Puppyroach said: Why should you believe President Trump, when it seems both Bush and Obama made false statements during their precidencies? Since you are doing false equivalencies, why not be consistent atleast? 🙂

We have been down this road with Iraq WMDs.

BOTH parties (not just Bush) said Saddam had WMDs.

Hell, Bill Clinton BOMBED Iraq MULTIPLE times throughout the 1990s because of Saddam's WMDs. Bill Clinton's Iraq Resolution Act of 1998 was actually used as justification for the invasion.

The Establishment clearly doesn't want to Trump to win, so they made up election interference. If Trump lost, would we be hearing anything about this?

What do you think of Robert Mueller saying Iraq had WMDs?

Was Robert Mueller lying then? Or is he lying now?

Why should I believe YOU'RE telling the truth, but not the Bush Administration about Iraq WMDs? Give me a good explanation why you're so much more reliable than Iraq WMD intelligence.

McDonaldsGuy said: Puppyroach said: Why should you believe President Trump, when it seems both Bush and Obama made false statements during their precidencies? Since you are doing false equivalencies, why not be consistent atleast? 🙂 We have been down this road with Iraq WMDs. BOTH parties (not just Bush) said Saddam had WMDs. Hell, Bill Clinton BOMBED Iraq MULTIPLE times throughout the 1990s because of Saddam's WMDs. Bill Clinton's Iraq Resolution Act of 1998 was actually used as justification for the invasion. The Establishment clearly doesn't want to Trump to win, so they made up election interference. If Trump lost, would we be hearing anything about this? What do you think of Robert Mueller saying Iraq had WMDs?   Was Robert Mueller lying then? Or is he lying now? Why should I believe YOU'RE telling the truth, but not the Bush Administration about Iraq WMDs? Give me a good explanation why you're so much more reliable than Iraq WMD intelligence.

Bruh, I already told you that all major Western intelligence community warned US of Russia and Trump connection. At different times as well.

I guess you never read that Iraq was using WMDs on the Curds in 1988.

The establishment of Republican donors helped Trump get where he is. Trump cabinet is full of Koch operatives and Goldman Sachs Alums, how much more Establishment does it get? That cabinet is basically Bayou.

Goatseye said: Bruh, I already told you that all major Western intelligence community warned US of Russia and Trump connection. At different times as well. I guess you never read that Iraq was using WMDs on the Curds in 1988. The establishment of Republican donors helped Trump get where he is. Trump cabinet is full of Koch operatives and Goldman Sachs Alums, how much more Establishment does it get? That cabinet is basically Bayou.

"Trump and Russian connection"

Proof? Where is the proof of this connection?

Where is the proof Russia hacked the DNC or Podesta?

5 years ago, you told me Russia was our best friend and Romney was an idiot for saying they were our number 1 geopolitical foe. Whatever the Establishment tells you, you will believe. Just like with Iraq WMDs.

McDonaldsGuy said: Goatseye said: Bruh, I already told you that all major Western intelligence community warned US of Russia and Trump connection. At different times as well. I guess you never read that Iraq was using WMDs on the Curds in 1988. The establishment of Republican donors helped Trump get where he is. Trump cabinet is full of Koch operatives and Goldman Sachs Alums, how much more Establishment does it get? That cabinet is basically Bayou. "Trump and Russian connection" Proof? Where is the proof of this connection? Where is the proof Russia hacked the DNC? 5 years ago, you told me Russia was our best friend and Romney was an idiot for saying they were our number 1 geopolitical foe. Whatever the Establishment tells you, you will believe.

Goat hasn't even been on the site for 5 years though.

VGPolyglot said: McDonaldsGuy said: "Trump and Russian connection" Proof? Where is the proof of this connection? Where is the proof Russia hacked the DNC? 5 years ago, you told me Russia was our best friend and Romney was an idiot for saying they were our number 1 geopolitical foe. Whatever the Establishment tells you, you will believe. Goat hasn't even been on the site for 5 years though.

5+ years ago Democrats, liberals, progressives and Obama would routinely mock and humiliate Romney over his position on Russia.

I highly doubt - considering he believes everything he's told about Russia - disagreed with them on that point.

People don't even know why all of a sudden the USA Establishment hates Russia. It's because Putin backs Assad. That's it. That's why we hate Russia now. If Putin didn't help Assad Putin would still be the Establishment's BFF.

McDonaldsGuy said: Puppyroach said: Why should you believe President Trump, when it seems both Bush and Obama made false statements during their precidencies? Since you are doing false equivalencies, why not be consistent atleast? 🙂 We have been down this road with Iraq WMDs. BOTH parties (not just Bush) said Saddam had WMDs. Hell, Bill Clinton BOMBED Iraq MULTIPLE times throughout the 1990s because of Saddam's WMDs. Bill Clinton's Iraq Resolution Act of 1998 was actually used as justification for the invasion. The Establishment clearly doesn't want to Trump to win, so they made up election interference. If Trump lost, would we be hearing anything about this? What do you think of Robert Mueller saying Iraq had WMDs? Was Robert Mueller lying then? Or is he lying now? Why should I believe YOU'RE telling the truth, but not the Bush Administration about Iraq WMDs? Give me a good explanation why you're so much more reliable than Iraq WMD intelligence.

I think you should look at the clip once more and see what he actually says. And you are compairing two different matters that has nothing to do with each other.

I look at this situation like this: Mueller might be doing a correct job, or he might not. That is irrelevant since he need to present evidence in order for Trump to be impeached. So If Trump is innocent, he should not be as sensitive as he is about all this. So why did he fire Comey specifically for the Russia investigation when he says it has nothing to do with him and has stated that Russia interfered in the election? https://www.google.se/amp/www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-russia-election-hacking-barack-obama-hillary-clinton-628835%3famp=1

McDonaldsGuy said: Final-Fan said: 1,2.  You have no point, and certainly no relevant point.  Please at least try to stay on topic instead of veering off into the nearest zinger.  3.  Let me spell it out for you.  Obama is saying, "if I negotiate about this topic now, Republicans will accuse me of sucking Russian dick.  Wait until after the elections."  Yes, that is something he would rather not have said live.  No, that isn't even remotely similar to the accusations against Trump.  In fact, it's the opposite:  the Trump campaign is accused of NOT waiting until after the elections to start doing things with Russia.  4.  No, in fact I do not remember when Bernie tried to steal Clinton's voter data.  If it's all BS and lies, how come Trump campaign officials have PLEADED GUILTY to improper dealings with foreign nationals and lying about their activities?  " "if I negotiate about this topic now, Republicans will accuse me of sucking Russian dick. " I have a question - did you miss the entire 2012 election? The entire 2012 election was the entire Democratic party sucking Russian dick. Why should I believe you when 15 years ago you told me Iraq had WMDs? What's the difference between this Russian hacking crap and Iraq WMDs?

O.K., I think I'm done with you.  You spew talking points only distantly related to the subject of discussion, and when any challenge to your claims makes you slightly uncomfortable you just pivot to a different one and ignore it.  You either can't or won't stay on topic and, despite your obsession with certain past falsehoods, show no consistent interest in discovering truth. 

Final-Fan said: McDonaldsGuy said: " "if I negotiate about this topic now, Republicans will accuse me of sucking Russian dick. " I have a question - did you miss the entire 2012 election? The entire 2012 election was the entire Democratic party sucking Russian dick. Why should I believe you when 15 years ago you told me Iraq had WMDs? What's the difference between this Russian hacking crap and Iraq WMDs? O.K., I think I'm done with you.  You spew talking points only distantly related to the subject of discussion, and when any challenge to your claims makes you slightly uncomfortable you just pivot to a different one and ignore it.  You either can't or won't stay on topic and, despite your obsession with certain past falsehoods, show no consistent interest in discovering truth.

First of all, if you don't remember Bernie stealing her data: http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/documents-show-sanders-staffers-breached-clinton-voter-data

How is it not relevant?

How is all this not relevant?

You keep saying "this is all from 2012!" but that's MY point. What did the governor of Massachusetts see that our COMMANDER-IN-CHIEF could not?

It's very relevant because you just lost the Presidential election. The one you guys couldn't be rigged remember? The one you said Trump had no chance of winning and it was "her turn."

I need a better explanation on Obama missing Russia.

So my contention is that "muh Russia" is partisan and here is the proof - the quotes of you guys from 2012

Many of which, are zingers BTW:

"Romney, who calls Russia our "No. 1 geopolitical foe," doesn't seem to realize it's the 21st century. #RomneyNotReady" - The Democrats -

Romney, who calls Russia our "No. 1 geopolitical foe," doesn't seem to realize it's the 21st century. #RomneyNotReady http://t.co/xcvhOAFS

— The Democrats (@TheDemocrats) October 22, 2012

"After all, you don't call Russia our No. 1 enemy -- not Al-Qaida, Russia -- unless you're still stuck in a Cold War mind warp." - Barack Obama at the 2012 DNC - http://www.npr.org/2012/09/06/160713941/transcript-president-obamas-convention-speech

"You (Romney) said Russia (was our no. 1 enemy), in the 1980s, they're now calling to ask for their foreign policy back because, you know, the Cold War's been over for 20 years. But Governor, when it comes to our foreign policy, you seem to want to import the foreign policies of the 1980s." - Barack Obama during 2012 Presidential debate https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QS2a44F5TgM)

"Mitt Romney talks like he's seen Russia by watching Rocky IV." The DNC even made a poster mocking Romney about watching Rocky IV to get his foreign policy: https://theintercept.com/wp-uploads/sites/1/2016/09/romneykerry.jpg - John Kerry at the 2012 DNC  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgUyqLrgO7Q

"Its someone dated to be looking backwards." - Then Secretary of State Hillary Clinton on Romney's views on Russia http://www.redstate.com/erick/2014/03/04/hillary-clinton-mocked-romney-on-russia-then-goes-to-hitler-comparisons/

"Vice President Joe Biden assailed Mitt Romney as “fundamentally wrong” and “totally out of touch” on foreign policy in a campaign speech Thursday — contrasting that to a record of President Barack Obama’s tough but right choices. Drawing contrasts between President Barack Obama and comments Romney has made on the campaign trail in 2008 and this year, Biden attacked the former Massachusetts governor for being  “one of a small group of Cold War holdovers,” for naming Russia as a major threat to the United States and at times referring to Soviets. I don’t know whether it’s a slip of the tongue or a mind-set … Everybody slips. I never do, but everyone does,” Biden said in a self-deprecating nod to his own gaffes." - Then VP Joe Biden http://www.politico.com/story/2012/04/biden-assails-mocks-romney-on-foreign-policy-075653

"VLADIVOSTOK, Russia — President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia sauntered into American presidential politics on Thursday, praising President Obama as “a very honest man” and chastising the Republican nominee, Mitt Romney, for describing Russia as “without question our No. 1 geopolitical foe.”[/quite] - The New York Times September 2012 archive.is/IsUS9

"After the election I have more flexibility." - Obama to Russia/Putin https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XsFR8DbSRQE

"Trade With Russia Is a Win-Win. By making Moscow a normal trading partner, Congress would create American jobs and advance human rights." - Secretary of State Hillary Clinton https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052702303836404577475061208876588

Puppyroach said: bigjon said: Mueller was in on it from the beginning. Rosenstien convinced Sessions to recuse himself then appointed Mueller. Now it is coming out that Rosenstein had a hand in the illegal surveillance of the Trump campaign (He signed several of the bogus FISA request).  They knew they had nothing on Russia, so Rosenstein recommended Comey be fired and then appointed Mueller to investigate Trump's obstruction of justice he committed by firing Comey. How fucked up is that.  So what you are saying is that Sessions and Trump are complete morons that are easily manipulated? And why did Trump claim Rosenstein had nothing to do with the firing of Comey, that it was all Trumps decision? The conspiracy was so advanced that they could literally guide Trump´s brain to do their bidding? =) And no, there hasn´t been any illegal surveillance of the Trump campaign. If you are referring to the GOP Fisa memo, it revolves around Carter Page, not Trump.

the political pressure was there too. I guess you could say they made the mistake of trusting Rosenstein. They should have known really. Obama gutted the DOJ and rotted it to its core. So ya they fucked up. They should not trust any of the political infrastructure Obama put in place. 

There is no Russia collusion. Thought this topic was going to be covering which Russian Olympian is hotter. Much more interesting topic.