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Google GDC Keynote Official Thread

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potato_hamster said:
RaptorChrist said:
This may kill consoles as we know it.

... you guys do realize this was the core of the Xbox One when it was first announced right?

"the power of the cloud", remember?

Yes.  But that was also a traditional console maker targeting traditional gamers, who were having none of it.  Stadia is going to be targeting non-traditional gamers or those who don't care about hardware.  Basically not most of any of us here.

Fast forward 15-20 years from now and I bet dedicated gaming hardware will be few and far between.

There are absolutely going be people who want to be able to play on any screen with zero restrictions and get the same performance everywhere and the same performance as the then game consoles.

As for pricing.  Could very well be the same prices we are paying now.  In other words same as buying PS+ or XBOX Live and buying the game on their stores.  Nothing more.

I will still be buying PS5 and PS6 (if that will exist).

Last edited by dharh - on 19 March 2019

A warrior keeps death on the mind from the moment of his first breath to the moment of his last.



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spemanig said:
potato_hamster said:

But that wasn't my argument at all. In the best case scenario it is as good as a console. In the worst case scenario it is unusable.

In both of those scenarios my PS4 or laptop, or Switch or whatever will still be able to play whatever games I like regardless of how spotty my internet connection is. I don't have to rely on an internet connection that for the majority of the world isn't as reliable, consistent or affordable as you're making it out to be. I don't care about concept, I care about real world applications. I've seen plenty of absolutely outstanding tech demos that totally fell on their fucking face in the real world. If you need some recent examples, see Titanfall's release and claims that the game wouldn't be possible "without the power of the cloud" or better yet, check out Microsoft's claims about UWA. That shit never panned out, but the tech demos sure looked impressive!

But, hey if you want to count on google and the internet totally for your gaming experiences, that's cool man. Just don't try and dunk on anyone that points out the downsides of that. There's plenty of very valid concerns when you look beyond the presentation and get into the meat of real world applications and issues that an average user will have to contend with that they will not have to contend with on a traditional piece of gaming hardware.

But, I mean, that certainly is your argument. Your next sentence revealed just that; in the best case scenario, it's not merely as "good as a console" - it's tremendously better than a console specifically and exclusively because it is not a console. In the worst case scenario, it's just as unusable as, for random example, a PS4 in an airport, a Switch in a small pocket, or a laptop when trying to have a 4K 60" screen.

In those hyper specific scenarios, the platforms are completely unusable as well, but it would be silly to present those as cataclysmic checkmates that prove why those platforms are not viable or less viable than platforms than can do what they can't. In most scenarios, most people have access to good enough internet for that specific con to not be an issue most of the time, and everything it can do to make up for that deficiency surpasses anything any current platform can do from a fundamentally conceptual level.

It's not just that it's so convenient and instantaneous to play, but that it also has power matching and possibly surpassing the rumored specs of next generation consoles with the ability to constantly improve computationally constantly and with not so much as a software update needed on the user's end, let alone a physical or financial change. It's that it's a platform that is fundamentally un-hackable because the software and hardware is never localized or centralized. It's the possibilities that having a platform where the the client and servers are not connected via the internet the way they must be on consoles, making the standard multiplayer experience not dependent on the client with the slowest connection because both the game client and server are localized to Google's networking backbone before hitting the internet. That fundamentally changes online multiplayer latency in a way that literally cannot be replicated via physical consoles due to the very nature of consoles. The list goes exceedingly on.

I understand having a wait and see attitude from tech demos and declarations. I don't think there's a single thing MS said about those games that "wouldn't be possible without the cloud" that actually exist in those games specifically because they just aren't using the tech. Stadia is different though because it's literally only cloud tech. There isn't anything else they can use but cloud tech.

I'm only ducking your "downsides" to the same degree that I would duck someone who purports the "downsides" of, again another random example, a PS4 in an airport, a Switch in a small pocket, or a laptop when trying to play have a 4K 60" screen. I guess not being able to play a PS4 in an airport is a "valid concern," but I don't think it's one "valid" enough to discount the tremendous utility of that very same PS4 in nearly every other relevant scenario, in which cases it currently potentially excels far better than any other platform that can actually be played at an airport.

The airport needn't be the hill you choose to die on is all I'm saying.

Tremendously better than a console? Well that remains to be seen, doesn't it? Look. In an ideal world with a steady, reliable, uncapped internet connection whereever you go, then sure, this might be able to offer a slightly worse gameplay experience than a PS4 or Xbox One. But that's not the case.

You can act like it's "no big deal" that wi-fi is still pretty shitty in many places no matter how urban, and cell is not only shittier, but often capped. But the only thing limiting me playing my Switch anywhere on the planet is the availability of a power outlet, and even then, it should be fine if one is an hour or two away. Stadia, on the otherhand, will offer a poorer single player experience if my wife decides to watch Netflix. It might not be playable at any time in any college dorm, or foreign military base. It certainly isn't usable in a place with no wi-fi or cell access, and well, that might not be an issue for you, but it will be for far, far more people than you imagine. These are real world issues that every day people experience every single day, Sure I might have brought up airports, but that's only because I recently went on a flight with a 4 hour layover, and totally gave up on trying to play an online race of mario kart because the connection was so shitty, so I stuck to single player gaming for the time I spent there. If I was relying on Stadia for my gaming experience I would have sat there, bored out of my trees - top that off with the experience I would have gotten while flying and that's a whopping 9 hours of game time I got in when I would have gotten nothing out of Stadia.

As for "only possible with the power of the cloud" it was collision detection/physics/intensive calculations that MS claimed required cloud-based processing in order to accomplish. As it turns out, they were either blowing smoke up everyone's asses, or they scaled back the game to not require it because you know, the Xbox one was no longer "always online". But as far as the presentation goes, it worked great! Just like Stadia...

I think I need to emphasize, I had this exact same conversation with people when the Xbox One was initially announced, and that was even less of an issue because it was a home console and internet is more reliable and accessable in homes than possibly anywhere else in someone's lives. The internet tore it to shreds, flat out rejected it, and Microsoft had to scramble to put that genie back in the bottle. Now a little over 5 years later, google is gambling that the gaming community has effectively pulled a 180 on the whole thing, and MS was simply "too early" with its gaming model. Well.. we're gonna see about that.

By all means, put all your eggs in the online-only streaming basket. Have fun with that experience you're convinced wouldn't be available anywhere else. But just remember every time that experience is hampered by a less than ideal internet connection that its a sacrifice you were willing to make, but didn't have to.



dharh said:
potato_hamster said:

... you guys do realize this was the core of the Xbox One when it was first announced right?

"the power of the cloud", remember?

Yes.  But that was also a traditional console maker targeting traditional gamers, who were having none of it.  Stadia is going to be targeting non-traditional gamers or those who don't care about hardware.  Basically not most of any of us here.

Fast forward 15-20 years from now and I bet dedicated gaming hardware will be few and far between.

There are absolutely going be people who want to be able to play on any screen with zero restrictions and get the same performance everywhere and the same performance as the then game consoles.

As for pricing.  Could very well be the same prices we are paying now.  In other words same as buying PS+ or XBOX Live and buying the game on their stores.  Nothing more.

I will still be buying PS5 and PS6 (if that will exist).

Maybe 15-20 years from now, and dedicated gaming hardware will be rare .... but maybe not. I've heard it all before, still there's just something about using a game controller on a dedicated game console on a TV that keeps people coming back, and I don't see that going away any time soon.



Wait, did someone say this is better than a console? Lol.



Random_Matt said:
Wait, did someone say this is better than a console? Lol.

With a good internet connection supposedly you could get more compute power than  PS4 Pro and XBox X combined. 



A warrior keeps death on the mind from the moment of his first breath to the moment of his last.



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A controller with Google home listening to you and a paid key logger in your browser
Am I the only one that feel like it is the perfect spy box ?



jenpol said:
A controller with Google home listening to you and a paid key logger in your browser
Am I the only one that feel like it is the perfect spy box ?

*Kinect flashbacks*

Not many people raised this issue but yes, you might be selling your privacy to Google even more than some of us might do right about now.



Switch Friend Code : 3905-6122-2909 

dharh said:
Random_Matt said:
Wait, did someone say this is better than a console? Lol.

With a good internet connection supposedly you could get more compute power than  PS4 Pro and XBox X combined. 

The problem are

1.It such a rare to find a stable condition even on a great ISP on high speed

2.Not all Internet model and ISP with high speed has a great ping and unlimited data caps

3.If it's subscription payment model , people who prefer own games they buy will not interested with this

4.Speed Internet connection is not a guarantee you have zero lag response , even on controllable condition there will be a lag.

5.PS5 and Xbox 2 will be more powerful and we don't know how powerful they will be if you think Stadia is better on spec. 



HollyGamer said:
dharh said:

With a good internet connection supposedly you could get more compute power than  PS4 Pro and XBox X combined. 

The problem are

1.It such a rare to find a stable condition even on a great ISP on high speed

2.Not all Internet model and ISP with high speed has a great ping and unlimited data caps

3.If it's subscription payment model , people who prefer own games they buy will not interested with this

4.Speed Internet connection is not a guarantee you have zero lag response , even on controllable condition there will be a lag.

5.PS5 and Xbox 2 will be more powerful and we don't know how powerful they will be if you think Stadia is better on spec. 

6. If google shuts down Stadia, your entire game library on that platform is no longer able to be played.



HollyGamer said:
dharh said:

With a good internet connection supposedly you could get more compute power than  PS4 Pro and XBox X combined. 

The problem are

1.It such a rare to find a stable condition even on a great ISP on high speed

2.Not all Internet model and ISP with high speed has a great ping and unlimited data caps

3.If it's subscription payment model , people who prefer own games they buy will not interested with this

4.Speed Internet connection is not a guarantee you have zero lag response , even on controllable condition there will be a lag.

5.PS5 and Xbox 2 will be more powerful and we don't know how powerful they will be if you think Stadia is better on spec. 

1. Is it really that rare?  I know I live in a college town, but i've been logged into the same DSL session for this entire year so far.

2. Sure.  I think this is going to be a slow ramp up and internet over wireless probably need not apply.

3. Agree also to this, so again its going to be on the outside to the core.  First it will be casuals and streamers/content creators, then less casual gamers, etc.  The last to fall will be us Physical only people.

4. Of course there will be lag, but their attempt to address this is probably one of the best i've seen, far better than what SONY came up with.  Also input lag is not necessarily important for all people or all games.  <100ms input lag will be enough for many people.

5.  I agree that comparing Stadia's current performance to those aging consoles is a bit much.  However, the rumored PS5 specs seem like something Stadia would easily be able to be on par with by the time of the rumored PS5 launch (2020).

potato_hamster said:
HollyGamer said:

The problem are

1.It such a rare to find a stable condition even on a great ISP on high speed

2.Not all Internet model and ISP with high speed has a great ping and unlimited data caps

3.If it's subscription payment model , people who prefer own games they buy will not interested with this

4.Speed Internet connection is not a guarantee you have zero lag response , even on controllable condition there will be a lag.

5.PS5 and Xbox 2 will be more powerful and we don't know how powerful they will be if you think Stadia is better on spec. 

6. If google shuts down Stadia, your entire game library on that platform is no longer able to be played.

6.  This is a problem already for any person who buys digitally.  Obviously it's much less likely that SONY just goes completely dead tomorrow and all your digital stuff poofs than it is for Google to abandon Stadia in two years like some predict.  However, I think they want to be in on this for the long haul.  Even if this were only just google play game apps on all devices everywhere it would still be a profit maker.  If they can pull off Triple A games everywhere and everyone but us diehards buy into it, it will be massive.

Last edited by dharh - on 19 March 2019

A warrior keeps death on the mind from the moment of his first breath to the moment of his last.