Forums - Politics Discussion - Why is the United States so segregated?

KingCherry said:
adisababa said:
US is still alright for the most part, but UK is a whole other beast. Over there, I've been told to get out of the metro twice, once by some old drunk and second by a group of teens because of my ethnicity, granted they were mostly drunks but it still isn't a comfortable feeling when you're told that.

I actually think you're talking rubbish, I don't believe that one for one second... Unless you're white and the group of teens were black, etc... The UK is a whole other Beast???

If you're trying to imply the UK, a totally submissive nation who's being tarred with every brush for the sake of it, has more race problems than the USA, then you're utterly deluded or just a sh1t-stirrer!

Absolutely you do. Some of things that go on and are accepted at football matches make the most racist people in the US blush. The bar for racism is much lower in the US in what is and isn't accepted.



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Jumpin said:
revinit said:

Obama won 95% of the black vote and 75% of the hispanic vote. Proof that racism not only exists, but that racism is more of an issue among "non-whites".

Hell, I could run for president and not win 95% of my own family's vote!

I don’t follow. How is this proof of racism? Are you implying that black people only voted for being racist toward whites, and not because he was the best candidate for their current (horrible) situation in the US?

If Obama voting let's say is 55% on total population.... and 95% of blacks and 75% of latinos voted on him then there is certainly a very big discrepancy and possible bias that isn't only "he is the best candidate". When was the last time any candidate in USA had 95% of the votes in any election?



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DonFerrari said:

Dr.Henry_Killinger said:

The U.S is not inherently any more racist compared to other countries.

Rather, the United States has a history of trying to deal with uncomfortable things by pretending it doesn't exist. Pretending Racism doesn't exists exacerbates it. Combine this with the fact that the U.S is one of the most diverse nations on the planet, and the result is that there are more instances where diverse people interact and this suppressed racism can flare up.

In addition, Racism is not necessarily as tribalistic as most would argue it is. Rather it is used to justify institutionalized practices by appealing to the ego. For instance, consider Slavery, which on the surface seems motivated by Racism. As slavery is not unique to a specific "race", nearly every race has been enslaved at some time in history, a motivation of Racism isn't necessarily a justification.

Rather Racism served as, and can continue to serve as, a tool to justify immoral actions in pursuit of more concrete motivations. It is much easier to sugarcoat the pillaging and looting of valuable natural resources as "liberating the heart of darkness" and "bringing light and happiness to the savages".

You know that the more you talk about races and racism more conscious people are and keep it?

And reading OP would help.

I'm not sure how you would come to the conclusion that I did not read the OP as I am directly addressing it.

Here is the Original Post for Reference and the reference in my post addressing it in Bold:

LuccaCardoso1 said: 

I've been thinking about this for the last few days, but I couldn't get to a conclusion to why (most) people from the United States are so racist. Racism seems to be embedded in US's culture. I say that as a Brazilian that has already lived in the US and experiences the country's culture almost daily.

Addressed by First Sentence and second paragraph two some degree.


Brazil and the United States have very similar historical backgrounds. Both were inhabited by natives before the Europeans arrived in the first half of the 16th century and have a history of slavery, where in both countries it was abolished in the second half of the 19th century. Today, however, while Brazil is known for its miscegenation of natives, africans, europeans and asians, the United States seems to have mostly maintained the division that existed before the Emancipation Proclamation.

Addressed by third paragraph. Examples of explicit institutionalized  racism (US ONLY) following and undercurrent of general class-ism include: Jim Crow (Segregation), Internment Camps, Racial Profiling (Stop and Frisk), Tuskegee syphilis, Philando Castile (and related shootings). While determining if the latter is racial motivated can be primarily subjective, that distinction is meaningless when considered from the perspective of coming from the institution itself i.e training.

For example: In Brazil, there are no such things as "black neighborhoods". Yes, in some places some ethnicities are more prevalent (that has to do with the lack of support the government gave to the ex-slaves once slavery was abolished and the recency of that event), but no one thinks of these places as "where black people live". There are no words that can only be used by one ethnicity, such as the N word in English. Also, "white culture" and "black culture" aren't really a thing. While rap in the US is mostly viewed as black culture, in Brazil it's simply culture. Some of the most important samba and funk singers are black, but that doesn't mean it's black culture. We see it as Brazilian culture.

Also addressed by the third paragraph. Institutional effects cannot be reversed to a significant degree in a reasonable amount of time by simply removing the cause. It needs to be counteracted. For example, a zoning law that creates a minority ghetto being removed will not result in integration or diversification on its own. You might have a couple of people who pull themselves out of poverty and then observers will ignore the causes of the condition in the first place.

I don't know, Brazil just seems much more integrated and patriotic than the United States in that regard (yes, I just said the United States is not very patriotic in a way).

I'm not aware of Brazil's history or governmental structure, but it may be the case that since the US is a federation of states, that integration can be limited to each state's individual history, culture, and governance.

This also has nothing to do with Democrats and Republicans. It has nothing to do with left or right-wing. It affects both sides. You know, all of those BuzzFeed videos such as "White Parents Who Raise Black Children" or "Things Our Black Moms Would Say" only exist because they think of black and white people as being fundamentally and culturally different. In Brazil, a video titled "Things Our Black Moms Would Say" would make no sense, because being black has nothing to do with the way you act.

I'm not calling you racist for being American. You are not guilty for doing things the only way you know to do them. I'm just trying to show you a different vision of the world and hopefully make you reflect about it.

EDIT: In this text, I used the word "racism" meaning "the act of diving people into races". It was the best word I could find to describe it.

@DonFerrari If your suggesting that I did not read the OP because of this EDIT, do you not think it likely that the OP was edited after I posted.
Irregardless, "the act of dividing people into races" is simply categorization. It is recognizing the differences between people. Even race is just a social construct to describe a group of characteristics that people share. For instance, it is not racist to say people of Jewish Descent are more likely to get Cancer or even Black People tend to have lower than average IQs. 
Intent is what makes something racist, so in the latter example it is why you said such a thing (In this case, nearly every intent is racist, I personally can't think of a way other than here in this very post that isn't racist. [Intent is difficult to prove and subjective itself, so it could in fact be interpreted as racist anyway lol])
As a result, that categorization "the act of dividing people into races" is universal its not any more inherent in one country or another. You wouldn't even notice it to be able to describe it as racist unless that intent was behind it.

TL:DR: You are describing categorization for a lack of a better term, which is useful and necessary when describing a large subset of things. Noticing differences is natural, not racist. It is action as a result of that observation that describes an (intention/motivation) as racist. And this can be generalized to any us versus them behavior such as sexism, class-ism, caste systems (Advanced Class-ism), marxism, communism, age-ism, etc.

Racism is so noticeable in the US, for the same reason that Sexism is so widespread; people pretend like it doesn't exist.

 

Sweeping it under the rug doesn't resolve it for the myriad of reasons stated above such as the persistent effects and stereotypes, nor will it stop people from noticing differences. The fact that my skin is darker and that I can notice that difference is not racist or aberrant from normal human nature, its only when I make a judgement, action, or belief motivated by that difference that it can and usually is racist.



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Honestly, compared to most places in the world the US is probably one of the most tolerant places out there for people from different racial backgrounds. If a person who has a visibly different skin color than the majority population spent time in most of the countries in Africa, Asia, the middle-east I find it hard to imagine that they would be more accepted and embraced by the local population than a visible minority person would be in the US.

Is the US perfect in terms of racism? Probably not. But it is ludicrous to be holding the US up as an example of racism when we have political leaders in countries like South Africa who are openly saying that they want to confiscate property from and even kill their visible minority population. People need to get some perspective and get out of this comfortable bubble of self-shame and take a look at what the world is actually like. If more countries were like the US, the world would be a far better place.



Jumpin said:

After scanning the US using google maps, I think I might know some reasons for all the racism.
1. The US has no flowers, it’s just a lot of dry looking grass and all their plants look washed out, not green enough. Maybe too much pollution.
2. All the buildings, fences, and everything is so randomly/haphazardly placed. Nothing logically or stylistically goes together, like children did all the city planning. It doesn’t look comfortable to be anywhere in the US. No feng shui.
3. There is trash EVERYWHERE, even abandoned cars just sitting on grass off the side of random roads.
4. No bike lanes or foot paths, people probably getting hit by cars ALL the time.
5. There are virtually no road signs, how do you know where you are?
6. There are flags all over the place, the people have trouble remembering what country they are in.
7. The speed limits are VERY slow.

I think all these things must make Americans very angry, and that is why they have all the racism.

that's hilarious, especially #6. I always find it funny how obsessed the yanks are with their flag.



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Ka-pi96 said:
Jumpin said:

After scanning the US using google maps, I think I might know some reasons for all the racism.
1. The US has no flowers, it’s just a lot of dry looking grass and all their plants look washed out, not green enough. Maybe too much pollution.
2. All the buildings, fences, and everything is so randomly/haphazardly placed. Nothing logically or stylistically goes together, like children did all the city planning. It doesn’t look comfortable to be anywhere in the US. No feng shui.
3. There is trash EVERYWHERE, even abandoned cars just sitting on grass off the side of random roads.
4. No bike lanes or foot paths, people probably getting hit by cars ALL the time.
5. There are virtually no road signs, how do you know where you are?
6. There are flags all over the place, the people have trouble remembering what country they are in.
7. The speed limits are VERY slow.

I think all these things must make Americans very angry, and that is why they have all the racism.

that's hilarious, especially #6. I always find it funny how obsessed the yanks are with their flag.

You say this as if you don't have the Union Jack tattoo'd on your arse.



outlawauron said:
Ka-pi96 said:

that's hilarious, especially #6. I always find it funny how obsessed the yanks are with their flag.

You say this as if you don't have the Union Jack tattoo'd on your arse.

I don't... so yeah, that's exactly how I'm saying it



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I'm American. Ahem... I was born and raised in 'Merica, the greatest country in the world.

But to the point, I'm not sure where "America is racist" comes from. More racist than other countries? I don't know, but I would doubt it. I feel like people in America, if anything, may be more sensitive to things like "the N word", etcetera.

In the past decade or so, I've noticed an extreme movement towards acceptance of all groups: gays, transgenders, etcetera. Not sure if this is something specific to America or not, but just what I've noticed.

I was born and raised in Chicago, Illinois. I've never even left the country, so I can't say what other places in the world are like. I thought America was sort of the place where people from all over the world dream to be.

If someone walked up to me and we starting talking, I would refer to myself as Polish, even though you'd have to go 100 years back to find an ancestor of mine from Poland. Is America the only place where this conversation is a thing? I feel like people in Italy are Italian, people in China are Chinese, but people in America are all different things (being "American" isn't quite the full story).



Jumpin said:
revinit said:

 

Obama won 95% of the black vote and 75% of the hispanic vote. Proof that racism not only exists, but that racism is more of an issue among "non-whites".

Hell, I could run for president and not win 95% of my own family's vote!

 

I don’t follow. How is this proof of racism? Are you implying that black people only voted for being racist toward whites, and not because he was the best candidate for their current (horrible) situation in the US?

Exactly. More blacks voted in the Obama elections than at any time in history. And many voted for Obama SOLELY because he is black. I remember when Obama was running against McCain and there was a huge Obama rally held in Central Park, mostly attended by blacks. One of Howard Stern's news cronies was interviewing some of the attendees and asked dozens of them "How do you feel about Obama's running mate, Sarah Palin?" Not one of them knew that Palin wasn't running with Obama!

And if any US citizen is living in  "Horrible" conditions, it IS NOT BECAUSE OF THEIR SKIN COLOR!