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Forums - General - Taliban stoning to death of man and woman for adultery

I'm fine with the death penalty, but this is horrible. I don't think that it's a crime punishable by death, but I'm willing to accept that this culture believes that it is - fine - but couldn't they have just shot them? Stoning is totally wrong in this age.



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radishhead said:

I'm fine with the death penalty, but this is horrible. I don't think that it's a crime punishable by death, but I'm willing to accept that this culture believes that it is - fine - but couldn't they have just shot them? Stoning is totally wrong in this age.

Erm...did you even read the article?



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huaxiong90 said:
radishhead said:

I'm fine with the death penalty, but this is horrible. I don't think that it's a crime punishable by death, but I'm willing to accept that this culture believes that it is - fine - but couldn't they have just shot them? Stoning is totally wrong in this age.

Erm...did you even read the article?

They stoned her first



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radishhead said:
huaxiong90 said:
radishhead said:

I'm fine with the death penalty, but this is horrible. I don't think that it's a crime punishable by death, but I'm willing to accept that this culture believes that it is - fine - but couldn't they have just shot them? Stoning is totally wrong in this age.

Erm...did you even read the article?

They stoned her first

Yes, but they weren't killed for committing a crime. This was an illegal execution carried out by a terrorist group, who are now wanted criminals.Nothing to do with the justice system.

You spoke of the death penalty and crime, which is what I think huaxiong was picking up on.



Im definitely not going to watch that vid, but from the description it sounds horribly wrong I can't believe such cultures exist. O_O



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Sovereignty is the bane of international relations, born of a treaty created before the USA itself. Europe and Japan prospered after WW2 because the USA shoved their sovereignty up their respective arses -  rebuilt the countries, influenced economic policies, and pretty much took control of their foreign and defence policies. That was over 50 years ago.

But, alas, the tyrants which rule over most of the Middle East and Africa are entitled to do as they see fit, and pass legislation that serves only their personal benefit. But, hey, they're different cultures, and have their own sovereignty, right? It's only fair.

 

EDIT: This is in response to Chairman-Mao's love-in with sovereignty, not the nature of the article itself.



sapphi_snake said:
Chairman-Mao said:
sapphi_snake said:
Chairman-Mao said:

How am I inconsistent and how are the holocaust and stoning to death of adulterers (nothing new or radical) anything similar?

I'm for a nations sovereignty to make their own laws but of course when it reaches the stages of genocide or something crazy then we have to step in.

You're inconsistent, because you simoltaneously agree and disagree with cultural relativity. And how exsactly is stoning peopel to death for adultery NOT RADICAL??? It's extremely radical.

Things like the Holocaust happen when prejudices are fed and encouraged within a society. But the ideea is that the Holocaust was expectable considering the attitude towards jews throughout the centuries. It was a cultural thing. Does that make it right? And why is genocide wrong in your opinion, and can't be subjected to cultural relativity, yet persecuting people individually isn't, and can be viewed as being culturally relative?


It really sounds like you're just trying to be difficult here. You took a simple statement I made about national sovereignty and turn it into an argument over genocide and persecution. 

And you call me inconsistent because I don't care about a person who broke the law in another country being stoned but I "draw the line" at genocide? So you'd be happier if I was for genocide because then I wouldn't be inconsistend?

You are inconsistent. Why do you care that a sovereign nation decides that X group of people needs to be eliminated? By your logic it's their right to do so, and not any other nation's business. That's if you go by any logic of course.


Yeah its still their right to try and eliminate whoever they want, but when it reaches the point of actions the powerful nations (USA, China, EU, etc.) need to step in and stop it. 

I still don't agree that I'm being inconsistent though. This woman broke the law and was punished, brutally, but punished nonetheless. She knew what she was doing and she knew it was against the law in her country. While she may be the victim of cruel and unusual punishment she isn't innocent in the matter. The Jews in the holocaust, on the other hand, were victims. Their only crime was being Jewish in a Nazi run country. Nothing they could do about it except try to escape. This woman had the choice not to fuck some married guy but she chose to do it anyways knowing the possible consequences. 



Ok, I don't post in off topic much but here it goes.

What I dislike about coverage of these types of events is that they are completely out of line with the beliefs of virtually all Muslims. The Incidents of stoning that do take place are isolated and condemned by prominent individuals within the Muslim world, but that doesn't seem to garner as much coverage.

I mean... discuss stoning and what it means once you have some basic understanding of Islamic history, beliefs, and practices. Sitting on your computer at home and being outraged or sickened without being able to put these events into a historical and cultural context serves no purpose. 

What I can say is that a layperson who reads the news is overwhelmed with negative stories about Muslim and Islam in general. Most Americans don't know a Muslims personally, are increasingly distrustful of Muslims, yet the only time I see Islam and Muslims mentioned on here is with some negative connotation which only serves to reinforce this negative image. When news like this slips through the cracks while individual cases of extremism dominate news coverage, there's a problem.



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Lets not forget that she was killed by the Taliban and not the government of Afganistan. Thus she wasn't actually killed by government of a soveriegn country. So applying the "she broke the law" argument is on weak ground.

@ameratsu

That may be so, but when the west and its allies are in a conflict with a group like this, it is good to show theocratic intolerance for what it is, most Afganistanis from what I read are still in favor of the intervention. So showing the people who are citizens of governments in conflict with the Taliban barbarism like this helps reinforce why we can't let these people regain control of Afganistan.

We're talking about a group that banned music, bombs girls schools and stones people for adultery. That should be shown. And it should be resisted.



Chairman-Mao said:
sapphi_snake said:
Chairman-Mao said:
sapphi_snake said:
Chairman-Mao said:

How am I inconsistent and how are the holocaust and stoning to death of adulterers (nothing new or radical) anything similar?

I'm for a nations sovereignty to make their own laws but of course when it reaches the stages of genocide or something crazy then we have to step in.

You're inconsistent, because you simoltaneously agree and disagree with cultural relativity. And how exsactly is stoning peopel to death for adultery NOT RADICAL??? It's extremely radical.

Things like the Holocaust happen when prejudices are fed and encouraged within a society. But the ideea is that the Holocaust was expectable considering the attitude towards jews throughout the centuries. It was a cultural thing. Does that make it right? And why is genocide wrong in your opinion, and can't be subjected to cultural relativity, yet persecuting people individually isn't, and can be viewed as being culturally relative?


It really sounds like you're just trying to be difficult here. You took a simple statement I made about national sovereignty and turn it into an argument over genocide and persecution. 

And you call me inconsistent because I don't care about a person who broke the law in another country being stoned but I "draw the line" at genocide? So you'd be happier if I was for genocide because then I wouldn't be inconsistend?

You are inconsistent. Why do you care that a sovereign nation decides that X group of people needs to be eliminated? By your logic it's their right to do so, and not any other nation's business. That's if you go by any logic of course.


Yeah its still their right to try and eliminate whoever they want, but when it reaches the point of actions the powerful nations (USA, China, EU, etc.) need to step in and stop it. 

I still don't agree that I'm being inconsistent though. This woman broke the law and was punished, brutally, but punished nonetheless. She knew what she was doing and she knew it was against the law in her country. While she may be the victim of cruel and unusual punishment she isn't innocent in the matter. The Jews in the holocaust, on the other hand, were victims. Their only crime was being Jewish in a Nazi run country. Nothing they could do about it except try to escape. This woman had the choice not to fuck some married guy but she chose to do it anyways knowing the possible consequence


But the Jews broke the laws too. It was their fault that they were jewish. After all, no one forced them to be Jewish, and they could've converted too another religion a long time ago. See how your argument falls flat?

People should oppose unjust laws. It's the right thing to do. This is an unjust law. And from what I understand this isn't actualyl an official law, but a religious law that was not enforced by the Government, but by a radical terrorist group. I suppose you don't think that's right, do you?



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