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Forums - Gaming - If 3D Dot Game Heroes was an actual Zelda game...

Euphoria14 on 31 May 2010
Khuutra said:
Euphoria14 said:
Khuutra said:

I think you undersell how much Phantom Hourglass managed to differentiate itself from the rest of the series in terms of structure and design.

It is still at heart a 2D 3/4 top down Zelda title. My only gripe is the touch screen controls.

If you take away those controls and some of the gimicks that come with the DS (closing an reopening to create the image on the map, it is still the old school fun many Zelda fans are accustomed to.

The complete shift in gameplay focus toward puzzle-based dungeons to the exclusion of combat focus - and especially the boss fights - differentiates the game considerably from its 2D predecessors. Nevermind the way the overworld works, and the sectioned off towns and dungeons.

The game is structurally as different from LttP as OoT is.

If I am understanding this comment correctly then I must ask this...

 

Why is it being attacked for being too similar to NES/SNES Zelda when it clearly shows many differences?



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Khuutra on 31 May 2010
Euphoria14 said:
Khuutra said:

The complete shift in gameplay focus toward puzzle-based dungeons to the exclusion of combat focus - and especially the boss fights - differentiates the game considerably from its 2D predecessors. Nevermind the way the overworld works, and the sectioned off towns and dungeons.

The game is structurally as different from LttP as OoT is.

If I am understanding this comment correctly then I must ask this...

 

Why is it being attacked for being too similar to NES/SNES Zelda when it clearly shows many differences?

3DDGH or Phantom Hourglass? This is important!



Euphoria14 on 31 May 2010
Khuutra said:
Euphoria14 said:
Khuutra said:

The complete shift in gameplay focus toward puzzle-based dungeons to the exclusion of combat focus - and especially the boss fights - differentiates the game considerably from its 2D predecessors. Nevermind the way the overworld works, and the sectioned off towns and dungeons.

The game is structurally as different from LttP as OoT is.

If I am understanding this comment correctly then I must ask this...

 

Why is it being attacked for being too similar to NES/SNES Zelda when it clearly shows many differences?

3DDGH or Phantom Hourglass? This is important!

You're talking about PHG. -_-

 

Anyways, IGN said it best IMO.

To a large number of readers, this may sound all-too-familiar, so let's get something out of the way before we proceed: I've seen fellow Zelda fans react in mixed ways to previews of 3D Dot Game Heroes. While reactions have been overwhelmingly positive, cries of "ripoff" and accusations of unoriginality just couldn't be more misguided -- and they also show a shortsighted view of game history. 

Games that take a great foundation and build on it are invariably respected and championed for doing just that. Dragon Warrior begot Final Fantasy, Super Metroid begot Castlevania: Symphony of the Night, and Guitar Hero begot Rock Band. Celebrated games are often blatant iterations on a previous game. The difference here is that 3D Dot Game Heroes isn't an attempt to one-up a competitor. It wears its heart for Zelda, and other retro games, on its sleeve. It's a love letter to Zelda and the games of yesterday, and it doesn't ever make the mistake of taking itself seriously -- and neither should you.



iPhone = Great gaming device. Don't agree? Who cares, because you're wrong.

Currently playing:

Final Fantasy VI (iOS), Final Fantasy: Record Keeper (iOS) & Dragon Quest V (iOS)     

    

Got a retro room? Post it here!

ZenfoldorVGI on 31 May 2010
Euphoria14 said:
darthdevidem01 said:
Euphoria in your opinion Is 3D Dot Game Heroes better than any of the 2D Console Zelda's?

3 words. HELL FUCKING NO!!!

 

Still doesn't mean I agree with the numerous 60/100 scores it has gotten. 

I believe it is an easy 80-83 Meta games, simply based on it's simple pick up and play style as well as long game length at the price of only $40.

 

I think my argument is pretty sound, especially considering just how much of a Zelda fan I am.

 

Gonna go eat some greasy bacon burgers, be right back to see responses.

No the game doesn't deserve a 6/10. It deserves between an 80 and 85 imo, and it's actually pretty good, even for a full priced game, and I would buy it 10 times before I'd buy some of the other crap that's being released at full price lately, and I won't mention the game I'm talking about because it would start unnecessary offtopic discussion.



I don't need your console war.
It feeds the rich while it buries the poor.
You're power hungry, spinnin' stories, and bein' graphics whores.
I don't need your console war.

NO NO, NO NO NO.

ZenfoldorVGI on 31 May 2010
Euphoria14 said:

Then add this little problem I have, even though it is different reviewers, which adds to my point that certain people should review certain games.

 

Eurogamer import review of 3D Dot Game Heroes, before the added Block Out upgrades - 7/10.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/3d-dot-game-heroes-review  

t Game Heroes is a one-trick pony, but it does its one trick very well. Anyone with any nostalgic affection for the era of its inspiration - or for classic Zelda - will find it hard to resist. You could see it either as a loving tribute or a complete rip-off, but even if it is a rip-off, it's a very likeable one. If it were a bit more imaginative and a bit funnier, a bit more openly satirical, it might be brilliant. It's a comfortable and visually stunning trip down memory lane rather than anything more ambitious.

Eurogamers domestic review of 3D Dot Game Heroes, after Block Out upgrade + shortened load times + DLC loaded onto the retail disc - 6/10.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/3d-dot-game-heroes-euro-review  

3D Dot Game Heroes does have its moments and fun features, like a cute little avatar editor (guess what I made), and the ability to take screenshots and save them to your PS3's photo gallery. But every one of the problems it suffers from elsewhere is something that Legend of Zelda, through its longevity and the massive expertise of its designers, has either long since overcome or never had to worry about anyway. More or less everything 3D Dot Game Heroes does well, meanwhile, is something Zelda has already done better.

Don't trust these reviews worth a shit, because which one do you trust? I would say the first one since the 2nd one takes way too much time attacking it for being exactly what it meant to be. Just sounds to me like a butthurt Zelda fan to be honest.

...and just a note, I don't think many Zelda fans are threatened by this game, especially any reviewers at Eurogamer...

6/10 is NOT a bad review from them, it's above average, and they reviewed the game under the same standard as a full priced game, so again, 6/10 is not a bad score from eurogamer.



I don't need your console war.
It feeds the rich while it buries the poor.
You're power hungry, spinnin' stories, and bein' graphics whores.
I don't need your console war.

NO NO, NO NO NO.

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Khuutra on 31 May 2010
Euphoria14 said:
Khuutra said:

3DDGH or Phantom Hourglass? This is important!

You're talking about PHG. -_-

 

Anyways, IGN said it best IMO.

To a large number of readers, this may sound all-too-familiar, so let's get something out of the way before we proceed: I've seen fellow Zelda fans react in mixed ways to previews of 3D Dot Game Heroes. While reactions have been overwhelmingly positive, cries of "ripoff" and accusations of unoriginality just couldn't be more misguided -- and they also show a shortsighted view of game history. 

Games that take a great foundation and build on it are invariably respected and championed for doing just that. Dragon Warrior begot Final Fantasy, Super Metroid begot Castlevania: Symphony of the Night, and Guitar Hero begot Rock Band. Celebrated games are often blatant iterations on a previous game. The difference here is that 3D Dot Game Heroes isn't an attempt to one-up a competitor. It wears its heart for Zelda, and other retro games, on its sleeve. It's a love letter to Zelda and the games of yesterday, and it doesn't ever make the mistake of taking itself seriously -- and neither should you.

I ignored reviews for that one, largely.

If they're saying that in spite of the fact that it clearly differentiates itself, it's because they don't think very hard about how Zelda's structure works.



Euphoria14 on 31 May 2010
ZenfoldorVGI said:
Euphoria14 said:
 

Then add this little problem I have, even though it is different reviewers, which adds to my point that certain people should review certain games.

 

Eurogamer import review of 3D Dot Game Heroes, before the added Block Out upgrades - 7/10.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/3d-dot-game-heroes-review  

t Game Heroes is a one-trick pony, but it does its one trick very well. Anyone with any nostalgic affection for the era of its inspiration - or for classic Zelda - will find it hard to resist. You could see it either as a loving tribute or a complete rip-off, but even if it is a rip-off, it's a very likeable one. If it were a bit more imaginative and a bit funnier, a bit more openly satirical, it might be brilliant. It's a comfortable and visually stunning trip down memory lane rather than anything more ambitious.

Eurogamers domestic review of 3D Dot Game Heroes, after Block Out upgrade + shortened load times + DLC loaded onto the retail disc - 6/10.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/3d-dot-game-heroes-euro-review  

3D Dot Game Heroes does have its moments and fun features, like a cute little avatar editor (guess what I made), and the ability to take screenshots and save them to your PS3's photo gallery. But every one of the problems it suffers from elsewhere is something that Legend of Zelda, through its longevity and the massive expertise of its designers, has either long since overcome or never had to worry about anyway. More or less everything 3D Dot Game Heroes does well, meanwhile, is something Zelda has already done better.

Don't trust these reviews worth a shit, because which one do you trust? I would say the first one since the 2nd one takes way too much time attacking it for being exactly what it meant to be. Just sounds to me like a butthurt Zelda fan to be honest.

...and just a note, I don't think many Zelda fans are threatened by this game, especially any reviewers at Eurogamer...

6/10 is NOT a bad review from them, it's above average, and they reviewed the game under the same standard as a full priced game, so again, 6/10 is not a bad score from eurogamer.

Oh I agree, they shouldn't feel threatened. I feel that any self respecting Zelda fan should welcome this game with open arms. Not only because it is similar, but because it is meant to be similar and it is meant to be a tribute to what Zelda is and it shows it's love for Zelda and numerous other old school titles throughout the adventure.

I also don't think 6/10 is bad from Eurogamer, I just think it looks bad that an import review with less content is rated higher than a domestic review with enhanced gameplay as well as more content.

 

One review is focused on what the game is and what it offers while the other is really nothing more than "blah blah Zelda", "blah blah Too much like Zelda", "Blah blah copies from Zelda".

To me that isn't a review, that is bashing in place of where an actual review should be. A review is meant to tell you what the game offers, what it's strengths are, what it's weaknesses are, not that it isn't worth too much of your time because it is similar to a game most young gamers haven't even touched.

Want to focus on us older gamers however who did touch the old school Zeldas? I still think they are doing it wrong because the fact that it is similar is why we are interested in the first place.

 

You know what I mean? I know I am not alone in this line of thinking.



iPhone = Great gaming device. Don't agree? Who cares, because you're wrong.

Currently playing:

Final Fantasy VI (iOS), Final Fantasy: Record Keeper (iOS) & Dragon Quest V (iOS)     

    

Got a retro room? Post it here!

miz1q2w3e on 31 May 2010

Euphoria14 said:

Anyways, IGN said it best IMO.

To a large number of readers, this may sound all-too-familiar, so let's get something out of the way before we proceed: I've seen fellow Zelda fans react in mixed ways to previews of 3D Dot Game Heroes. While reactions have been overwhelmingly positive, cries of "ripoff" and accusations of unoriginality just couldn't be more misguided -- and they also show a shortsighted view of game history. 

Games that take a great foundation and build on it are invariably respected and championed for doing just that. Dragon Warrior begot Final Fantasy, Super Metroid begot Castlevania: Symphony of the Night, and Guitar Hero begot Rock Band. Celebrated games are often blatant iterations on a previous game. The difference here is that 3D Dot Game Heroes isn't an attempt to one-up a competitor. It wears its heart for Zelda, and other retro games, on its sleeve. It's a love letter to Zelda and the games of yesterday, and it doesn't ever make the mistake of taking itself seriously -- and neither should you.


wow, really beautiful words :)

I'd also recomend checking out the Gametrailers Review  for this game, it was super in describing the game very well imo. certainly doesn't deserve the 6's and 5's like some reviewers gave it :(

on topic (long forgotten lol) : i actually think that the usually reliable reviewers gave the game pretty fair scores but metacritic also factors in the not-so-reliable reviewers aswell... that's why it got a lower metascore



Euphoria14 on 31 May 2010
miz1q2w3e said:

Euphoria14 said:

Anyways, IGN said it best IMO.

To a large number of readers, this may sound all-too-familiar, so let's get something out of the way before we proceed: I've seen fellow Zelda fans react in mixed ways to previews of 3D Dot Game Heroes. While reactions have been overwhelmingly positive, cries of "ripoff" and accusations of unoriginality just couldn't be more misguided -- and they also show a shortsighted view of game history. 

Games that take a great foundation and build on it are invariably respected and championed for doing just that. Dragon Warrior begot Final Fantasy, Super Metroid begot Castlevania: Symphony of the Night, and Guitar Hero begot Rock Band. Celebrated games are often blatant iterations on a previous game. The difference here is that 3D Dot Game Heroes isn't an attempt to one-up a competitor. It wears its heart for Zelda, and other retro games, on its sleeve. It's a love letter to Zelda and the games of yesterday, and it doesn't ever make the mistake of taking itself seriously -- and neither should you.


wow, really beautiful words :)

I'd also recomend checking out the Gametrailers Review  for this game, it was super in describing the game very well imo. certainly doesn't deserve the 6's and 5's like some reviewers gave it :(

on topic (long forgotten lol) : i actually think that the usually reliable reviewers gave the game pretty fair scores but metacritic also factors in the not-so-reliable reviewers aswell... that's why it got a lower metascore

I look at it this way. The fact that a game that only took 10 months to make averaged ~80% is absolutely astonishing.

Think it they took 2 years like most devs.



iPhone = Great gaming device. Don't agree? Who cares, because you're wrong.

Currently playing:

Final Fantasy VI (iOS), Final Fantasy: Record Keeper (iOS) & Dragon Quest V (iOS)     

    

Got a retro room? Post it here!

Sorcery on 31 May 2010

You and I differ in opinion Eurogamer, you wouldn't rank 3DDGH ahead of all the 2-d Zelda games, but I would.


I truly don't understand why everyone is so adamant that 3DDGH is an inferior game to the Zelda games. Honestly, what about the game is inferior to the 2-d Zelda games? The only aspects of the game that I'd argue are inferior to the 2-d Zelda games are the music and the story, and perhaps I'd also include the lack of depth the overworld has in comparison to A Link to the Past, but that's about it. 

The world is full of character, just like Zelda. There are a ton of items to collect, even more than Zelda. The world is easy to navigate, unlike the handheld Zelda's. The puzzles are similar, albeit a bit different (and IMO harder were it not for the fact that we're all used to those types of puzzles by now). Enemies are tough and the game is challenging, unlike Zelda has been for generations. There are no poorly implemented gimmicks. Item switching is probably faster than its ever been in Zelda.


As far as I'm concerned, 3DDGH takes a formula, then builds and improves upon it. It is easily the best top-down perspective action/adventure game I've ever played. Sure, the original Legend of Zelda has always been my favorite, and therefore my adoration towards 3DDGH is a bit more understandable, but even then the game does a lot right, and very little wrong.

Hell, even the fetch quest was 1,000 times less annoying than the fetch quests we've had in TWW and TP.


I'll just finish up by saying I'd much, MUCH rather spend $40 on 3DDGH than $35 on Phantom Hourglass or Spirit Tracks. In comparison, the game is so much better it's laughable.



Currently playing: Uncharted: Drake's Fortune, NBA2k11, Metal Gear Solid, Picross 3d