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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Update: Jade Raymond joins Google as Vice President | Rumor: Google's gaming console details leaked, possible controller design revealed via patent

OTBWY said:
Manlytears said:

Whit all due respect, the level of arrogance on this statement is just.... damn!!! You insist that offset is the best and symmetrical is wrong! Why not accept that both are good!? Why not accept that there are people that feel better whit symmetrical?

I even bring up the "claw technique" that, imho, is great for use on games like nioh, dark souls and monster Hunter, something that is impossible to do on Offset controller! Why can't you accept opinions that are different from yours? People here are accepting that Offset works well, and it's all about preferences, but you insist in saying symmetrical is bad and doens't work! Tha's very arrogant way to put things.

Excuse me? Why are you silent against the guy that basically said that defending anything other than symmetrical makes you a fanboy? 

His words:

"The truth is either will work just fine.  But, anyone who is actually anti-symmetry, symmetry being what are bodies are built off of, are just showing their blatant bias for a brand/company."

now, in a respectful way, let me tell you that he acknowledged that the xbox controller works well when he says "The truth is either will work just fine" and at no time he said that "defending anything other than symmetrical makes you a fanboy.",no, he said that "anyone who is actually anti-symmetry, symmetry being what are bodies are built off of, are just showing their blatant bias for a brand/company.". Note, there is no problem in preferring offset control, after all, "either will work fine", the situation is treated as a simple case of preference, something contrary to actively attacking symmetric control, that is, being anti-symmetric, to the point of speaking that "the dualshock gets to most uncomfortable when play long hours on end." You can not deny that, and people who read this know it, but are not willing to admit it. "

Can you see the difference? He affirms his preference for symmetric, adimite that both are good and says attacks against symmetrical controls are a fanboy behavior, this is reasonable and I have nothing to say against it. On the other hand, you say that the control of xbox is better, and that everyone reading your message knows this "truth" but is not willing to admit the "truth"! These are rather arrogant words, and it's almost like calling anyone who disagrees with them hypocrites, and that is why i called you.

Last edited by Manlytears - on 11 March 2019

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shikamaru317 said:
DonFerrari said:

Considering the good/great 3rd party devs that would accept being bought by Google, considering it takes several years to develop a new game (so look at how long each of them haven't revealed a game in a platform on the last 2 or 3 years), how many devs would they have to show for? I guess not many if any. Much more likely they'll moneyhat ports.

Depends really. Games usually aren't announced until they're at least 50% done (except of course for Square Enix, lol). If they bought studios that have unannounced, mostly finished games and bought the game from the publisher as well, they could have some 1st party stuff ready for the first year of the consoles life possibly. But yeah, it does seem more likely that they will moneyhat some 3rd party exclusives like these rumored Sega games to fill in the gaps until they can build up a decent 1st party a couple of years into the generation. 

As for potential AAA devs they could be looking to buy, I wouldn't be surprised if they have been in discussions with some of the same studios that Microsoft is rumored to be in discussions with, like Turtle Rock, 4A, and IO Interactive. Another possibility for them would be Crytek, as that would also give them access to an engine they could use for their 1st party games without paying 10% royalties to use Unreal 4. 

Yes I agree there may be some unnanounced games that could be launched in 1-2 years, but I wouldn't say those are many and from big devs.

And we have agreed that is more likely that most will be port purchase (and sure they may also buy some timed exclusive) with a few old ip revival (wouldn't expect AAA level on those so they can make more quantity) there isn't much for us to discuss. I actually likes the idea of more players trying their hand and expanding the market.

JEMC said:
DonFerrari said:

First year or 2 they should really be open to paying full port cost of the game and some profit for the devs. As if they were the publisher. Then whatever sells is their. Until devs and pubs are confident enough they can release by themselves on a steady rhythm.

Agree.

The question, if those rumors are true, is that while those ports could be "easy" and kind of cheap nowadays with a console more powerful than any of the others, that will change next year when the PS5 and XboxWhatever come with better specs. Will Google's console have sold enough consoles by then to make it a worth investment for publishers? We'll see.

Let's hope Google isn't dumb and the VP doesn't make the same mistakes he did before so they make something on the same ballpark of PS5 and X2 so they can have good time on porting.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

shikamaru317 said:
Mar1217 said:

Bold of you to assume streaming will ever take over traditional consoles. Not even mentionning that other meanings of playing our games could happen first or be more conveniant.

It's not certain, but it does seem likely to me (and I've seen gaming analysts say the same). It won't happen soon for sure, the internet infrastructure isn't there yet even in many 1st world countries including the US, let alone developing markets, but I do think it will eventually become the main way to play games once the countries find a way to get high speed internet to rural areas (possibly white space internet or super Wi-Fi will do the trick). Will traditional consoles/handhelds die entirely? I doubt it, at the very least Nintendo should keep that flame burning, but I do think streaming will surpass consoles eventually, just like movie streaming surpassed Blu-Ray. 

It will take 10 years at least before game streaming really takes off.



DonFerrari said:
JEMC said:

Agree.

The question, if those rumors are true, is that while those ports could be "easy" and kind of cheap nowadays with a console more powerful than any of the others, that will change next year when the PS5 and XboxWhatever come with better specs. Will Google's console have sold enough consoles by then to make it a worth investment for publishers? We'll see.

Let's hope Google isn't dumb and the VP doesn't make the same mistakes he did before so they make something on the same ballpark of PS5 and X2 so they can have good time on porting.

On this thread it's been said that the rumor is that this console will be "more powerful than XboxOneX". Whether that means just that or that it will be in the ballpark of PS5/X2, it remains to be seen.

In any case, they won't survive with only multiplatform games so they need to start hunting for dev. studios or exclusives, specially if they plan to launch the console soon (in the next 12-18 months or so).



Please excuse my bad English.

Currently gaming on a PC with an i5-4670k@stock (for now), 16Gb RAM 1600 MHz and a GTX 1070

Steam / Live / NNID : jonxiquet    Add me if you want, but I'm a single player gamer.

 

JEMC said:
DonFerrari said:

Let's hope Google isn't dumb and the VP doesn't make the same mistakes he did before so they make something on the same ballpark of PS5 and X2 so they can have good time on porting.

On this thread it's been said that the rumor is that this console will be "more powerful than XboxOneX". Whether that means just that or that it will be in the ballpark of PS5/X2, it remains to be seen.

In any case, they won't survive with only multiplatform games so they need to start hunting for dev. studios or exclusives, specially if they plan to launch the console soon (in the next 12-18 months or so).

They can survive with little to no exclusives if they have good power and price, they still don't have a name for anyone to care about new IPS exclusive to them.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

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DonFerrari said:

If you think someone is trolling make a report.

Do you have evidence that Sony didn't patent the design of the controllers? Because you are saying he is lying, you probably can prove it right?

You may have a patent and not sue small companies that break your patent, can also license it to partners. On the cartridge we are plenty sure it wasn't due to patent in cartridge because not only there were cartridges before Nintendo entered console but also Sony used CD (won't enter the quality discussion) because that was what they were working with Nintendo before the deal died.

If you think it isn't important why did you brought it up? I gave reasons why it likely isn't a copy based on the success of N64 as you claimed.

I have all consoles from Sega, X360, will complete my Nintendo consoles with Switch this year. I certainly favor Sony and call accept myself as a fanboy (although I wouldn't call or ask someone is a fanboy over here). I don't avoid Nintendo, I play several of their games, just not my favorites. Not sure what this have to do with the point.

If you want a reason for the reply besides you bringing the point, would be that in this forum is quite common to have claims that Sony only copies Nintendo all the time.

We are on separate pages here, as I think you misunderstood a couple of my points. The whole thing about the patent was that it was a red herring. It was pretty much stated that "the reason other companies don't have a symmetrical layout is because of Sony's patent". Do you get what I'm saying? Clearly, Sony's patent has nothing to do with why other companies don't have that layout, or do you disagree? I hope you realize this will become very awkward if/when Sony eventually releases a controller with a traditional analog layout.

I consider myself to be very good at reading the intentions of people, and that's why I said "I'm calling you out" to that poster. It's not important to me whether or not N64 was the influencer or not, but it does trigger me a little bit to see people who *are* bothered about it. ... And, you did state that you are a "fanboy", so it leads me to believe that if Sony had offset sticks from the start and other companies used a symmetrical layout, you would have a tendency towards offset. If that's the case, then it's kind of pointless, right?

I've read a lot of your posts on here and we've had impactful discussions. I even got GT Sport due to your recommendation when I bought my PSVR. I think you have a great mind and a great way of conveying your ideas, so I'm not sure if you intentionally misrepresented what I said or if I'm still being unclear (not trying to sound rude). No hard feelings.



RaptorChrist said:
DonFerrari said:

If you think someone is trolling make a report.

Do you have evidence that Sony didn't patent the design of the controllers? Because you are saying he is lying, you probably can prove it right?

You may have a patent and not sue small companies that break your patent, can also license it to partners. On the cartridge we are plenty sure it wasn't due to patent in cartridge because not only there were cartridges before Nintendo entered console but also Sony used CD (won't enter the quality discussion) because that was what they were working with Nintendo before the deal died.

If you think it isn't important why did you brought it up? I gave reasons why it likely isn't a copy based on the success of N64 as you claimed.

I have all consoles from Sega, X360, will complete my Nintendo consoles with Switch this year. I certainly favor Sony and call accept myself as a fanboy (although I wouldn't call or ask someone is a fanboy over here). I don't avoid Nintendo, I play several of their games, just not my favorites. Not sure what this have to do with the point.

If you want a reason for the reply besides you bringing the point, would be that in this forum is quite common to have claims that Sony only copies Nintendo all the time.

We are on separate pages here, as I think you misunderstood a couple of my points. The whole thing about the patent was that it was a red herring. It was pretty much stated that "the reason other companies don't have a symmetrical layout is because of Sony's patent". Do you get what I'm saying? Clearly, Sony's patent has nothing to do with why other companies don't have that layout, or do you disagree? I hope you realize this will become very awkward if/when Sony eventually releases a controller with a traditional analog layout.

I consider myself to be very good at reading the intentions of people, and that's why I said "I'm calling you out" to that poster. It's not important to me whether or not N64 was the influencer or not, but it does trigger me a little bit to see people who *are* bothered about it. ... And, you did state that you are a "fanboy", so it leads me to believe that if Sony had offset sticks from the start and other companies used a symmetrical layout, you would have a tendency towards offset. If that's the case, then it's kind of pointless, right?

I've read a lot of your posts on here and we've had impactful discussions. I even got GT Sport due to your recommendation when I bought my PSVR. I think you have a great mind and a great way of conveying your ideas, so I'm not sure if you intentionally misrepresented what I said or if I'm still being unclear (not trying to sound rude). No hard feelings.

So for your first point you would like us to believe that the reason only Sony uses symmetrical is because all other know it is inferior?

You can consider yourself to be a good judge of character, but that is hardly important or can be verifiable. You may have not seem in his post and others that commented upon it, where he says both are valid and ok to use, he preffers symmetrical and that to say it is inferior is due to bias. Basically you are attacking a point that wasn't made.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari said:
RaptorChrist said:

We are on separate pages here, as I think you misunderstood a couple of my points. The whole thing about the patent was that it was a red herring. It was pretty much stated that "the reason other companies don't have a symmetrical layout is because of Sony's patent". Do you get what I'm saying? Clearly, Sony's patent has nothing to do with why other companies don't have that layout, or do you disagree? I hope you realize this will become very awkward if/when Sony eventually releases a controller with a traditional analog layout.

I consider myself to be very good at reading the intentions of people, and that's why I said "I'm calling you out" to that poster. It's not important to me whether or not N64 was the influencer or not, but it does trigger me a little bit to see people who *are* bothered about it. ... And, you did state that you are a "fanboy", so it leads me to believe that if Sony had offset sticks from the start and other companies used a symmetrical layout, you would have a tendency towards offset. If that's the case, then it's kind of pointless, right?

I've read a lot of your posts on here and we've had impactful discussions. I even got GT Sport due to your recommendation when I bought my PSVR. I think you have a great mind and a great way of conveying your ideas, so I'm not sure if you intentionally misrepresented what I said or if I'm still being unclear (not trying to sound rude). No hard feelings.

So for your first point you would like us to believe that the reason only Sony uses symmetrical is because all other know it is inferior?

You can consider yourself to be a good judge of character, but that is hardly important or can be verifiable. You may have not seem in his post and others that commented upon it, where he says both are valid and ok to use, he preffers symmetrical and that to say it is inferior is due to bias. Basically you are attacking a point that wasn't made.

Perhaps there is a language barrier here. I checked your profile and saw that you are from Brazil, so I wonder if maybe Spanish is your native language, and English is secondary?

If so, then I want to clarify something, because you are kind of sort of understanding my point (it's a little funny actually because you had the same reaction I did at first regarding the accusation). Offset versus symmetrical is a preference. Neither is definitively superior or inferior. What you just accused me of is exactly the same as what I was accusing the other poster of in the first place.

PS. You are coming off as a little bit rude. If I've said something to bother you, then I apologize.



DonFerrari said:
JEMC said:

On this thread it's been said that the rumor is that this console will be "more powerful than XboxOneX". Whether that means just that or that it will be in the ballpark of PS5/X2, it remains to be seen.

In any case, they won't survive with only multiplatform games so they need to start hunting for dev. studios or exclusives, specially if they plan to launch the console soon (in the next 12-18 months or so).

They can survive with little to no exclusives if they have good power and price, they still don't have a name for anyone to care about new IPS exclusive to them.

As it has been proven several times, power only matters to a certain extent. And given that Sony and Microsoft (Nintendo goes their own route) will have all or almost all the multiplat games plus their own exclusives, to survive and have some success without exclusives, Google's console would have to be a whole lot cheaper.



Please excuse my bad English.

Currently gaming on a PC with an i5-4670k@stock (for now), 16Gb RAM 1600 MHz and a GTX 1070

Steam / Live / NNID : jonxiquet    Add me if you want, but I'm a single player gamer.

OTBWY said:

Sorry but that is some janky logic. In the 3D era, our left stick is the primary control option for movement. You thumb should be on it most of the time. But because how it was placed on the PS controller, was due to keeping with the formfactor, not because they thought it was super clever. Many games on the PS1 still used the d-pad prominently cause you know, the PS! first came with a controller with no sticks. We however came to find out that offset works best because we developed upon already great left thumb stick up controllers. The camera movement in all this is secondary, as many games still have facebuttons as primary controls (meaning it should be level with your left stick). The only way you can make the argument that the left and both right stick are primary is if you are talking about fps games, which in all honesty is an inferior experience on console anyway, but the dualshock makes it all the more uncomfortable with the wide reach of your thumb and your index fingers on the triggers, hence crabclaw.

This should be etched in stone because truer words have never been spoken.