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Forums - Sony Discussion - Valve sure it will develop for PS3 in the future?

WilliamWatts on 20 February 2010
Reasonable said:

Personally, I'd love to see Valve on PS3 because on PSN, unlike Live, they could allow mods and access to user created content. They've remarked more than once they'd like 360 customers to get the access PC customers have to extended content - for example on PC I have way more campaigns/maps installed that ship with the game, for zero extra cost - and on PSN that would be possible as it is with UT3.

But Xbox Live does allow for user generated content AFAIK, its just that it needs to be moderated. In addition to this, most people are pretty unaware of how to create content which runs as fast or faster than the original content, so for a FPS which has little room for error then the PS3 would likely struggle with much of this content in terms of frame-rate. They would have to leave a significant performance margin in place to allow for user generated content, its not just flipping a switch.



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Chairman-Mao on 20 February 2010

Valve is one of the most overrated developers in my opinion. Left 4 Dead is a pretty average shooter that takes advantage of the recent resurgence in the popularity of zombie games. Half Life is really good but I don't know why people call it one of the, if not the, best shooters.



WilliamWatts on 20 February 2010
Xxain said:
RPGJock said:
Xxain said:
just to be real... I really think those PS3 fanboys shouldjust get over it. A Third Party developer (should) has the right to choose whatever platform they want whenever they want and the only Xxception is when there tied by contract. If you want to play a Valve game get a XBOX or a PC because you choose the wrong console.

Really son, really?  Because if it was about "leaving if up to the developers" to choose which consoles to develop on, it would be more than just a handful of developers doing it now.  You don't think there is a bunch of Japanese programmers asking why are they bothering to develop thier titiles on the X360?  You know a bunch of them probably down right hate it.  But its not about them or Valve or you or me.  Actually it is about you and me.  You like Xbox more, I like Playstation more.  The PUBLISHER wants to sell to both of us and its about making that money.  Never kid yourself on that fact, I don't care what the developers, publishers, journalists, or even the console makers say. 


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Reasonable on 20 February 2010
WilliamWatts said:
Reasonable said:

Personally, I'd love to see Valve on PS3 because on PSN, unlike Live, they could allow mods and access to user created content. They've remarked more than once they'd like 360 customers to get the access PC customers have to extended content - for example on PC I have way more campaigns/maps installed that ship with the game, for zero extra cost - and on PSN that would be possible as it is with UT3.

But Xbox Live does allow for user generated content AFAIK, its just that it needs to be moderated. In addition to this, most people are pretty unaware of how to create content which runs as fast or faster than the original content, so for a FPS which has little room for error then the PS3 would likely struggle with much of this content in terms of frame-rate. They would have to leave a significant performance margin in place to allow for user generated content, its not just flipping a switch.

Valve distinctly said there were issues, mainly around MS wanting some form of charging if I remember correctly, to getting this kind of modding onto Live.  I'll need to look at what is allowed, but I'm sure Epic also stated something similar around UT3.  Do you have any links?  I'm basing my understanding off comments from some of the developers, but if you have something specific I'd be interested to review it.

Certainly the perception of Live to me seems to be that it is anti-modding in the sense it exists on the PC.

I disagree a bit on generating the content, that's down to skill like anything else.  No reason talented modders wouldn't produce good results just as they do on the PC.  I've downloaded additional content/maps for UT3 on PS3 which run fine.



Try to be reasonable... its easier than you think...

kitler53 on 20 February 2010

as a ps3 fan and trophy whore i'd prefer to play valve games on my ps3 but eh...valve can do whatever they want and if they don't want to support the ps3 then that's just tough beans. oh, and portal was amazing.



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kibebr on 20 February 2010

I bought Orange Box for PS3.. I really liked playing offline all content, really great...
They are right about building up a development team inside theyr house..

If they not support PS3.. it´s OK, today there´s more PS3 games available than free time to play.. so I don´t miss...



PSN: franco-br
MGS4, GH, MW2, GT5p, WipeoutHD, etc..etc..

WilliamWatts on 20 February 2010
Reasonable said:
WilliamWatts said:
Reasonable said:

Personally, I'd love to see Valve on PS3 because on PSN, unlike Live, they could allow mods and access to user created content. They've remarked more than once they'd like 360 customers to get the access PC customers have to extended content - for example on PC I have way more campaigns/maps installed that ship with the game, for zero extra cost - and on PSN that would be possible as it is with UT3.

But Xbox Live does allow for user generated content AFAIK, its just that it needs to be moderated. In addition to this, most people are pretty unaware of how to create content which runs as fast or faster than the original content, so for a FPS which has little room for error then the PS3 would likely struggle with much of this content in terms of frame-rate. They would have to leave a significant performance margin in place to allow for user generated content, its not just flipping a switch.

Valve distinctly said there were issues, mainly around MS wanting some form of charging if I remember correctly, to getting this kind of modding onto Live.  I'll need to look at what is allowed, but I'm sure Epic also stated something similar around UT3.  Do you have any links?  I'm basing my understanding off comments from some of the developers, but if you have something specific I'd be interested to review it.

Certainly the perception of Live to me seems to be that it is anti-modding in the sense it exists on the PC.

I disagree a bit on generating the content, that's down to skill like anything else.  No reason talented modders wouldn't produce good results just as they do on the PC.  I've downloaded additional content/maps for UT3 on PS3 which run fine.

Unfortunately this was not possible for us. Trials HD is a moderate budget live arcade game after all. Track sharing system with rating and reviews between all players would require massive server infrastructure and lots of full day paid moderators to check that user levels do not have any vulgar content or copyright issues. LittleBigPlanet is a top budget AAA platform seller game, so Media Molecule and Sony could include a full featured all-to-all player content sharing system to it. This is a feature we are certainly looking forward in the game sequel(s) in the future.

In Trials HD you can share your tracks with your friends. Players can upload tracks, download tracks and browse tracks made by their friends. We have also local high scores and replays stored for all user created level top scores.

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1311628&postcount=24

Sebbbi is a Trials HD developer and that game has user generated content, just not shared over Xbox Live to anyone but people on friends lists.

Live allows modding but Microsoft is very controlling. They don't want vulgar/offensive content on their service so they moderate the players to ensure that paying customers get a good experience and they require content to be moderated as well. In addition to this im pretty sure they said they didn't want the userbases of games to fracture off along different lines such as mods + KB/M, mods - KB/M, no mods + KB/M etc and along the lines of different mods as well as wanting people to erm pay for their stuff too!

Im not saying all mods would make a game run poorly but theres a potential for that to happen. In addition to this it provides another 'entry' for hackers to abuse the system and for the mods to expose bugs in the games code. Xbox Live didn't suffer the same level of hacking for COD 4 that the PS3 did for example and thats partially due to how Microsoft locked down their system.

 



Reasonable on 20 February 2010
WilliamWatts said:
Reasonable said:
WilliamWatts said:
Reasonable said:

Personally, I'd love to see Valve on PS3 because on PSN, unlike Live, they could allow mods and access to user created content. They've remarked more than once they'd like 360 customers to get the access PC customers have to extended content - for example on PC I have way more campaigns/maps installed that ship with the game, for zero extra cost - and on PSN that would be possible as it is with UT3.

But Xbox Live does allow for user generated content AFAIK, its just that it needs to be moderated. In addition to this, most people are pretty unaware of how to create content which runs as fast or faster than the original content, so for a FPS which has little room for error then the PS3 would likely struggle with much of this content in terms of frame-rate. They would have to leave a significant performance margin in place to allow for user generated content, its not just flipping a switch.

Valve distinctly said there were issues, mainly around MS wanting some form of charging if I remember correctly, to getting this kind of modding onto Live.  I'll need to look at what is allowed, but I'm sure Epic also stated something similar around UT3.  Do you have any links?  I'm basing my understanding off comments from some of the developers, but if you have something specific I'd be interested to review it.

Certainly the perception of Live to me seems to be that it is anti-modding in the sense it exists on the PC.

I disagree a bit on generating the content, that's down to skill like anything else.  No reason talented modders wouldn't produce good results just as they do on the PC.  I've downloaded additional content/maps for UT3 on PS3 which run fine.

Unfortunately this was not possible for us. Trials HD is a moderate budget live arcade game after all. Track sharing system with rating and reviews between all players would require massive server infrastructure and lots of full day paid moderators to check that user levels do not have any vulgar content or copyright issues. LittleBigPlanet is a top budget AAA platform seller game, so Media Molecule and Sony could include a full featured all-to-all player content sharing system to it. This is a feature we are certainly looking forward in the game sequel(s) in the future.

In Trials HD you can share your tracks with your friends. Players can upload tracks, download tracks and browse tracks made by their friends. We have also local high scores and replays stored for all user created level top scores.

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1311628&postcount=24

Sebbbi is a Trials HD developer and that game has user generated content, just not shared over Xbox Live to anyone but people on friends lists.

Live allows modding but Microsoft is very controlling. They don't want vulgar/offensive content on their service so they moderate the players to ensure that paying customers get a good experience and they require content to be moderated as well. In addition to this im pretty sure they said they didn't want the userbases of games to fracture off along different lines such as mods + KB/M, mods - KB/M, no mods + KB/M etc and along the lines of different mods as well as wanting people to erm pay for their stuff too!

Im not saying all mods would make a game run poorly but theres a potential for that to happen. In addition to this it provides another 'entry' for hackers to abuse the system and for the mods to expose bugs in the games code. Xbox Live didn't suffer the same level of hacking for COD 4 that the PS3 did for example and thats partially due to how Microsoft locked down their system.

 

I didn't mean content designed into the game like LBP, but allowing for custom L4D campaigns with user created textures, etc.  That just seems to be harder to get through Live due to the restrictions.  It's interesting that, despite 360/Live being tighter in this area the PS3 hasn't had the same level of hacking overall (to the console) although of course in cases like CoD you mention it did seem more exposed.

I think the other issue is that, due to the design of the consoles, mods would ideally need to be developed on a PC rather the console, as with say UT3, which complicates things a bit as it requires the owner to not just have a PS3/360 but a decent PC as well.

But I still want it because mods are so great on PC.  The amount of content I have for L4D, Oblivion, etc. on PC makes the original content on the disk look puny by comparison!

But clearly there are a lot of hurdles beyond just control of the network.



Try to be reasonable... its easier than you think...

Sharky54 on 20 February 2010
kowenicki said:
Sharky54 said:
I hate valve because of their stance that "Ps3 is too hard to develop for so we won't do it." Yes they have a right to not do work they don't want to. But I have a right to not buy their games. I used to be able to get over the how horribly ugly their games look. But I refuse to buy games from a company that is as I see it LAZY. If everyone refused to do stuff that was "hard" we wouldn't have nearly as much shit in the modern age as we do. Great men have tried their entire lives(Even if they keep failing) to achieve something. Look at Da Vinci. He tried to create a flying machine his entire life. Failed the whole time to. But i'll be damned. Many many MANY years later. Others built upon what he found. And now we can go into space. So FUCK YOU valve for not having the balls to push the video game industry forward. You lazy assholes.


lol... what the hell are you talking about... thats the worst analogy I ever heard. 

Um no its not. Its "hard" for them. Many things have been hard for others and they did them anyway.



kibebr on 21 February 2010
Sharky54 said:
kowenicki said:
Sharky54 said:
I hate valve because of their stance that "Ps3 is too hard to develop for so we won't do it." Yes they have a right to not do work they don't want to. But I have a right to not buy their games. I used to be able to get over the how horribly ugly their games look. But I refuse to buy games from a company that is as I see it LAZY. If everyone refused to do stuff that was "hard" we wouldn't have nearly as much shit in the modern age as we do. Great men have tried their entire lives(Even if they keep failing) to achieve something. Look at Da Vinci. He tried to create a flying machine his entire life. Failed the whole time to. But i'll be damned. Many many MANY years later. Others built upon what he found. And now we can go into space. So FUCK YOU valve for not having the balls to push the video game industry forward. You lazy assholes.


lol... what the hell are you talking about... thats the worst analogy I ever heard. 

Um no its not. Its "hard" for them. Many things have been hard for others and they did them anyway.

LOL LOL LOL!!! I admire because they do what they want when they can do the best about... I prefer working on a company that reject chaos and focus on professional quality and a life with spare time.



PSN: franco-br
MGS4, GH, MW2, GT5p, WipeoutHD, etc..etc..