By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - General Discussion - Who are you for? EA, Jason West and Vince Zampella or activision?

 

Who are you for? EA, Jason West and Vince Zampella or activision?

EA, Jason West and Vince Zampella. 82 60.29%
 
Activision. 27 19.85%
 
Really don't care. 27 19.85%
 
Total:136
Kasz216 said:
Alby_da_Wolf said:

Kasz216 said:

[...]

So your taking the word of the group of people you KNOW did something wrong, because you dislike the other group of people.  Thank you for proving my point.

 

Afterall your taking the side of "They did something wrong, but it's ok because they said activision did something wrong too, with no proof, and apparently with memos and notices stating the exact opposite in evidence."

Which by the way isn't an actual defense.   Even if they are telling the truth about the payments, they are still guilty of breach of contract.  If someone else breaches your contract you don't breach it as well and claim "they did first" and thing everything is going to be ok.  You start legal procedings.

Unless you are buying the story that "They fired them so they could keep a few million dollars while risking sales in the billions of dollars..."

Two wrongs don't make a right, I perfectly know. No wrong from any part has been proven in tribunal yet, anyway, but you accuse me of buying W and Z's story while you buy Activision's one. And you also look desperate to downplay Activision's possible wrong just in case two wrongs are proven. BTW, in many countries, after the strongest part commits a serious breach of contract, the weakest one is often considered relieved from many or even every contract obligations.

1. Only if proven before they breach said contracts themselves.  Hence you know, why you'd lawyer up.

I'm not "buying" anything.  I'm looking at the facts objectivly.  I mean hell, I can't even name the last activision game I've bought.  I recieved Red Steel as a gift... that's all I can thnk of.

One the one hand, you've got West and Zampella,  who are pretty much known for this kind of thing, who definitly did something illegal that everyone can agree with.

On the otherhand you have activision... who may or may not have done something wrong... and who specifically mention correspondense to them about said event.  Which either they have or it's more or less an auto-lose so there is no point to bring it up unless it exists unless they exist.

I mean, have you even bothered to look at the evidence that HAS released so far? 

There are text messages of Zampella while working at activison talking about how he did something specifically to hurt activision and "COD: WaW". 

You are taking the side who is pretty much already proven guilty of something, (or at least there is heavy proof they are guilty) against the side of someone in which there is no proof against them.

Also the evidences in favour of Activision must be checked in tribunal, though, and about W and Z messages, opinions and wishes, even harsh, will have to be told from actual actions.

About 1, yes, breaking the contract in their turn as an answer to a supposed previous breach by the other part to their disadvantage and BEFORE taking any actual legal action is risky, because then they MUST prove the other part broke the contract first, otherwise they'll be considered the only ones guilty of breach. But if the previous breach by Activision were proven, their successive breach could be fined too or not, but most probably less than Activision's one, or in an extreme case, fined in the same measure, and what it would remain would be that fines would compensate each other and Activision then would still have to pay what was due. BTW, if you look at the chronology of facts, both parts started legal actions later than their respective supposed breaches, they are both at fault at least up to a certain degree from this point of view.

Finally, about W and Z attitudes, if Activision will be found in the right, they'd be quite weasely, besides guily of the breach, otherwise, if their claims against it are proven instead, it would be a reaction to an unfulfillen promise by Activision to leave them more control on their series. But also about this everything still has to be established in tribunal, Activision's claims are still only claims just like W and Z ones are. Both parts claim to have evidences, but it hasn't been extablished yet by a tribunal what these evidences actually prove.



Stwike him, Centuwion. Stwike him vewy wuffly! (Pontius Pilate, "Life of Brian")
A fart without stink is like a sky without stars.
TGS, Third Grade Shooter: brand new genre invented by Kevin Butler exclusively for Natal WiiToo Kinect. PEW! PEW-PEW-PEW! 
 


Around the Network
Alby_da_Wolf said:
Kasz216 said:
Alby_da_Wolf said:

Kasz216 said:

[...]

So your taking the word of the group of people you KNOW did something wrong, because you dislike the other group of people.  Thank you for proving my point.

 

Afterall your taking the side of "They did something wrong, but it's ok because they said activision did something wrong too, with no proof, and apparently with memos and notices stating the exact opposite in evidence."

Which by the way isn't an actual defense.   Even if they are telling the truth about the payments, they are still guilty of breach of contract.  If someone else breaches your contract you don't breach it as well and claim "they did first" and thing everything is going to be ok.  You start legal procedings.

Unless you are buying the story that "They fired them so they could keep a few million dollars while risking sales in the billions of dollars..."

Two wrongs don't make a right, I perfectly know. No wrong from any part has been proven in tribunal yet, anyway, but you accuse me of buying W and Z's story while you buy Activision's one. And you also look desperate to downplay Activision's possible wrong just in case two wrongs are proven. BTW, in many countries, after the strongest part commits a serious breach of contract, the weakest one is often considered relieved from many or even every contract obligations.

1. Only if proven before they breach said contracts themselves.  Hence you know, why you'd lawyer up.

I'm not "buying" anything.  I'm looking at the facts objectivly.  I mean hell, I can't even name the last activision game I've bought.  I recieved Red Steel as a gift... that's all I can thnk of.

One the one hand, you've got West and Zampella,  who are pretty much known for this kind of thing, who definitly did something illegal that everyone can agree with.

On the otherhand you have activision... who may or may not have done something wrong... and who specifically mention correspondense to them about said event.  Which either they have or it's more or less an auto-lose so there is no point to bring it up unless it exists unless they exist.

I mean, have you even bothered to look at the evidence that HAS released so far? 

There are text messages of Zampella while working at activison talking about how he did something specifically to hurt activision and "COD: WaW". 

You are taking the side who is pretty much already proven guilty of something, (or at least there is heavy proof they are guilty) against the side of someone in which there is no proof against them.

Also the evidences in favour of Activision must be checked in tribunal, though, and about W and Z messages, opinions and wishes, even harsh, will have to be told from actual actions.

About 1, yes, breaking the contract in their turn as an answer to a supposed previous breach by the other part to their disadvantage and BEFORE taking any actual legal action is risky, because then they MUST prove the other part broke the contract first, otherwise they'll be considered the only ones guilty of breach. But if the previous breach by Activision were proven, their successive breach could be fined too or not, but most probably less than Activision's one, or in an extreme case, fined in the same measure, and what it would remain would be that fines would compensate each other and Activision then would still have to pay what was due. BTW, if you look at the chronology of facts, both parts started legal actions later than their respective supposed breaches, they are both at fault at least up to a certain degree from this point of view.

Finally, about W and Z attitudes, if Activision will be found in the right, they'd be quite weasely, besides guily of the breach, otherwise, if their claims against it are proven instead, it would be a reaction to an unfulfillen promise by Activision to leave them more control on their series. But also about this everything still has to be established in tribunal, Activision's claims are still only claims just like W and Z ones are. Both parts claim to have evidences, but it hasn't been extablished yet by a tribunal what these evidences actually prove.

They specifically talk about how they released a video specifically do ruin treyarchs buisness.

As in, the specifically took the action to do it.

Then they lied and said they had no idea that the Treyarch map pack was coming out the same day.  (Despite you know, saying when they released it via text message that it was done to inentionally screw Treyarch.)

There is no doubt of West and Zampella's guilt.  The only tricky part is proving that they were damaged iby it.

With Black Ops selling so well and Infanty Ward in general shown as overrated in terms of the franchises success.... it's a hard thing to prove.  Plus Activisions stock only went up.  In general Infinity Ward's value seems to have been greatly inflated by all 3 parties.

Once again though, I point out, and you've yet to have any defense for the fact that you are supporting the side who has produced zero evidence vs a side that that has produced evidence.

This is an illogical stance to take at present.

Espiecally considering Infinity Ward was created by West and Zampella raiding 2015 INC... in the exact same manner as they are accused of doing with Respawn.

 

It's like saying "I know they have some proof that they said he was going to rob their house... and I know that he's robbed houses before.... but I think they're lieing!"

Whether the person is lieing or not is irrelevent to the point that your stance is irrational.  If your arguement was "I'm not taking anyside" that would be rational.  "I'm taking the side of the group that has shown no proof vs the side of the group that has."

Not so much.



Alby_da_Wolf said:

Activision not paying the whole team in due time their share on the game profits was actually the first to violate the contract. A CEO that doesn't pay his best teams in due time is a bad CEO and a danger for his company.

I want to make sure those of us seriously commenting have our information straight. In this case, you have to look at Activision's legal brief and read it in full.

On page 12 of Activision's countersuit, "..., it was clearly underway no later than July 30, 2009. On that date, EA Chief Operating Officer, John Schappert, covertly contacted West, urging West and Zampella to meet with him and John Riccitillo, EA's Chief Executive Officer..."

Source: http://kotaku.com/5715884/activision-vs-ea-complaint/gallery/

If, and IF Activision has the text messages and/or email to back this up, then West and Zampella's whole lawsuit and original claim about the bonuses is false and malicious because they violated their Employment Agreements and Memorandum of Understandings before the release of Modern Warfare 2. Activision would not be held liable for any bonuses rendered to West and/or Zampella as they breached their contracts prior to release of Modern Warfare 2.



Kasz216 said:

Only if proven before they breach said contracts themselves.  Hence you know, why you'd lawyer up.

I'm not "buying" anything.  I'm looking at the facts objectivly.  I mean hell, I can't even name the last activision game I've bought.  I recieved Red Steel as a gift... that's all I can thnk of.

One the one hand, you've got West and Zampella,  who are pretty much known for this kind of thing, who definitly did something illegal that everyone can agree with.

On the otherhand you have activision... who may or may not have done something wrong... and who specifically mention correspondense to them about said event.  Which either they have or it's more or less an auto-lose so there is no point to bring it up unless it exists unless they exist.

I mean, have you even bothered to look at the evidence that HAS released so far? 

There are text messages of Zampella while working at activison talking about how he did something specifically to hurt activision and "COD: WaW". 

You are taking the side who is pretty much already proven guilty of something, (or at least there is heavy proof they are guilty) against the side of someone in which there is no proof against them.

Red Steel was developed and published by Ubisoft. I just thought I'd make that correction.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

mhsillen said:
Salem said:

I vote for EA, West and Zampella, activision deserves to go down


Why does activision need to go down?

Oh I know they make better games than EA...yea thats it


Not true, Dragon Age, Mass effect, FIFA 10...all from EA. Activision has nothing but Cal of Duty



Around the Network
Killiana1a said:
Alby_da_Wolf said:

Activision not paying the whole team in due time their share on the game profits was actually the first to violate the contract. A CEO that doesn't pay his best teams in due time is a bad CEO and a danger for his company.

I want to make sure those of us seriously commenting have our information straight. In this case, you have to look at Activision's legal brief and read it in full.

On page 12 of Activision's countersuit, "..., it was clearly underway no later than July 30, 2009. On that date, EA Chief Operating Officer, John Schappert, covertly contacted West, urging West and Zampella to meet with him and John Riccitillo, EA's Chief Executive Officer..."

Source: http://kotaku.com/5715884/activision-vs-ea-complaint/gallery/

If, and IF Activision has the text messages and/or email to back this up, then West and Zampella's whole lawsuit and original claim about the bonuses is false and malicious because they violated their Employment Agreements and Memorandum of Understandings before the release of Modern Warfare 2. Activision would not be held liable for any bonuses rendered to West and/or Zampella as they breached their contracts prior to release of Modern Warfare 2.

Thanks for the infos. If what Activision claims is true, it's obvious that it's right, but West and Zampella claim quite different things. Also, EA trying to meet W and Z, and not the opposite, doesn't imply a guilt of the latter by itself, unless they accepted EA's offers and actually damaged Activision or at least broke contract obligations. Moreover, even proving a meeting was not only requested, but actually happened, doesn't automatically demontrate that at that supposed meeting they conspired to act against Activision while still under contract with it. The trials will decide who's right about what and up to what degree. There is also a thing to be established: if they just talked with EA about a possible contract AFTER their contract with Activision expired, could this be considered a guilt or a breach of contract?



Stwike him, Centuwion. Stwike him vewy wuffly! (Pontius Pilate, "Life of Brian")
A fart without stink is like a sky without stars.
TGS, Third Grade Shooter: brand new genre invented by Kevin Butler exclusively for Natal WiiToo Kinect. PEW! PEW-PEW-PEW! 
 


Alby_da_Wolf said:
Killiana1a said:
Alby_da_Wolf said:

Activision not paying the whole team in due time their share on the game profits was actually the first to violate the contract. A CEO that doesn't pay his best teams in due time is a bad CEO and a danger for his company.

I want to make sure those of us seriously commenting have our information straight. In this case, you have to look at Activision's legal brief and read it in full.

On page 12 of Activision's countersuit, "..., it was clearly underway no later than July 30, 2009. On that date, EA Chief Operating Officer, John Schappert, covertly contacted West, urging West and Zampella to meet with him and John Riccitillo, EA's Chief Executive Officer..."

Source: http://kotaku.com/5715884/activision-vs-ea-complaint/gallery/

If, and IF Activision has the text messages and/or email to back this up, then West and Zampella's whole lawsuit and original claim about the bonuses is false and malicious because they violated their Employment Agreements and Memorandum of Understandings before the release of Modern Warfare 2. Activision would not be held liable for any bonuses rendered to West and/or Zampella as they breached their contracts prior to release of Modern Warfare 2.

Thanks for the infos. If what Activision claims is true, it's obvious that it's right, but West and Zampella claim quite different things. Also, EA trying to meet W and Z, and not the opposite, doesn't imply a guilt of the latter by itself, unless they accepted EA's offers and actually damaged Activision or at least broke contract obligations. Moreover, even proving a meeting was not only requested, but actually happened, doesn't automatically demontrate that at that supposed meeting they conspired to act against Activision while still under contract with it. The trials will decide who's right about what and up to what degree. There is also a thing to be established: if they just talked with EA about a possible contract AFTER their contract with Activision expired, could this be considered a guilt or a breach of contract?


They have proof of them intentionally damaging WaW on purpose... before MW2 came out.  They've already released this to the public.



sapphi_snake said:
Kasz216 said:

Only if proven before they breach said contracts themselves.  Hence you know, why you'd lawyer up.

I'm not "buying" anything.  I'm looking at the facts objectivly.  I mean hell, I can't even name the last activision game I've bought.  I recieved Red Steel as a gift... that's all I can thnk of.

One the one hand, you've got West and Zampella,  who are pretty much known for this kind of thing, who definitly did something illegal that everyone can agree with.

On the otherhand you have activision... who may or may not have done something wrong... and who specifically mention correspondense to them about said event.  Which either they have or it's more or less an auto-lose so there is no point to bring it up unless it exists unless they exist.

I mean, have you even bothered to look at the evidence that HAS released so far? 

There are text messages of Zampella while working at activison talking about how he did something specifically to hurt activision and "COD: WaW". 

You are taking the side who is pretty much already proven guilty of something, (or at least there is heavy proof they are guilty) against the side of someone in which there is no proof against them.

Red Steel was developed and published by Ubisoft. I just thought I'd make that correction.

Ah right, shit what does Activision even make?

To be honest I don't buy "big studio" games too often.

Lets look at a list

Ah Prototype, I boguht Prototype.... after that my last activision game bought was....

Gladius for the gamecube i think.  Actually... I think I got that for X-mas.

So Lost Kingdoms for the Gamecube.



Kasz216 said:
Alby_da_Wolf said:

[...]

Thanks for the infos. If what Activision claims is true, it's obvious that it's right, but West and Zampella claim quite different things. Also, EA trying to meet W and Z, and not the opposite, doesn't imply a guilt of the latter by itself, unless they accepted EA's offers and actually damaged Activision or at least broke contract obligations. Moreover, even proving a meeting was not only requested, but actually happened, doesn't automatically demontrate that at that supposed meeting they conspired to act against Activision while still under contract with it. The trials will decide who's right about what and up to what degree. There is also a thing to be established: if they just talked with EA about a possible contract AFTER their contract with Activision expired, could this be considered a guilt or a breach of contract?


They have proof of them intentionally damaging WaW on purpose... before MW2 came out.  They've already released this to the public.

Thanks to you too, now I understood without any doubt which amongst Activision claims was the strong evidence you were talking about. And this could indeed be really serious matter against W and Z, their only defence could be proving that exaggerated competition amongst dev teams was encouraged by Activision from the start, or that the very fast releases of the series alternated between IW and Treyarch left them no other choice than harsh internal competition, but yes, this second possible defence is quite pulled by the hair, unless Activision actively (sorry for the pun) pushed this competition to harsh levels, it wouldn't be a strong defence. A third possible defence would be that in this internal competition it wasn't either Activision or IW, but Treyarch to start the feud. IIRC before WaW release, IW complained to Noah Heller for talking shit about MW in interviews about the soon to be released WaW and asked websites and mags to interview actual Treyarch developers instead of that guy that constantly tried making their game shine by throwing shit at MW instead of using their own game's merits to promote it http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=201353&site=cvg . Noah Heller's statements can be proven too, they were made in interviews publicly available, so, if Activision let him do, it would be a proof that it at least tolerated, if not encouraged, a war between the teams with blows below the belt. Before googling, I didn't remember this episode anymore, now I remember that back then most people sided with IW in that feud. After, Treyarch more than proved its worth and that that shit wasn't really necessary, but by then a douche Treyarch exec not able to do PR in a fair way already started bad blood between the teams and between IW and Activision.



Stwike him, Centuwion. Stwike him vewy wuffly! (Pontius Pilate, "Life of Brian")
A fart without stink is like a sky without stars.
TGS, Third Grade Shooter: brand new genre invented by Kevin Butler exclusively for Natal WiiToo Kinect. PEW! PEW-PEW-PEW! 
 


New News.

http://kotaku.com/5725056/activision-accused-of-stalling-in-modern-warfare-legal-showdown

http://www.develop-online.net/news/36814/Internal-EA-email-Zampella-held-off-DLC-for-us

 

"They knew EA's involvement 6 months ago" isn't that them in trying to play the victim just admitting their guilt?