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Australia legalizes same sex marriage

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monocle_layton said:

It's funny how people still freak out over gay marriage. It'll lead to incest!!!

After all, with this logic heterosexuality will lead to incest as well. Shouldn't we ban straight marriage as well?



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Goodnightmoon said:
monocle_layton said:

It's funny how people still freak out over gay marriage. It'll lead to incest!!!

 

After all, with this logic heterosexuality will lead to incest as well. Shouldn't we ban straight marriage as well?

Love leads to incest and pedophilia, #SayNotToLove!

Conservatives constantly bashed the Middle East, but perhaps they were right after all. We should make sure we force niqabs on everyone. Don't they realize allowing t shirts will lead to everyone being nude?

 

Affection should also be illegal. Before you know it, hugging your dad turns into some rough wrestling.

 

Azznation was truly woke - we were the ignorant ones in the end.



monocle_layton said:

It's funny how people still freak out over gay marriage. It'll lead to incest!!!

 

After all, with this logic heterosexuality will lead to incest as well. Shouldn't we ban straight marriage as well?

It's an interesting point though - surely the same points arguing in favour of same-sex marriage apply to incestuous marriages also (take reproduction out of the equation). What's the argument against same-sex incestuous marriage eg dad and son or incestuous marriage where one of the couple is infertile eg sterile brother and sister?



Vyse_Blue_Rogue said:
monocle_layton said:

It's funny how people still freak out over gay marriage. It'll lead to incest!!!

 

After all, with this logic heterosexuality will lead to incest as well. Shouldn't we ban straight marriage as well?

It's an interesting point though - surely the same points arguing in favour of same-sex marriage apply to incestuous marriages also (take reproduction out of the equation). What's the argument against same-sex incestuous marriage eg dad and son or incestuous marriage where one of the couple is infertile eg sterile brother and sister?

Replace homosexual with heterosexual. Your argument is weak and is a complete joke



Here is the Bible's argument against homosexuality. Various quotes in the Bible condemns homosexuality. http://www.livingout.org/the-bible-and-ssa

1.Genesis 19: "Sodom has become so associated with homosexual conduct that its name was for many ears a byword for it."

In the New Testament, Jude adds an important insight:

 

...just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which likewise indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural desire, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire. (Jude 7)

2.Leviticus 18 & 20: Leviticus contains two well known statements about homosexual activity:

You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination. (Leviticus 18:22)

If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them. (Leviticus 20:13)

Turning to the New Testament, Romans 1 has much to say about the nature and character of homosexual behaviour. 

Paul’s aim in these early chapters is to demonstrate that the whole world is unrighteous in God’s sight, and therefore in need of salvation. In Romans 1:18-32 he zeroes in on the Gentile world, describing the way it has turned away from God and embraced idolatry. The particular details in the passage may indicate that Paul is using the Greco-Roman culture surrounding his readers as a case in point.Paul writes:

1. Homosexual desire is not what God originally intended.

2. Our distorted desires are a sign that we have turned away from God.

Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. (1 Corinthians 6:9-10)

1. Homosexual sin is serious.
2. Homosexual sin is not unique.
3. Homosexual sin is not inescapable.

Here Paul writes:

The law is not laid down for the just but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who strike their fathers and mothers, for murderers, for the sexually immoral, men who practise homosexuality, enslavers, liars, perjurers, and whatever else is contrary to sound doctrine. (1 Timothy. 1:9-10)


Last edited by Dark_Lord_2008 - on 14 December 2017

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Azzanation said:

Guns don't control the crimes. The people do and unfortunately in the USA its the culture not the guns that's the issue. Banning them only takes away freedom doesn't solve the problem.

And what freedom would that be?
I think you are under the false misconception that it is illegal to own guns in Australia when that couldn't be farther from the truth.

Azzanation said:

Those mass shootings will still happen regardless if guns are banned or not (eg. black Market).

The evidence of no massacres in Australia for the past few decades says otherwise.
You understand what evidence is, right?

Azzanation said:

Blaming items for crimes is a poor mans excuse.

Let me guess... You will use the old adage of "Guns don't kill people, people kill people".
So North Korea should have nuclear weapons as Nuclear Weapons don't kill people, people kill people?

Azzanation said:

Australia banned knifes in the city yet we still have stabbings.

There is a fundamental difference between the concealed knife ban and gun control.
Australians were happy to give up their guns and hand them over to police, it cost the Government hundreds of millions.

Knives on the other hand only need a trip to Kmart or any kitchen in Australia. - Try acquiring a gun that easily.
Thus the Knife ban was never going to work.

Azzanation said:

What next, we ban cars because some crazy people do hit and runs?

This is a logical fallacy and thus false.

Azzanation said:

No thanks. Id rather take freedom of choice than be monitored like babies and being defenceless at the same time. This comes down to your opinion vs mine and mine wont change on the matter.

It's not just my opinion, you are clinging to logical fallacies, which means your opinion is fundamentally wrong. - And that's not my opinion either, that is a fact.

Azzanation said:

I don't import or emulate so majority miss out on these games that get banned because Australia thinks that's the reason for bad behaviour.

That's fine. You can still import or VPN.

Azzanation said:

Back to the main topic. Does it matter if there gay, straight, incest or pedo? Why allow one and not the others if others say they do it because there in love? We can judge and exclude them for a period of time however how long can we continue holding the lines. Maybe our generation is safe but maybe not the next.

Regurgitating your argumentum ad ignorantiam isn't going to make your argument sound, it does the opposite.

Incest is already legal to a point anyway.

But the appropriate answer to your response is... It depends on society and how they perceive it.
If Society deems that Polygamy is morally acceptable, then so be it.
If Society deems same-sex marriage is morally acceptable, then so be it.
If society deems that marrying a physical object or location is morally acceptable, then so be it.

But the abuse of Children... Will never ever ever be morally acceptable as it destroys innocent lives.
Your slippery slope conspiracy theories are not the truth and you should stop.

Azzanation said:

This is a growing community that will continue to push for more. Love is love as they say.

Its already happening with paedophilia want to be part of the LGBT community. Its extremely wrong however if paedophilia is pushing for sexual orientation, what's not stopping incest from there own sexual identity? (Vid Below)

This is a logical fallacy. And thus untrue.

Using Infowars which is an outlet that propagates fake news and conspiracy theories and will use any argument they can to reinforce their confirmation bias to push their own agenda?
Only idiots would trust in it and try to use it as a source, infowars doesn't even use appropriate citations or sources in it's claims... - And thus in one fell swoop, you just lost any and all credibility.

Azzanation said:

Its a trending social movement on Twitter and YouTube that provides information how gays were once considered a mental illness and was redefined as a sexual orientation.

And then science happened. I suggest you go have a listen to Richard Dawkins on how biology and genetics plays a role in Homosexuality... And most importantly the twin studies.
..Which is why Homosexuality was delisted as a mental illness.

A few decades later when the idea that Homosexuality isn't a choice... Same-sex marriage was legalized. Yay.

Azzanation said:


Some of the LGBT community has advocated the social movement of paedophilia as a sexual orientation. 

And some in the Christian community advocate the death penalty for homosexuality, doesn't mean they are representative of all Christians across Australia, especially the millions that voted yes.

Only a fool paints everyone with the same brush.

Dark_Lord_2008 said:
Here is the Bible's argument against homosexuality. Various quotes in the Bible condemns homosexuality. http://www.livingout.org/the-bible-and-ssa

Don't get me started on theistic perspectives on homosexuality and same-sex marriage.
Freedom from Religion should be something that all nations aspire towards in my opinion.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

Dark_Lord_2008 said:

Here is the Bible's argument against homosexuality. Various quotes in the Bible condemns homosexuality. http://www.livingout.org/the-bible-and-ssa

Australia is not a theocracy. Ergo, what the Bible says isn't really relevant to whether gay couples should be able to be legally married.

Last edited by curl-6 - on 14 December 2017


Locknuts said:

I don't want government influencing our nations' culture. The culture should develop naturally and government should simply represent those views

Our Government is part of our Culture, it's been an influencer of Australian culture for centuries, why should that change? That's not very conservative of you. :P

For example... The New South Wales Government owns the Sydney Opera House, which is a massive cultural landmark in Australia, would Australia be better off culturally if that building was never built? Think about it.
And think about how often that building is referenced in movies, tv and music and other forms of media. (Independence Day for example.)

Locknuts said:

I could get into the ways in which christian values have improved western society, but that's a topic for another time. I don't believe that Jesus was the son of an actual God, but that doesn't mean his teachings weren't incredibly important in shaping the civilisation with the highest standards of living and longest life expectancy in human history.

I don't believe in any of the theistic accounts outlined in the Bible as it comes into contradiction with many scientific precedents.
But I do believe in the Australian Constitution and where it protects and supports the idea of Freedom of Religion and it's implied right of Freedom from Religion.

And you know what? There are nations which have never been strongly theistic which are advanced, developed nations... And there are dozens of nations that are extremely religious and have some of the worlds worst human-rights track records that will make your skin crawl.

Ergo. Religion is not a requirement for a country to be successful.
As for "Christian Values". - The Bible is just as bad as the Torah and Quran in my opinion... And thus I would argue they are actually immoral and in some extreme cases dangerous. - Thus I would hate for them to have any kind of complete control on ANY aspect of Australian society.

I think we basically understand each other on the other issues so I'll just tackle these two:

With regards to the Opera House, a building, being a part of our culture, I really don't follow you. I think the government recognised that the people within their electorate valued the arts and built the opera house. I don't know of anyone getting upset about it. It's more of a landmark than something that dictates culture to people.

I was thinking more along the lines of the ABC and SBS. Government funded media which have an obvious bias towards big government (their salaries depend on it) even they try very hard (and fail) to appear to represent all views. It's fine to be biased, but let people know at the outset. 

On the second point, I never said that religion is critical to a country's development, but religion is an important part of our culture in the west and gave us many of the principles on which the nation was built. I'd guess that many of the countries you are referring to have copied the western countries to some degree to become successful, but you didn't list any, so I wouldn't know. 

Christianity has done more good in the world that Islam or Judaism. Although Jews have achieved a disproportionate number of things like Nobel Prizes, I think this has more to do with their intellect than their culture. Before the reformation and subsequent separation of church and state, the Christian church was responsible for some horrific atrocities. But we learned the hard way and a separation became a fundamental part of our culture. I am currently educating myself on Judaism so I can't really say much on the subject.

Islam does not allow for a separation of Church and state. As Hitchens said 'Not all religions are equally bad at the same time'.



Locknuts said:

I think we basically understand each other on the other issues so I'll just tackle these two:

With regards to the Opera House, a building, being a part of our culture, I really don't follow you. I think the government recognised that the people within their electorate valued the arts and built the opera house. I don't know of anyone getting upset about it. It's more of a landmark than something that dictates culture to people.

I'm not talking about the arts themselves. I am talking about the Opera House itself. It was commissioned by the Government, owned by the Government and likely would never have happened without the Government and is a massive Australian cultural landmark.
Go overseas and ask someone what is some of things they recognize about Australia... The Opera House is one of them.

Ergo. The Government "involvement" with Australian culture could be argued to be vital.
Otherwise... What is Australian culture? A blue singlet, footy shorts, beer gut and thongs whilst throwing a shrimp on the BBQ with a few slang words thrown in for good measure?

Locknuts said:
I was thinking more along the lines of the ABC and SBS. Government funded media which have an obvious bias towards big government (their salaries depend on it) even they try very hard (and fail) to appear to represent all views. It's fine to be biased, but let people know at the outset.

The ABC and SBS do provide a counter-balance to the Murdoch empire which are right-leaning, thus they provide a different perspective on issues which is very much needed.
Personally I think the ABC and SBS should be consolidated anyway, that way you can streamline and reduce costs.

Locknuts said:
On the second point, I never said that religion is critical to a country's development, but religion is an important part of our culture in the west and gave us many of the principles on which the nation was built.

Fair enough.

Locknuts said:
I'd guess that many of the countries you are referring to have copied the western countries to some degree to become successful, but you didn't list any, so I wouldn't know.

Japan. Pretty sure China also ranks highly as well.

Locknuts said:
Christianity has done more good in the world that Islam or Judaism.

Christianity is also responsible for the deaths of millions, the prevention of equal rights and other immoral actions.
An example: Inquisition, murdering pagans, sentencing of death for homosexuality.

However... To say that Christianity has done more good than Judaism is a little duplicitous...
Judaism, Christianity and Islam are all based on the same Abrahamic, Middle-Eastern ethos.

In-fact, Judaism was the first of the three religions and is built around the Torah, the Jewish Bible.
Christianity adopted the Torah and relegated that to the Old Testament whilst "tacking on" the New Testament and applying it's own spin, so it could be argued that without Judaism and the Torah you wouldn't have Christianity and the Bible anyway.
Islam takes the Torah/Bibles Old Testament and essentially gives it it's own spin on the events.

There is a reason why all three religions preach death to Homosexuals, against the consumption of pork, women serving men, owning slaves is okay and why all three are thus against same-sex marriage.

Locknuts said:
Although Jews have achieved a disproportionate number of things like Nobel Prizes, I think this has more to do with their intellect than their culture. Before the reformation and subsequent separation of church and state, the Christian church was responsible for some horrific atrocities. But we learned the hard way and a separation became a fundamental part of our culture. I am currently educating myself on Judaism so I can't really say much on the subject.

Agreed. I didn't wish to get into a theistic discussion here (even a light one) but it happened anyway. Haha

Locknuts said:
Islam does not allow for a separation of Church and state. As Hitchens said 'Not all religions are equally bad at the same time'.

I dislike all religions equally, I prefer science, evidence, logic and sound reasoning.
Thus no religion is better or worst than each other... I mean after several thousand years, 4000+ religions/denominations and thousands of "gods" none have even been able to provide evidence to justify their claim of a supernatural deity. Ever.

That is in stark contrast to homosexuals who do exist in the real world and thus should come first before any religion.

I am just glad that same-sex marriage is being legalized one country after another... And that religion is taking a backseat to that.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

Dark_Lord_2008 said:

Here is the Bible's argument against homosexuality.

So what you're saying is "here is a load of bullshit".

That's... not exactly a good argument



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