that other religions are evil, again, its just your hate speech, nothing more and opressive (the fact that it tries to control every aspect of people's lives and surpress their free will and fre thoughtIf you dont like christianity, dont follow it. Nobody is forcing you to do anything. Thats why God gave us free mind and free will, so we can choose what we want to believe in. Christianity follows the teachings of Jesus Christ and if you think they are  trying to controll your life, than dont listen to them).

There can only be one true religion, and dont act like other religions dont claim to be the right ones. Your bias against christianity and christianity only is jaw-dropping.

Buddhism doesn't claim that other religions are wrong.Buddhism isnt real religion. Its a spiritual lifestyle Actually, most of the religions from the part fo the world are very tolerant of others. A phenomenon called religious syncretism is really popular in the far East (many people are both Buddhists and Shintoists in Japan, for example). Christians would ruin the balance in that part of the world, and the Christians would eventually try eliminate the other religious faiths. Yes, because in countries like Germany, France, Sweden and Denmark, christians are very intolerant of muslim imigration minority there, despite their behaviour...Yup, thre is some hardcore extermination of muslims here...

See? Your just so ignorant and biased against everything christian, you dont even see what happening and choose to close your eyes and tell yourself all that nonsense to make yourself feel better about your beliefs. I dont insult judisam, islam, buddisam or even atheism to make myself feel better and more secure about my beliefs.

Yes you do. Now I'm not gonna go and search the forums about Islam to search for your hateful posts, Really? Than dont say stuff like that, if you cant support it.but you've given great examples of your hatred for atheists on this very topic. If I said that "I hope more and more people become Atheists in Italy, because that would weaken Christianity in the world", you'd accuse me of being hateful,No, i would acuse you of being hateful when you spread crap like you did in 2 paragraphs above but appearently your kind likes to insult others, but not be insulted themselves.You seem to believe that your insults and accusations are fact, but

Except that this is totally diffrent than that rebelion. People are CHOOSING to follow christian religion, not to force it on others. No one is opression no one, no matter if you want to believe otherwise.

People are manipulated by missionaries who are feedign them lies. And if they ever gain more power they'll push for more people to become converted, and that could possibly lead to violence.

Yes, it would be IF I was talkking about Africa or Philiphinos, but since i was not, its irrelevant. Not to mention those events happedn 300 years ago, and Im talking about TODAY!!

You were talking about (the made-up) fact that Christianity did not spread through violence and opression. And the Philipinos are from the part of Asia we were talking about.I wasnt? You brought that up first, i was talking about peacefull spreading of Christianity in China, than you said its delusional to ignore the violent spreadings of...etc etc. I never even mentioned violence.

Absolutely, because inquisition wasnt about spreading christianity on innocent muslims who never raised sword against christians, it was about keeping church in power of the kingodms and lands of europe.Christianity would have been just fine without inqusition. Church and western kingdoms? I dont think so. As for muslims in Spain, go educate yourself on Spanish Reconquista

I think you don't really know much about the Reconquista. It was essentially Christians from the North of Spain stealing lands that for centuries belonged to muslims. They also forced millions of muslims to convert, and they other killed those who didn't, or banished them to North Africa. It was essentially ethnic clensing. And no, without things like the Inquisition Christianity would've been totaly different today.OH SWEET MOTHER OF GOD, WHAT THE HELL HAVE I JUST READ??????????????? Spain stealing lands that belong to muslims? Are you fucking serious? I cant believe you just wrote that...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umayyad_conquest_of_Hispania

^^Thats just some peacufull muslims taking their rightful lands of christian kingdom of Spain,that totally belonged to them. Than later , evil opressing christians took muslim land of spain which always belonged to muslims...no I just cant go on anymore. Please donttalk to me anymore before you educate yourself on this topic. But still, this is a great example to show just how ignorant of christianity you really are. Seriously, i couldnt have asked for better example.

Just read the first fucking paragraph here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reconquista

The innocent muslims here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moors

As for inquisition, you didnt provide any arguments there...

Woah, long read. Yeah, I never meant to equate Noah's ark and Special Relativity! It is my belief that the Noah's ark story isn't the fact.