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Forums - Nintendo - Abbie Heppe (G4TV): Metroid: Other M is Sexist

d21lewis said:

I didn't read the review.  In this case, I'll check it out.  But since X-Play is a TV show that's viewed by a lot of people, I assume there are probably more people that watched the show than read their review.  And maybe everything they said is justified.  Maybe the game does suck.  KylieDog seems to think so.  It's just such a contrast to the other reviews I've read. 

They're making such a big deal about "She thinks really hard......"Is it more plausible that I can shoot an alien and a missle will fall out?  Is it such a problem in Halo/Call of Duty that I can just avoid fire and wait to heal?  Why is it so much of a problem in this game?  Why is it being held to such a higher standard of realism? 

I'll see how jarring it is, soon enough.


Well Halo always had that, and CoD had it since before Modern Warfare. Here, I'll give that it could work, but it is jarring.



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

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"Um, by that logic, every other game character is a Sue".

THAT'S WHAT I JUST SAID. Yes, every other game protagonist is a Sue, a proxy for the player to project onto as an escapist wish-fulfillment. Crono and Serge in the Chrono series are this, Link is, Samus used to be, Gordon Freeman is, Master Chief is, Marcus Fenix is, Kratos is (from God of War 2 onward anyway), every protagonist in the Shin Megami Tensei series, every hero in the Dragon Quest series, and nearly every hero ever created in every Western RPG. They're Sues, I'll admit that, it's common as hell in gaming since its purpose is to entertain, not necesarilly tell a story. In story-heavy games though things change; the protagonists are more defined and have characteristics and flaws (though a lot of RPGs still do the silent protagonist thing) such as Fei Fong Wong, Ashley Riot, Aya Brea, Lenneth Valkyrie, Cloud Strife, Cecil Harvey, Dante, Nero, Tidus, and now our current Samus. They're no longer Sues, they're defined characters that we can't project onto but that we can use to guide us through the narrative.



Aiddon said:

"Um, by that logic, every other game character is a Sue".

THAT'S WHAT I JUST SAID. Yes, every other game protagonist is a Sue, a proxy for the player to project onto as an escapist wish-fulfillment. Crono and Serge in the Chrono series are this, Link is, Samus used to be, Gordon Freeman is, Master Chief is, Marcus Fenix is, Kratos is (from God of War 2 onward anyway), every protagonist in the Shin Megami Tensei series, every hero in the Dragon Quest series, and nearly every hero ever created in every Western RPG. They're Sues, I'll admit that, it's common as hell in gaming since its purpose is to entertain, not necesarilly tell a story. In story-heavy games though things change; the protagonists are more defined and have characteristics and flaws (though a lot of RPGs still do the silent protagonist thing) such as Fei Fong Wong, Ashley Riot, Aya Brea, Lenneth Valkyrie, Cloud Strife, Cecil Harvey, Dante, Nero, Tidus, and now our current Samus. They're no longer Sues, they're defined characters that we can't project onto but that we can use to guide us through the narrative.


Proxy for the players is not a definition of a Sue. Chrono doesn't beat Lavos when everyone else failed. Magus didn't turn to good because Chrono showed him it was right in some vague manner. Chrono didn't have all the girls in the game fawning over him.

This is worse than calling Luke Skywalker a Sue because he got promoted fast, as though all the other fast promotions in the series don't count.



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

mhsillen said:
MaxwellGT2000 said:
mhsillen said:
Farmageddon said:

Oh please, I bet if any of the male naysayers saw a Ridley-like beast popping out in their front they'd go mental a lot worse than Samus did.

I find it sexist to find that sexist :P


Are you kidding? You have to do better then that.

Samus was strong silent and kicked ass

Now she shrinks and a man has to save her?  And she is so scared that she allows someone to die?  I'm surprised Sakamoto  didn't make her wear a school girl uniform.

Ripley in Aliens had maternal instincts but she didn't shrink she kicked ass.  So if you have to bore us with maternal instinct and if you have to bore us with cutscenes at least do the character right. 

That didn't happen she told Anthony not to fight Ridley she would handle it and he went in with his plasma gun that needed to charge, he gets knocked off and she made the tough choice of fighting instead of risking her life and the mission...


she sat there frozen with fear while everyone is trying to wake her from her slumber of fear.

Ripley in the Aliens movie had maternal instincts for the little girl newt.

When Newt needed rescue her fears were drowned out by her sense of duty she didn't think about for a second.  No shrinking out of fear just action, Ripley was a well done fleshed out take charge women.

This Samus is a train wreck 

Maybe strong women is what I like 

And younger Japanese culture like the  weak women type


Again that didn't happen, did you even play the game? 



MaxwellGT2000 - "Does the amount of times you beat it count towards how hardcore you are?"

Wii Friend Code - 5882 9717 7391 0918 (PM me if you add me), PSN - MaxwellGT2000, XBL - BlkKniteCecil, MaxwellGT2000

Farmageddon said:
LordTheNightKnight said:
Farmageddon said:

Oh please, I bet if any of the male naysayers saw a Ridley-like beast popping out in their front they'd go mental a lot worse than Samus did :P


How does that apply here? We aren't battle-hardened warriors who fought monsters.

mhsillen said:
Farmageddon said:

Oh please, I bet if any of the male naysayers saw a Ridley-like beast popping out in their front they'd go mental a lot worse than Samus did.

I find it sexist to find that sexist :P


Are you kidding? You have to do better then that.

Samus was strong silent and kicked ass

Now she shrinks and a man has to save her?  And she is so scared that she allows someone to die?  I'm surprised Sakamoto  didn't make her wear a school girl uniform.

Ripley in Aliens had maternal instincts but she didn't shrink she kicked ass.  So if you have to bore us with maternal instinct and if you have to bore us with cutscenes at least do the character right. 

I'll go for a single answer.

No, people here are not hardened soldiers, but the point is that being either male or female is not what's gonna decide if that reaction would make sense. So if sex has no bearing in dictating if that could or could not happen, there's no way that scene can be sexist.

Thus, it only makes sense to say that scene is so if you actually believe that someone is supposed to always freak out on that situation if it's a woman but supposed to never do so if it's a man. Now, that's sexist thinking.

Also, so what a man saves her. Would it be ok if another woman saved her? Besides, how many men has she saved before? Are those men less of a man because of that? Again, that'd be a sexist interpretation. So basically if you ever need help, or anyone sacrifices for yourself, you're a woman. Right, Sakamoto is the sexist one.

So yeah, you don't need to like the sequence, but calling it sexist makes no sense. Ripley killed her friking parents when she was a child. And the damn thing seems like it actually never dies, as it had told her before. Sure only a woman could ever gasp for thirty seconds on that situation.


this is the same Samus who did not show fear in earlier games. That was her personality.  

This is another MOM character it is not Samus it is an impostor. 

I think I'm mostly alone. mostly  in my feelings and disappointment and I realize my bloviating  meter is in the red

So I hope they will make another metriod with fans like me in mind



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mhsillen said:
Farmageddon said:
LordTheNightKnight said:
Farmageddon said:

Oh please, I bet if any of the male naysayers saw a Ridley-like beast popping out in their front they'd go mental a lot worse than Samus did :P


How does that apply here? We aren't battle-hardened warriors who fought monsters.

mhsillen said:
Farmageddon said:

Oh please, I bet if any of the male naysayers saw a Ridley-like beast popping out in their front they'd go mental a lot worse than Samus did.

I find it sexist to find that sexist :P


Are you kidding? You have to do better then that.

Samus was strong silent and kicked ass

Now she shrinks and a man has to save her?  And she is so scared that she allows someone to die?  I'm surprised Sakamoto  didn't make her wear a school girl uniform.

Ripley in Aliens had maternal instincts but she didn't shrink she kicked ass.  So if you have to bore us with maternal instinct and if you have to bore us with cutscenes at least do the character right. 

I'll go for a single answer.

No, people here are not hardened soldiers, but the point is that being either male or female is not what's gonna decide if that reaction would make sense. So if sex has no bearing in dictating if that could or could not happen, there's no way that scene can be sexist.

Thus, it only makes sense to say that scene is so if you actually believe that someone is supposed to always freak out on that situation if it's a woman but supposed to never do so if it's a man. Now, that's sexist thinking.

Also, so what a man saves her. Would it be ok if another woman saved her? Besides, how many men has she saved before? Are those men less of a man because of that? Again, that'd be a sexist interpretation. So basically if you ever need help, or anyone sacrifices for yourself, you're a woman. Right, Sakamoto is the sexist one.

So yeah, you don't need to like the sequence, but calling it sexist makes no sense. Ripley killed her friking parents when she was a child. And the damn thing seems like it actually never dies, as it had told her before. Sure only a woman could ever gasp for thirty seconds on that situation.


this is the same Samus who did not show fear in earlier games. That was her personality.  

This is another MOM character it is not Samus it is an impostor. 

I think I'm mostly alone. mostly  in my feelings and disappointment and I realize my bloviating  meter is in the red

So I hope they will make another metriod with fans like me in mind


You're not alone. There are some on this thread, and other threads, and several online, that feel that.



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

How can Samus Aran be an important videogame female icon, if she has barely shown her face until now, and has barely said anything until Other M? ....



gekkokamen said:

How can Samus Aran be an important videogame female icon, if she has barely shown her face until now, and has barely said anything until Other M? ....


Why do you think seeing her face is necessary to being the icon? Why do you think speaking is?

How about she was just a plain old asskicker, just like guy heroes, not just of games, but of other media? Abbie did state that what set Samus apart was that Samus being female never really factored into the games until now.



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

LordTheNightKnight said:
gekkokamen said:

How can Samus Aran be an important videogame female icon, if she has barely shown her face until now, and has barely said anything until Other M? ....


Why do you think seeing her face is necessary to being the icon? Why do you think speaking is?

How about she was just a plain old asskicker, just like guy heroes, not just of games, but of other media? Abbie did state that what set Samus apart was that Samus being female never really factored into the games until now.

exactly, then why made the distinction of "female" icon...IT was just an important videogame icon, IT still is. Gender had never anything to do with it, and this woman takes it kinda personal 'cause she's a woman and Samus is, but the importance of Metroid has very little if anything to do with the character, let alone atribute any particular distinction to it because it turns out Samus is female.



gekkokamen said:
LordTheNightKnight said:
gekkokamen said:

How can Samus Aran be an important videogame female icon, if she has barely shown her face until now, and has barely said anything until Other M? ....


Why do you think seeing her face is necessary to being the icon? Why do you think speaking is?

How about she was just a plain old asskicker, just like guy heroes, not just of games, but of other media? Abbie did state that what set Samus apart was that Samus being female never really factored into the games until now.

exactly, then why made the distinction of "female" icon...IT was just an important videogame icon, IT still is. Gender had never anything to do with it, and this woman takes it kinda personal 'cause she's a woman and Samus is, but the importance of Metroid has very little if anything to do with the character, let alone atribute any particular distinction to it because it turns out Samus is female.


I don't think you get it. It was BECAUSE gender never had anything to do with it that made her a strong female gaming icon. In a way, it's like no one remaking on someone's skin color. That was what made Uhura such a strong icon in the 60s. Despite having a seemingly minor role, about the only time her skin color mattered was when an illusion of Abraham Lincoln was created. Otherwise it didn't matter, and when she spoke up, people listened. Unfortunately, her being female was mentioned more often, and I don't just mean the uniform (or Kirk coming on to her in the new film, since that was just Kirk being Kirk), but not too much. She was still important to the crew (for one thing, she knew communications codes to help whenever they ran into the Romulans).

Just look at the controversies over whether a female heroine should be more female or less female (like are the Disney Princesses good role models or not). With Samus, it had finally gotten past that crap... until here.



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs