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Forums - PC Discussion - Official Star Craft 2 Beta Thread

KungKras on 08 May 2010
Gnizmo said:
KungKras said:

Against Terran you need a fast robo to get observers since they are your only protection against cloaked banshees and you need fast immortals or you WILL get raped by their marauders if the terran knows how to play.

   Against Zerg you need robo to get scouting since you won't have map control and you need fast immortals to deal with mass roach.getting an observer early to scout for spire is also extremely important.

Not until after you have at least one robotics facility is it viable to get a citadel since even with the upgrades, your units will be too weak to deal with the enemy without tech support. (And protoss are supposed to be the strongest but most expensive -_-)

   In PvP robo bay is also the by far best choice for teching since the immortals rapes stalkers and the observer lets you scout your enemy fairly early on. You can go stargate => Voidray, but that's only if you all-in.

Templar tech would be viably if psionic storm didn't suck and if you could get DTs faster. Starport needs units that are not raped by the basic enemy air units (Viking > Phoenix? but aren't protoss supposed to.... nevermind)

If the Phoenix could counter Vikings then Terran would be massively fucked against Protoss. Collossus counters bio, Immortals counter mech and Marauders big time. Air is the only way to keep competitive in a long game against Protoss. Take away that advantage and all three tech trees would have ridiculous issues trying to win any long term battle.

Well, they should do something to make other tech openings than robo bay viable anyways. DT should be easier to get, HT too so that a teplar opening would be viable. But then Zerg would need early detection.



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Gnizmo on 08 May 2010
KungKras said:
Gnizmo said:
KungKras said:

Against Terran you need a fast robo to get observers since they are your only protection against cloaked banshees and you need fast immortals or you WILL get raped by their marauders if the terran knows how to play.

   Against Zerg you need robo to get scouting since you won't have map control and you need fast immortals to deal with mass roach.getting an observer early to scout for spire is also extremely important.

Not until after you have at least one robotics facility is it viable to get a citadel since even with the upgrades, your units will be too weak to deal with the enemy without tech support. (And protoss are supposed to be the strongest but most expensive -_-)

   In PvP robo bay is also the by far best choice for teching since the immortals rapes stalkers and the observer lets you scout your enemy fairly early on. You can go stargate => Voidray, but that's only if you all-in.

Templar tech would be viably if psionic storm didn't suck and if you could get DTs faster. Starport needs units that are not raped by the basic enemy air units (Viking > Phoenix? but aren't protoss supposed to.... nevermind)

If the Phoenix could counter Vikings then Terran would be massively fucked against Protoss. Collossus counters bio, Immortals counter mech and Marauders big time. Air is the only way to keep competitive in a long game against Protoss. Take away that advantage and all three tech trees would have ridiculous issues trying to win any long term battle.

Well, they should do something to make other tech openings than robo bay viable anyways. DT should be easier to get, HT too so that a teplar opening would be viable. But then Zerg would need early detection.


I'd love that as well honestly. It would make either bio or mech much more viable against Protoss and make the game more dynamic in general. I was just commenting on the Phoenix part. You simply can't have one race able to completely shut down another. It was my one and only concern about Phoenixes getting moving shot honestly.

Starcraft 2 ID: Gnizmo 229

The_vagabond7 on 09 May 2010

Awesome, patch 12 will be buffing the ultralisk. That sucker needs it.
Apparently they plan on focusing specifically on the zerg for the next patch, not to make them stronger but to give them more variety.

http://forums.battle.net/thread.html?topicId=24702391969&sid=5000

it's an interesting read all together. It's the "situation report" on patch 11 explaining the buffs and nerfs and what is planned for the next patch. I can't wait to see what they have in store for the ol' ultralisk. I used to love dark swarm+ultras in broodwar, now those big fellas are just a waste of resources.



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Gnizmo on 09 May 2010

Yeah I am interested to see what happens with the ultralisk now. You definitely needed to make 250mm Cannon harder to get to have them be remotely viable though. Easier to get, same exact cost, and always wins with even or better numbers is rough.



Starcraft 2 ID: Gnizmo 229

The_vagabond7 on 09 May 2010

If they really wanted to make the ultra a meat shield they should give it an ability similar to the immortal's shield. The immortal's shield can only have I think 10 HP taken off of it at a time, give that or something similar to that to an ultra and it effectively can become a huge meat shield. Maybe even make it an active ability rather than a passive one. But as it stands there are just too many units that will make mincemeat out of ultras before they can do anything to be worth their cost.



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Gnizmo on 09 May 2010
The_vagabond7 said:
If they really wanted to make the ultra a meat shield they should give it an ability similar to the immortal's shield. The immortal's shield can only have I think 10 HP taken off of it at a time, give that or something similar to that to an ultra and it effectively can become a huge meat shield. Maybe even make it an active ability rather than a passive one. But as it stands there are just too many units that will make mincemeat out of ultras before they can do anything to be worth their cost.

There is no need to copy abilities. Especially since it likely wouldn't do a lot to help the Ultralisk anyways. I'd much rather see them create something unique for the unit. 250mm Cannon would still wipe it out, and Marauders with stim would still crop it lightning fast before it could do much damage.



Starcraft 2 ID: Gnizmo 229

The_vagabond7 on 09 May 2010
Gnizmo said:
The_vagabond7 said:
If they really wanted to make the ultra a meat shield they should give it an ability similar to the immortal's shield. The immortal's shield can only have I think 10 HP taken off of it at a time, give that or something similar to that to an ultra and it effectively can become a huge meat shield. Maybe even make it an active ability rather than a passive one. But as it stands there are just too many units that will make mincemeat out of ultras before they can do anything to be worth their cost.

There is no need to copy abilities. Especially since it likely wouldn't do a lot to help the Ultralisk anyways. I'd much rather see them create something unique for the unit. 250mm Cannon would still wipe it out, and Marauders with stim would still crop it lightning fast before it could do much damage.

Which leaves one solution. FLYING ULTRALISKS



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mirgro on 09 May 2010
The_vagabond7 said:
Gnizmo said:
The_vagabond7 said:
If they really wanted to make the ultra a meat shield they should give it an ability similar to the immortal's shield. The immortal's shield can only have I think 10 HP taken off of it at a time, give that or something similar to that to an ultra and it effectively can become a huge meat shield. Maybe even make it an active ability rather than a passive one. But as it stands there are just too many units that will make mincemeat out of ultras before they can do anything to be worth their cost.

There is no need to copy abilities. Especially since it likely wouldn't do a lot to help the Ultralisk anyways. I'd much rather see them create something unique for the unit. 250mm Cannon would still wipe it out, and Marauders with stim would still crop it lightning fast before it could do much damage.

Which leaves one solution. FLYING ULTRALISKS

I think it should be able to shoot out its scythes and be a ranged unit instead.

Although I have to admit, in only one game I made about 7-9 Ultralisks against a mass of Terran, and those things absolutely decimated the poor fuckers in seconds.

For the zerg, I also wish they would make the infestor a little more useful. In fact between the 3 support units, high templar, infestor, and ravens, only the ravens really seem of any use.



mirgro on 10 May 2010

This is probably why the ultralisks aren't getting nerfed:

 



KungKras on 10 May 2010

What about an ultralisk that can move while burrowed? That would be awesome, and make ultras more tactical.



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