RolStoppable said:
kitler53 said:
i'm going to ignore all the crying and get right you the point.
"This was inspired by the thread about GTA Chinatown Wars, but this is broader than that. This is about the supposed notion that userbase is to blame for a game not selling well."
Wrong, it is the user bases fault. nintendo fans have flooded vgchartz lately with threads crying about third parties not bring the kind of games the market leader deserves. "oh noes, the developers are lazy" you say. "they didn't advertise enough" you say. "they aren't bringing their top tier franchises" you say. well too bad, GTA:CW is an amazing game from a great brand that had great advertising and still it failed. the reason: the nintendo userbase doesn't want the GTAs, the No More Heroes, the Red Steels, the muramasas...
Cry all you want but here is the honest truth of the matter. Nintendo is a great developer, no doubt about it. but nintendo makes a certain type of game: family friendly, cartoony, simplistic, with unique user interfaces. the userbase of the wii and the ds were created on the backs of great nintendo hits like nintendogs, new super mario brothers, mario kart, wii fit, wii sports.
now take particular notice to what those games are not like...they're not at all like GTA. but you know who is making games much more similar to GTA? Sony and Microsoft. consumers aren't stupid, consumers that want simple family friendly fair are going to buy wiis, consumers that what complex violent fair are going to buy 360s or ps3.
in the end, nintendo systems don't deserve games like GTA, dead space, assassins creed, ect any more then the ps3 deserves the port of EA active it's getting. the userbase just isn't there. |
GTA:CW is nowhere the same as the style that made the series popular in the first place, it's not that hard to understand. You might as well wonder why 2D Mario platformers sell so much more than the more critical acclaimed 3D games, but the answer is the same: They are different kinds of games, hence the difference in sales.
No More Heroes is kinda like Killer 7. Didn't sell on the PS2 even though GTA was the top dog on the console.
Red Steel is definitely not a great game. I guess you can compare it to a franchise like Red Faction if you want. Didn't sell spectacularly on the PS2 either.
Muramasa. Well, Odin Sphere. Didn't sell on the PS2 either.
Not that many consumers buy 360s and PS3s due to first party games, that's evidenced by third party games being so present on the million sellers list, even at the top. What that means is that most consumers seem to go where the games are. So if it's made, it should sell. GTA:CW is the best selling top down GTA in the series. Dragon Quest IX is going to be the best selling game of the series. Monster Hunter Tri will easily become the best selling title of the series on a home console. How is that possible if what you say is correct?
Well, the answer is that you are wrong.
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http://www.vgchartz.com/swlaunch.php?reg1=Japan&game1=Monster+Hunter+Freedom+2nd+G+-+PSP[18542]®2=Japan&game2=Monster+Hunter+Tri+-+Wii[26681]®3=All&game3=&weeks=100
That's not going to happen.
Also @ OP, why would you bother saying CW is a mediocre game and then compare it to other games like Call of Duty and Monster Hunter? Sales-wise they are in the same ballpark, but your point insists that those are great games.
What's with all the excuses? Some vocal Nintendo fans on this site constantly know what's best and trash games when they sell poorly despite being good games. If it's not some "fatal gameplay flaw" (usually a complete exaggeration), it didn't have enough advertising, or it was drowned out by some GOTY which is a far better game than any of the competitors. Or maybe it was because the concept was great, but it was a bit on the eccentric side.
There's always something. Had NSMBWii been any other franchise or OIP (and therefore sold poorly) the nintendo guys would have said, "the mid-air collisions in this game made it completely unplayable with friends and totally killed the central aspect of the Wii demographic: social gaming". It's a cherry pick, honestly. If you push yourselves to like the game, then the idiosyncrasies don't matter....they actually IMPROVE the game! But when it sells bad, wow; everyone becomes a master librarian at Video Game Central and proclaims how devs don't understand anything and make poor decisions. You guys just can't let the pride down and say "Yes, blank game should've sold better, I don't understand". No no no. You guys have all the answers. 'Let's talk about Malstrom for a little while and congratulate N for being disruptive while we sip english breakfast and nibble on some ginger snaps'.
The OP doesn't even make a very good point, nor does the post directly below it about just dance or NSMB. 'the games that are deserving of being a hit, sell'. That's what I got from the OP.
The games that sell are the ones that the demographic userbase wants... It doesn't matter if it is a great game. What matters is what the environment is like, and what the demographic expects. Every developer wants to make hit games. Every dev is a creator. They don't like making corporate trash, but they sometimes have to do it. However, there are lots of these guys who want to make an experience for the audience and they really give it their all, but in sales, they always come up short. It is not their fault. Look at the non-nintendo games out there that sell bucketloads... it's mostly corporate cash-ins: cheap, easily made games that fit the demographic.
And don't worry about that ps2 diamonds list, rol. Wii is amassing a sizable army of ignored games in half the time.
the points I made about things that were specifically brought up were meant for the people I addressed them to. The rest of the ranting was just non-directional vitriol. You guys should really just enjoy your games, and stop thinking that it's your place to answer all the hatemail. Here's a tip: WHO CARES? Stop taking it personally when people complain that the wii can't sell a game they like. Like Rol said, there are plenty on every console, and there really aren't any concrete answers to any of them. So stop taking it personally and stop making these excuses.
Sorry for the rant. I really don't harbor any ill will toward any of you. But at times, this rhetoric is maddening. I like you all, and I know you're intelligent, but you're not fighting the good fight. You are fighting an ignorant one against people who hate on things because they are doing poorly on a system they hate. Don't stoop to that level, because there is no good answer. The questions the haters ask are rhetorical. They know the answer, and it's just a low-blow. It's especially embarassing when people try to actually defend it like it's something that is so profoundly intellectual that only a few fans in the underground, nintendo, and malstrom really understand.
