Sorry I'm in a few GT5 debates, more then 1 in this thread alone, sometimes I forget who I'm talking to.

I'm debating what you said here:

"did you even think before posting that joke.

6-8m will be Europe alone."

6-8 million in Europe alone, thats what I'm debating.

I gave a prediction bracket for EMEAA of 3-6 million total and then you said what you bolded. (3Million in Europe by the end of the year). I guess I stuck on the 1st topic as I felt it was more important and you went to the second, and we kind of lost connection? We both misunderstood each other because we were both debating different things.

3 million in EMEAA by the years end is possible, but I doubt it. I can see EMEAA week 1 totals being close to 1 million, and then the game selling 300-600k weekly for every week until christmas. So because of the delay, I really doubt anything above 3 million for all of EMEAA this year. Europe will get at best 2 million.

BTW I own GT1-4, and GT PSP. I'm a huge GT fan as well. LOL wow, I don't think you know anything about me. I'm a huge car nut, I own just about every good racing game. I watch Best Motoring in Japanese just because they race real cars against each other with real race drivers. You probably don't even know what Best Motoring is. I watch Top Gear, Fifth Gear, Top Gear Australia, and soon Top Gear US faithfully. When I read the paper the first thing I read is the wheels sections. I know so much about cars, you can mention almost any european or japanese car to me and I'll tell you the specs. I can approach this subject from a car and game perspective.

I never said anything about any racing game interfereing with GT5 sales. I only used Forza as an example of how the holiday window doesn't really affect sales, and I later included God of War and MGS as examples to future my validation.

As for the relevance of NFS to GT, Where is this comming from? You say things like "wth is wrong with you" but you also bring points out from nowhere.

However now that you bring it up, wasn't the best selling NFS game, NFS Underground for PS2 selling 6.49 million (3.42 million in EMEAA)? When was the best selling GT released? GT3 and GT4 were released in 2001 and early 2005 right, basically within 2 years of this game.

There are good years and bad years for racing games, so when GT did really well NFS did really well. If racing games aren't doing very well now days, then why will GT5?

There are many reasons to why GT5 won't sell as well as other GT games. What I am debating, and have always been debating is you assuming GT5 will sell 6-8 million units in Europe alone. Thats never been done before, for any GT game, and an extremly unrealistic assumption. 3-6 million LTD for the entire EMEAA region is more realistic.

I don't feel like writing a rebuttal to your foolishness.

release will come soon enough, will prove whos right. 

By the way Bestmotoring while having great production, is quite far from "real" or id say legit.  They are known to put better more aggressive drivers in their prefered cars while being quite pro bias towards japanese cars and even accued of sandbaggind.

Do you know Option ? D1 ? FD ? Super GT ? Rod Millen ? Aussi V8s High octane Texas Mil.... 

Do you have any idea the power potentail of a 2jzgte, the horsepower the stock rods and pistones can handle, or the RB26detts capability comapred to it ?

Yea I noticed the GT-R always got the better racers, and they never raced it against a proper Ferrarri. (Best Motoring)

That last bit your naming random things. D1-Gran Prix, FD - Something they call Mazda RX-7's in Japan, Super GT - Touring Car Championship in Japan, Rod Millen - a Race Car Driver. Option I know is a magazine, but I don' get it here in Canada, and the last one I dunno. Whats with all the Japanese stuff, this hardly reflects car knowledge at all.

I can do the same thing back though Type 123, E46 - differences in Europe and NA?, Altezza, etc.

As for the last bit, I dunno specific engines and hp's, and no I don't know the hp stock rods and pistons can handle. Nor do I care.

Anyway 6million for Europe is foolish, and your the one calling other a fool. Your view over GT5 is optimistic, and I want you to know that. Thats all.

Its not optemistic, its called an intelligent estimate.

GT3 - 5.85
GT4 - 6.61

How the hell can any one see those numbers and think 6m for GT5 in Europe is foolish.  It should be expected especially if France alone is getting 555k GT5 disks for release. 

What i want you to know is your posts lack knowledge and understanding, you lack the ability to look at the big picture.   You fail to use releven facts, you post nonsense that has little to do with whats being debated just to prove some irrelevent thought you have on some point you came up with .  Overall you lack intellgince on the matter and about GT and its sales.

e46 differences, care to be more specific.  Diesel wagon Euro M3 having more power all the differant treim levels no CLS for NA ? what ?  LoL i own a IS300, if you want to get into discussing the differnces i will destroy you.

Of course you dont know engines, just like you dont know GT.

You know what an intelligent estimate is? A Hypothesis to test a theory.

I know GT3 and GT4 sold roughly 6 million in EMEAA (Not just europe), but you yourself presented an install base arguement. There are much less PS3's out there then PS2' and PS1's in the past, and a large portion of PS1/PS1 fans have had their current gen console purchase split (i.e. some own 360's only, some own PS3's only). I mean this is one possible reason why Forza Sales have jumped, the PS2 owners who went 360 got Forza instead.

To beleive there isn't a single con to the GT franchise selling well is foolish, and to assume it will be the best selling GT game is a strongly optimistic opinion. That said I'm not telling you that your wrong, I'm just saying your opinion is an unlikely course of action, not an impossibility.

I do not lack knowledge and understanding of the franchise, I've been playing it for ages. I've also been predicting games sales for nearly 3 years now and have gotten substantially better. I merely disagree with you, and I can back it up. You can't accept that so you resort to insulting me.

My facts are nonsence to you because your soo in love with this franchise (as shown by your profile pic, and tag in your profile), that you cannot accept any forms of critisizm. It's like how fat people think they are "just big boned" or "its genetic." You convince yourself what you want to beleive in, and completly ignore any point that contradicts your beleifs. Even when your logic contradicts itself, and a con is defintaly present, your simply ignore it (How can a small userbase be responsible for the lower GT5P sales, but a small userbase won't be responsible for lower GT5 sales?).

I don't know the mechanical limitations of an engine, but unlike most people I still know what parts build up an engine and basically what every part does. I also understand engines from a thermodynamic standpoint (efficiency, entropy, etc), and I bet you have no clue what that type of stuff means. I also know why specific cars are so fast (like why one chasis is better then the other, why one short throw transmissions are better, what type of gearing ratio makes cars faster at this, and the other at that, why mid engine cars handle better). You know, the important stuff you need to know in order to know which car will likely be faster on a track?

I also plan to get into touring car racing, so how can I not be a massive car nut?

Still didn't tell me what a Type 123 is.

Anyway, your not proving anything to anyone. Go ahead and think what you want about the game, but by trying to force your opinions onto others won't change a thing. All you can do to support this game is buy it, and thats it.

Unfortunelty buddy you dont back up anything at all, you just post paragraphs of worhtless ideas.  You spin things your way and are unable to look at things logically.  You just view them in your closed minded way. 

You can't wrap your mind around what a 1.6 million user base means compared to 14million one.  At a certain point user base loses importance, you seen to lack that simple understanding.  1.6 million user base matters after a certin amount it loses importance.  Is that so hard for you to comprehand ? why is that so tough ?

I would love for some intelligent critcritisizm on why GT5 will fail to sale, unfortunetly nothing you have posted fits that criteria. 

I can see thorugh your bs, Im not the one that writes esseys each post to push his opinion on others.  The problem i have with you is you are pushing ingnorance while thinking its gold.

I have yet to see one intelligent logical facts backed post from you on why GT5 sales will suffer.

Ha my thoughts about you exactly.

• Hard to beleive PS3 won't surpass 360 in total sales
• Hard to beleive Multiplatform games look better on 360 then PS3
• Hard to beleive 360 software is higher weekly and total compared to PS3.

Hard to beleive you can be wrong, when your scream a strong bias to PS3.

All I said was that it's unrealistic to assume GT5 will outsell GT1-4 in Europe, and look at how you react. All you can come back is with insults, I think you lost the ability to debate a long while back.

Itll be the worst selling GT game by a considerable amount.

Actully there is no debatnig with you, you cant stay on topic or even interpret the most basic numbers to prove a point.  In my opinion you lack intelligence to do so.

Either way the game will release and all will be solved.

you get that from ? what magicl evil unicorns saying so ?