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Forums - Sony - NGP is a Dev's dream: Sony details NGP strategies at private UK event

Ultr said:
kitler53 said:
Scoobes said:
Chibi.V.29 said:

Wooow O_O Thats  crazy amount of praise from the developers. If in NGP gets this kind of support everywhere we may just have found ourselves a winner.


Yeah, the only worry is (initially at least) we may see a lot of PS3 ports rather than new games. However, this could also be considerred a plus if they manage the cloud storage thing.


i'll say -- if NGP only did ps3 games but cloud storage was availible -- i'd buy. xD

same here...Im such a fanboy...

 

that Wipeout thing is absolutely amazing...!

also Just give me NGP and Tomba for psOne on PSN, thats it for the start!


Tomba equals day 1 buy even though I'm getting this day 1 no matter what I would pay up to 500 dollars seriously.



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Great to hear that Sony are finally getting developers what they want, so they can more easily create great games!



Scoobes said:
HappySqurriel said:
Chibi.V.29 said:
Scoobes said:
Chibi.V.29 said:

Wooow O_O Thats  crazy amount of praise from the developers. If in NGP gets this kind of support everywhere we may just have found ourselves a winner.


Yeah, the only worry is (initially at least) we may see a lot of PS3 ports rather than new games. However, this could also be considerred a plus if they manage the cloud storage thing.

Yeah im interested to see how it goes ^^ I just hope that sony control just how many games get ported etc. Dont want to end up with 100 shovel ware games a day :/

I actually doubt we will see many PS3 ports initially ...

If games are being sold on flash memory, the cost of a large enough game card to hold most HD console games would translate into much higher game prices.

Not neccessarily. Most PS3 games are already multiplat and manage to fit on the 6.8Gb of a 360 DVD. With extra compression, slightly lower resolution art due to the small screen and remembering that the cost of ROM memory (not read/write flash) is actually quite cheap, especially for Sony who mass produce, then ports are actually relatively cheap and easy.

Games released to the XBox 360 already are taking full advantage of compression, and I doubt significant gains could be made without adding noticeable graphical artefacts in the game; and you can downgrade the graphical assets to save space, but to get significant gains you would start to notice the quality reduction. While we could argue about the specifics, at some point the problems introduced from reducing the data-footprint of a game would undermine the entire point of producing a graphically impressive system.

With that said, memory is getting inexpensive but it isn't that cheap ... I could be wrong but I suspect that, while 4GB and 8GB game cards may be possible from launch, I doubt that the game cards that have enough capacity to do a straight port of a HD console game would be inexpensive enough to sell a game for the standard game prices without hurting the developer's margins on these games. This might not prevent Sony from porting first party games, because the margins of first part games are better (because of licensing fees) and they can justify any reduced revenue as platform building, but third party publishers are probably not as willing to cut into their margins or sell games for higher fees.

 

Obviously, this doesn't mean that these games won't eventually find their way to the NGP; but I see it as being something that will (probably) not be that common until memory prices are reduced further.



Scoobes said:
HappySqurriel said:
Chibi.V.29 said:
Scoobes said:
Chibi.V.29 said:

Wooow O_O Thats  crazy amount of praise from the developers. If in NGP gets this kind of support everywhere we may just have found ourselves a winner.


Yeah, the only worry is (initially at least) we may see a lot of PS3 ports rather than new games. However, this could also be considerred a plus if they manage the cloud storage thing.

Yeah im interested to see how it goes ^^ I just hope that sony control just how many games get ported etc. Dont want to end up with 100 shovel ware games a day :/

I actually doubt we will see many PS3 ports initially ...

If games are being sold on flash memory, the cost of a large enough game card to hold most HD console games would translate into much higher game prices.

Not neccessarily. Most PS3 games are already multiplat and manage to fit on the 6.8Gb of a 360 DVD. With extra compression, slightly lower resolution art due to the small screen and remembering that the cost of ROM memory (not read/write flash) is actually quite cheap, especially for Sony who mass produce, then ports are actually relatively cheap and easy.

You guys realize that almost all ps3 ports are going to be of psn games right?



HappySqurriel said:
Scoobes said:
HappySqurriel said:
Chibi.V.29 said:
Scoobes said:
Chibi.V.29 said:

Wooow O_O Thats  crazy amount of praise from the developers. If in NGP gets this kind of support everywhere we may just have found ourselves a winner.


Yeah, the only worry is (initially at least) we may see a lot of PS3 ports rather than new games. However, this could also be considerred a plus if they manage the cloud storage thing.

Yeah im interested to see how it goes ^^ I just hope that sony control just how many games get ported etc. Dont want to end up with 100 shovel ware games a day :/

I actually doubt we will see many PS3 ports initially ...

If games are being sold on flash memory, the cost of a large enough game card to hold most HD console games would translate into much higher game prices.

Not neccessarily. Most PS3 games are already multiplat and manage to fit on the 6.8Gb of a 360 DVD. With extra compression, slightly lower resolution art due to the small screen and remembering that the cost of ROM memory (not read/write flash) is actually quite cheap, especially for Sony who mass produce, then ports are actually relatively cheap and easy.

Games released to the XBox 360 already are taking full advantage of compression, and I doubt significant gains could be made without adding noticeable graphical artefacts in the game; and you can downgrade the graphical assets to save space, but to get significant gains you would start to notice the quality reduction. While we could argue about the specifics, at some point the problems introduced from reducing the data-footprint of a game would undermine the entire point of producing a graphically impressive system.

With that said, memory is getting inexpensive but it isn't that cheap ... I could be wrong but I suspect that, while 4GB and 8GB game cards may be possible from launch, I doubt that the game cards that have enough capacity to do a straight port of a HD console game would be inexpensive enough to sell a game for the standard game prices without hurting the developer's margins on these games. This might not prevent Sony from porting first party games, because the margins of first part games are better (because of licensing fees) and they can justify any reduced revenue as platform building, but third party publishers are probably not as willing to cut into their margins or sell games for higher fees.

 

Obviously, this doesn't mean that these games won't eventually find their way to the NGP; but I see it as being something that will (probably) not be that common until memory prices are reduced further.

Don't forget that flash based medium doesn't need duplication of data on discs due to almost instant seeking times while big parts of BR discs for ps3 are wasted on this to reduce loading speed.

Also there's a huge diffrence beetween SD card and cartridge:

SD card must survive few hundreds writes to each cell (and in case of smaller nands problems of losing data over time might arrise)  while game cartridge is read only and must keep your data for all eternity.



PROUD MEMBER OF THE PSP RPG FAN CLUB

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definatly good to hear that SONY are finaly learning that it is better to make the system as easy as possible to develop for. only took them 2 generations of overly complex architectures and poor dev kitts to learn the lesson tho. 

The NGP is sounding better and better, now the only issues are it's size and possibly price and original content, but with the current lack of original 3DS content that last one won't be to hard to out do the competition.



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Check out my hype threads: Cyberpunk, and The Witcher 3!

Zlejedi said:
HappySqurriel said:
Scoobes said:
HappySqurriel said:
Chibi.V.29 said:
Scoobes said:
Chibi.V.29 said:

Wooow O_O Thats  crazy amount of praise from the developers. If in NGP gets this kind of support everywhere we may just have found ourselves a winner.


Yeah, the only worry is (initially at least) we may see a lot of PS3 ports rather than new games. However, this could also be considerred a plus if they manage the cloud storage thing.

Yeah im interested to see how it goes ^^ I just hope that sony control just how many games get ported etc. Dont want to end up with 100 shovel ware games a day :/

I actually doubt we will see many PS3 ports initially ...

If games are being sold on flash memory, the cost of a large enough game card to hold most HD console games would translate into much higher game prices.

Not neccessarily. Most PS3 games are already multiplat and manage to fit on the 6.8Gb of a 360 DVD. With extra compression, slightly lower resolution art due to the small screen and remembering that the cost of ROM memory (not read/write flash) is actually quite cheap, especially for Sony who mass produce, then ports are actually relatively cheap and easy.

Games released to the XBox 360 already are taking full advantage of compression, and I doubt significant gains could be made without adding noticeable graphical artefacts in the game; and you can downgrade the graphical assets to save space, but to get significant gains you would start to notice the quality reduction. While we could argue about the specifics, at some point the problems introduced from reducing the data-footprint of a game would undermine the entire point of producing a graphically impressive system.

With that said, memory is getting inexpensive but it isn't that cheap ... I could be wrong but I suspect that, while 4GB and 8GB game cards may be possible from launch, I doubt that the game cards that have enough capacity to do a straight port of a HD console game would be inexpensive enough to sell a game for the standard game prices without hurting the developer's margins on these games. This might not prevent Sony from porting first party games, because the margins of first part games are better (because of licensing fees) and they can justify any reduced revenue as platform building, but third party publishers are probably not as willing to cut into their margins or sell games for higher fees.

 

Obviously, this doesn't mean that these games won't eventually find their way to the NGP; but I see it as being something that will (probably) not be that common until memory prices are reduced further.

Don't forget that flash based medium doesn't need duplication of data on discs due to almost instant seeking times while big parts of BR discs for ps3 are wasted on this to reduce loading speed.

Also there's a huge diffrence beetween SD card and cartridge:

SD card must survive few hundreds writes to each cell (and in case of smaller nands problems of losing data over time might arrise)  while game cartridge is read only and must keep your data for all eternity.

Thank you. That's what I was trying to get across.



zarx said:

definatly good to hear that SONY are finaly learning that it is better to make the system as easy as possible to develop for. only took them 2 generations of overly complex architectures and poor dev kitts to learn the lesson tho. 

The NGP is sounding better and better, now the only issues are it's size and possibly price and original content, but with the current lack of original 3DS content that last one won't be to hard to out do the competition.

To be fair to Sony, with the success of PS2 they probably thought they could get away with it. At least it looks like they've learnt from past mistakes (in this respect at least).



Scoobes said:
Chibi.V.29 said:

Wooow O_O Thats  crazy amount of praise from the developers. If in NGP gets this kind of support everywhere we may just have found ourselves a winner.


Yeah, the only worry is (initially at least) we may see a lot of PS3 ports rather than new games. However, this could also be considerred a plus if they manage the cloud storage thing.

Wait would I have to buy the same PS3 game on NGP if I wanted to utilize cloud storage or will buying a PS3 copy of the game give me an NGP copy too? (a game stick/cartridge bundled with the PS3 version's disc)

If its the former LOLOLOL I aint buying games twice and I guarantee you most people won't.

I guess I'll buy one when we see new games on it.

I have one more question person with cat avatar

As the development looks VERY easy how does this affect budget? IS budget affected by ease of development tools or does graphics and other things take up the budget? Could NGP actually be able to have good production value games but those games not needing a high budget?



All hail the KING, Andrespetmonkey

this is the first Playstation i have looked at and just thought 'i dont know'

The PSP did VERY well... but at the same time games wise.. it didnt near the end :/ 

the PS3 has sooo many amazing games and i just dont think sony can focus on both.

Plus NGP would have to be £200 at launch for me to pick it up lol

but as there focusing on 'hardcore' im guessing it will be £350 lol