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Forums - Sony Discussion - PSX not happening this year

Cerebralbore101 said:
thismeintiel said:

Still seeing "no way the PS5 hits in 2019, cause the PS4 is doing good and new game releases" comments.  I'm going to repost a section of a past post.

3rd party PS1 releases in 2000, the year the PS2 launched - Vagrant Story, NFS: Porche Unleashed, The Misadventures of Tron Bonne (Mega Man Legends spinoff), MK:SF, Threads of Fate, Strider 2, Chrono Cross, DQ VII, Spider-Man, TH's Pro Skater 2, Vampire Hunter D, Destruction Derby Raw, Donald Duck: GQ, Mega Man Legends 2, Capcom vs SNK: M 2000, Incredible Crisis, The World Is Not Enough, FFIX, The Emperor's New Groove, TR Chronicles, 007 Racing, Batman Beyond: ROTJ, Harvest Moon, Disney's Aladdin: NR, Evil Dead: HTTK,

Sony PS1 releases in 2000 - Wild Arms 2, Spyro: YOTD, Crash Bash

The PS1 also sold ~21M in 1999, the year before the PS2 launched.

Notable 3rd party PS2 releases in 2005, the year the PS3 was originally going to launch, and 2006 - Mercenaries: POD, Shadow of Rome, Xenosaga Ep II, FIFA Street, Tekken 5, Fight Night Rnd 2, DMC 3, MX vs ATV Unleashed, Timesplitters: FP, Dynasty Warriors 5, Splinter Cell: CT, Lego SW, Midnight Club 3, Psychonauts, Burnout Revenge, MK:SM, Indigo Prophecy, RE4, Soul Calibur 3, COD 2, SW Battlefront 2, Guitar Hero, NFS: MW, DQ VIII, Drakengard 2, MGS3: S, FFXII, KH 2, TR: Legends, Jaws Unleashed, Hitman: BM, DOC: FFVII, Disgaea 2, Xenosaga Ep III, Lego SW 2, Okami, Just Cause, Scarface, MK:A, Spyro: ANB, Bully, NFS:C, COD 3, Guitar Hero 2, TH Project 8

Sony PS2 releases in 2005 and 2006 - The Getaway: BM, MLB 2006, GOW, Rise of Kasai, Genji: DOTS, Sly 3, SOCOM 3, Jak X:CR, SOTC, Ratchet: Deadlocked, Ape Escape 3, Siren 2, MLB 06, SOCOM: CA, Ape Escape: MM

The PS2 also sold ~20M in 2005, the year before the PS3 launched.

Notable 3rd party PS3 releases in 2013, the year the PS4 launched - DmC, Ni no Kuni, Dead Space 3, Crysis 3, MG Rising, TR, Bioshock: I, Injustice, Dragon's Dogma: DA, Metro: LL, Grid 2, Deadpool, Dynasty Warriors 8, Dragon's Crown, Saint's Row IV, Splinter Cell: BL, FF XIV, Diablo 3, Rayman Legends, GTA V, Disgaea D2, Lego Marvel, Batman: AO, AC IV: BF, BF4, COD: Ghosts, XCOM, NFS: Rivals, Minecraft, TWD: S2

Sony PS3 releases in 2013 - Sly Cooper: TIT, MLB 13, GOW: A, TLOU, Puppeteer, Rain, Beyond: TS, R&C: ITN, GT6

Now, the sales argument doesn't quite work for PS3, as sales were starting to decline due to the length of the gen.  Though, using VGC's estimated sell-through of 13M+, we can guess shipments were still a respectable ~15M in 2012.

 

The point is, neither of those factors mean anything when it comes to when a console's predecessor will launch.  When an affordable chipset is developed/available that gives a generational jump, they will jump on it as soon as possible.  Sony usually waits 5-6 years before jumping, which 2019 would be 6 years.  They also have been working with Ryzen CPUs, which is obviously going into the PS5, definitely a generational leap.  And rumor has it Navi has been co-developed with, or at least made to meet requirements from, Sony.  Meaning that is what the PS5 will have.  Now, it will be possible that things don't go perfectly as planned and Sony has to wait until 2020 to launch.  However, I think if things actually do go according to plan, we will see a PS5 in late 2019.  They definitely want to strike while they are hot, while not giving MS a possible year headstart.

The only big-gun title that Sony released in 2000 for PS1 was Spyro. Insomniac has always been an independent studio though, so Sony had no control over when Spyro YotD released. 

We are talking about how Sony can't release a next gen console in 2019, because there are still so many big Sony developed or published 2019 PS4 games to come out. So including games from 2005 as part of the argument doesn't work. I can't think of a single heavy hitter game published by Sony in 2006 for the PS2. 

For 2013 PS3 just got TLoU for a big name game, developed or published by Sony. 

PS3 was around for seven years, and that's without a mid-gen refresh. PS4 should also be a seven year system, especially because the Pro exists. Sony doesn't care one bit about MS right now. They've crushed MS this gen, and have enough big exclusive developers to crush them for years to come. Even with 360 launching a year ahead, Sony still waited to put out PS3. PS1 and PS2 both had six years until the following system, but that was in a different era of tech. 

MS doesn't want to launch in 2019 because they already have the XB1X, that came out late 2017. 

SIE was a much smaller company back then, so it stands to reason they wouldn't be pushing as much then.  And including 2005 absolutely works because Sony was going to absolutely launch in 2005.  Unfortunately, they hit a snag in using two Cells (one as CPU and one as GPU), so they had to delay it a year to test a more conventional GPU solution.  Had they not hit that snag, those games would have launched the same year as the PS3.  And 5 big games next year doesn't mean much more when some, or all, could easily be made cross-gen, versus the 3 big games that launched exclusively for the PS3 in 2013.

And MS is ready to leave this gen behind.  The are going to fail to sell even half of what the PS4 will.  It's not like the XBO X sales are anything to write home about.  They obviously are pushing hard for next gen, with all of the game companies they acquired lately.  Hell, they even announced they have a next gen system on the way in June.  I doubt they announced that, just to have people waiting around for another 2 1/2 years for the next Xbox.



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If there isn't anything to show, there isn't anything.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

thismeintiel said:

Still seeing "no way the PS5 hits in 2019, cause the PS4 is doing good and new game releases" comments.  I'm going to repost a section of a past post.

3rd party PS1 releases in 2000, the year the PS2 launched - Vagrant Story, NFS: Porche Unleashed, The Misadventures of Tron Bonne (Mega Man Legends spinoff), MK:SF, Threads of Fate, Strider 2, Chrono Cross, DQ VII, Spider-Man, TH's Pro Skater 2, Vampire Hunter D, Destruction Derby Raw, Donald Duck: GQ, Mega Man Legends 2, Capcom vs SNK: M 2000, Incredible Crisis, The World Is Not Enough, FFIX, The Emperor's New Groove, TR Chronicles, 007 Racing, Batman Beyond: ROTJ, Harvest Moon, Disney's Aladdin: NR, Evil Dead: HTTK,

Sony PS1 releases in 2000 - Wild Arms 2, Spyro: YOTD, Crash Bash

The PS1 also sold ~21M in 1999, the year before the PS2 launched.

Notable 3rd party PS2 releases in 2005, the year the PS3 was originally going to launch, and 2006 - Mercenaries: POD, Shadow of Rome, Xenosaga Ep II, FIFA Street, Tekken 5, Fight Night Rnd 2, DMC 3, MX vs ATV Unleashed, Timesplitters: FP, Dynasty Warriors 5, Splinter Cell: CT, Lego SW, Midnight Club 3, Psychonauts, Burnout Revenge, MK:SM, Indigo Prophecy, RE4, Soul Calibur 3, COD 2, SW Battlefront 2, Guitar Hero, NFS: MW, DQ VIII, Drakengard 2, MGS3: S, FFXII, KH 2, TR: Legends, Jaws Unleashed, Hitman: BM, DOC: FFVII, Disgaea 2, Xenosaga Ep III, Lego SW 2, Okami, Just Cause, Scarface, MK:A, Spyro: ANB, Bully, NFS:C, COD 3, Guitar Hero 2, TH Project 8

Sony PS2 releases in 2005 and 2006 - The Getaway: BM, MLB 2006, GOW, Rise of Kasai, Genji: DOTS, Sly 3, SOCOM 3, Jak X:CR, SOTC, Ratchet: Deadlocked, Ape Escape 3, Siren 2, MLB 06, SOCOM: CA, Ape Escape: MM

The PS2 also sold ~20M in 2005, the year before the PS3 launched.

Notable 3rd party PS3 releases in 2013, the year the PS4 launched - DmC, Ni no Kuni, Dead Space 3, Crysis 3, MG Rising, TR, Bioshock: I, Injustice, Dragon's Dogma: DA, Metro: LL, Grid 2, Deadpool, Dynasty Warriors 8, Dragon's Crown, Saint's Row IV, Splinter Cell: BL, FF XIV, Diablo 3, Rayman Legends, GTA V, Disgaea D2, Lego Marvel, Batman: AO, AC IV: BF, BF4, COD: Ghosts, XCOM, NFS: Rivals, Minecraft, TWD: S2

Sony PS3 releases in 2013 - Sly Cooper: TIT, MLB 13, GOW: A, TLOU, Puppeteer, Rain, Beyond: TS, R&C: ITN, GT6

Now, the sales argument doesn't quite work for PS3, as sales were starting to decline due to the length of the gen.  Though, using VGC's estimated sell-through of 13M+, we can guess shipments were still a respectable ~15M in 2012.

 

The point is, neither of those factors mean anything when it comes to when a console's predecessor will launch.  When an affordable chipset is developed/available that gives a generational jump, they will jump on it as soon as possible.  Sony usually waits 5-6 years before jumping, which 2019 would be 6 years.  They also have been working with Ryzen CPUs, which is obviously going into the PS5, definitely a generational leap.  And rumor has it Navi has been co-developed with, or at least made to meet requirements from, Sony.  Meaning that is what the PS5 will have.  Now, it will be possible that things don't go perfectly as planned and Sony has to wait until 2020 to launch.  However, I think if things actually do go according to plan, we will see a PS5 in late 2019.  They definitely want to strike while they are hot, while not giving MS a possible year headstart.

Reading from the insiders over at resetera, 2019 release is still unlikely. I'm hoping ps5 is out in 2019 but we just got too few rumors for it to be likely.

Sony still has 4 big games to be released for ps4. Death stranding, The last of us 2, death of tsunami and days gone. It's enough and can keep ps4 alive intil q3-q4 2020. We also might see a ps4 slim next year too with a 50$ price cut.

What you think?

 

Edit:

If anyone is interested in the posts I will link here

(post 6869)

https://www.resetera.com/threads/ps5-and-next-xbox-launch-speculation-post-e3-2018.49214/page-138

 

(post 7005)

https://www.resetera.com/threads/ps5-and-next-xbox-launch-speculation-post-e3-2018.49214/page-141

 

(post 5957)

https://www.resetera.com/threads/ps5-and-next-xbox-launch-speculation-post-e3-2018.49214/page-120

About Matt the insider, he has mention Ps5 will be BC with ps4 and sony is working on improving the current ps4 games for ps5. I got no clue if this is just sonys first-party or every game. He also agreed in a neogaf post with Michael Pachter that Ps4 pro was a half-step and Ps5 will be another half-step so don't expect any crazy specs for ps5.

Last edited by Trumpstyle - on 30 September 2018

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I don't think it should happen any year.

If Sony didn't show so much at PSX/VGAS and other conferences they would have more hype coming out of E3, which is what going to give their games the biggest visibility.



Cerebralbore101 said:
taus90 said:

OK so you are just going to Ignore God of war Ascension, and Gran Turismo 6 and go with An unproven new IP The Last Of Us which was not big name game before its release, nobody new how it would turn out as it was ND first game away from 3 uncharted games. So technically there were 2 big First party games for 2013 and an unknown new IP from ND.

My bad. I thought GoW Ascension was a port of a PSP game.  Naughty Dog had a very long track record of producing excellent games at that point. Gran Turismo 6 is fine too. But that's still only three games versus 5 (Dreams, Death Stranding, Ghost of Tushima, Days Gone, TLoU2). I just don't see them releasing PS5 in 2019 with so many PS4 games still in the pipeline. 

but still it is was a New IP back then.. I remember people were downplaying how much fed up everyone was of zombie games! then there was BEYOND TWO Souls which was in similar position to Death Stranding (movie star and all) , then Sony Japan's Puppeteer (not a AAA, but still) and also you have to remember at that time Sony first party was also making games for PSVita and in 2013 we got Tearaway, Killzone Mercenaries, souls Sacrifice its just that in 2013 Sony's First party resources were split between 3 systems Ps3, PSV and PS4. 

You have to also factor in that two games on PS4 list Delayed  Days Gone and DREAMS both of them should have been out by now especially Dreams!  Also back in 2013 if both of these studios weren't working on PSvita then PS3 2013 exclusive would have been even bigger. Not to mention Sony First Party studios output on PS4 completely dwarfs in comparison to PS3 offerings. Even If we look at TLoU2 it should have been out by now, but neil and bruce had to jump on board for UC4 as amy henning left the project mid way so they had to put TLOU2 on hold.

In 7 years PS3 vs PS4

Naughty Dog = 4 vs 2

Sucker Punch = 2 vs 2

Guerrilla Games = 2 vs 3

Polphony = 2 vs 1

SSM = 2 vs 1 (also helped produce and co-develop many games during PS3)

Media Molecule 3 vs 0

Bend = 1 vs 1

Evolution (RIP) = 4 vs 1

countless of Sony Japan games vs 3

Sorry to go off topic but my point is the reason we are seeing these AAA exclusive pile up at this juncture of PS4 life cycle is combination of A. Restructuring of WWS, project cancelled, studio's closed and B. Only one system to develop for.



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Kyuu said:
Mr Puggsly said:

Uhm... cross gen doesn't mean its being held back per se. Because better specs could allow for huge improvements.

I mean just look at Spiderman. That same game could be tweaked for PS5 and look great. Higher quality textures, 60 fps, 4K, and other tweaks would make for a great looking 9th gen product.

That's kinda what Battlefield 4 was at launch. You had a game functioned on 7th gen very well, but 8th gen took it to the next level.

In fact, the Xbox One X is demonstrating that now. The GPU power in that device is a generational leap. The end result is significantly more polished games.

X1X improving X1 games to a notable degree is all the more reason why cross-gen games are completely unneeded this time. Sony should keep TLoU2 a PS4 title and simply patch it up to PS5 specs (If it's backward compatible.)

That being said, cross-gen games, typical (lazy) remasters, and patched games don't offer anything substantially above what the base game has to offer, especially in terms of design, mechanics, and visuals. TLoU vs TLoUR, MGSV PS3 vs PS4, Tomb Raider X1 vs X1X, and even Destiny PS3 vs PS4, the differences between those weren't remotely close to generational. Hell, in most cases they're resolution/performance buffs and little else (it isn't financially viable to fully optimize/re-engineer one game on multiple platforms of varying specs. The few exceptions include Ni no Kuni 1 and Dragon Quest XI which both probably didn't cost much to make on DS/3DS). If PS4 Pro is treated as a lowest common denominator, PS4-Pro exclusives (shared with PS5 via the misleading "forward compatibility") won't visually -maybe not even structurally- be close to the hypothetical PS5-Exclusive form of the same game (designed from the ground up specifically for PS5) With the CPU jump considered, we're talking TLoUR vs TLoU2 level of difference.


I wouldn't criticize MS for supposedly making X1X forward compatible since unlike Sony, they've never been clear about what the system exactly represents. Consumers bought or skipped it with that mystery in mind, so they'd only have themselves to blame if they end up disappointed of MS taking it to an undesirable direction. Furthermore, the X1X is not as weak as PS4P, so making it the lowest common denominator for a few years won't be quite as bad.

Your first sentence negates an obvious argument. Even though the X1X improves games, there is still room for improvement that 9th gen hardware can deliver. Generally the X1X does improve visuals and performance, but there is still compromise. For example, the X1X has many games still doing 30 fps or compromising resolution to achieve 60 fps.

MGSV, RotTR and Destiny have a big visual disparity between generational hardware. Primarily due to textures, higher quality effects, better draw distance, massive disparity in resolution, and of course the silky smooth 60 fps of MGSV.

I've been playing some Halo games recently. The disparity of Halo 4 between generations is huge even without touching the assets. The resolution, improved graphics settings, and 60 fps makes it the definitive experience. With improved textures it could have looked like a game made for X1, its a shame they didn't create higher quality assets for a future port.

Lastly and the best example, just look look at PC games primarily late in the 7th gen. Games like Crysis 2/3, Far Cry 3/4, and Battlefield 3/4 are all examples of games that were built primarily for PC and had great looking assets to take advantage of modern PC specs. Playing those games on 7th vs PC was essentially a generational leap. That's because high quality assets existed for PC specs, while the engine was also designed to scale back for lower quality specs. That's how cross gen games should be designed then scale it back for other platforms. That's essentially what Switch is getting right now, scaled back ports of games built for better specs.

Hence, just because a game is built to work on older specs doesn't mean there isn't room for huge room for improvements that 9th gen specs can provide.

Last edited by Mr Puggsly - on 01 October 2018

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