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Trump's tax proposal: raise taxes on the poor, give to the rich

Forums - Politics Discussion - Trump's tax proposal: raise taxes on the poor, give to the rich

TurboElder said:
Flilix said:
Did people seriously believe that a selfish millionaire like Trump was going to help the poor?

He already did.

"U.S. economy accelerated during first full Trump quarter"
http://money.cnn.com/2017/07/28/news/economy/gdp-second-quarter-trump-economy/index.html

THose quarters were not because of trump but because of actual businesses holding the market together. Trump blindly attributed stock market rises to himself and stated that they would somehow affect the national debt. Seriously....I don't know what else to say.



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People do like Trump is responsible for everything now, the republican party is pushing for a lot of that as they have a vast majority in the house while Trump isnt intervening. It wasnt much different under obama.



monocle_layton said:

 

kowenicki said:

Alreaqdy debunked.  But anyway...

 

People picking out trump for special criticism still haven't figured all politicians are the same? How Cute.

Obama recently charged $400,000 for a one hour speech at an investment company.

Obama charged $600,000 recently for an interview with a presidential historian on subjects such as income inequality (the irony!)

Obama vetoed a cap on presidents pensions of $200,000 during his presidency, he wanted more.

Obama just signed a $65m book deal, selling his story about his time in office.  Cashing in on public office... but that just for other grubby politicians surely?



Yes, Obama will earn a few hundred million in his post presidency period and conveniently forget all that bull he spouted about inequality.

But that's all ok, because he was cool..... apparently. Plus he was a really, really good president that achieved lots, like mass disenchantment and huge social divisions leading to the election of Trump.

'Buh Obama!'

 

Ok, now what about Trump? Why is it that any criticism avout Trump will always be directed to Obama or Hillary? Stop beating the bush and answer the actual problem.

I thought I was quite clear.  The problem is politicians... all politicians.  

But it is a fair point to ask why Obama got such a free ride, given his incompetence and failure to deliver.  He left a legacy of division leading to a Trump win.  Undeniable.

 

 

 



I'm not really here!

Link: Shipment History Since 1995


Superman4 said:
StarOcean said:

Used "Liberal media" unironically. Already not gonna read for that. I'll use "Nazi" and "racist" for as long as you call it "liberal media". 

I used to watch CNN on the regular. I stopped after this election made clear that they are the worst offenders for BS "news". They make Fox look like Ghandi. Everything that Trump says they twist into something its not and blow it way out of proportion. Fox was actually way more on point and stuck to what was said for both Hillary and Trump during the lection, I watched both. So the term "Liberal Media" is a just description considring everything that comes from that Network and a number of others is complete spin towards their agenda. The terms Nazi and racist just fit in with that Liberal agenda since they are also complete BS statements. 

I have to watch them both every night. CNN is anti-Trump, which doesn't make you liberal. It's common sense to be anti-Trump. I'm not a liberal and I think Trump is a disgrace to the entire world. Fox is pro-Trump. Well they flipped when all the other Rep candidates lost to him, anyway. CNN, no, any news network even need to twist his words because all he does is lie and say stupid shit. He's less functional than the patients I take care of. Fox is a conservative network and was never going to like Hillary. And was never ever going to be fair to her even if she was a decent candidate due to her ties with Obama. They were never on point and would defend Trump even if he raped a child. 

And using the word liberal to equate to spin is the same as conservative equates to lunatics since you have Info Wars saying Michelle Obama is a man and Fox promoting the Seth Rich conspiracy theory. So nah nah nah, you gonna hate one, you gotta hate the other. Both groups have made me lose most of my hope in humanity. At worst, this will blow over in 4-8yrs, at best the US crumbles to the ground. Trump is a bad businessman, politician, son, husband, father, and president. He would have you shot dead if it gave him 5 minutes of fame. He's petty, weak, insecure. You do not want that man to represent you. Whether or not he committed crimes doesn't negate him being a terrible human being.

My main reasons for being anti-Trump are his lack of care for the environment and his agenda on pushing any shitty health plan just to say, "Ha! Suck it!" to people he is against. Which in turn hurts MY clients, people I care for. The other shit is just icing on the cake. You might say, "Well he said otherwise" but his actions speak differently. He has proven he has little regard for life on earth and the people he is supposed to represent. 



StarOcean said:
Superman4 said:

I used to watch CNN on the regular. I stopped after this election made clear that they are the worst offenders for BS "news". They make Fox look like Ghandi. Everything that Trump says they twist into something its not and blow it way out of proportion. Fox was actually way more on point and stuck to what was said for both Hillary and Trump during the lection, I watched both. So the term "Liberal Media" is a just description considring everything that comes from that Network and a number of others is complete spin towards their agenda. The terms Nazi and racist just fit in with that Liberal agenda since they are also complete BS statements. 

I have to watch them both every night. CNN is anti-Trump, which doesn't make you liberal. It's common sense to be anti-Trump. I'm not a liberal and I think Trump is a disgrace to the entire world. Fox is pro-Trump. Well they flipped when all the other Rep candidates lost to him, anyway. CNN, no, any news network even need to twist his words because all he does is lie and say stupid shit. He's less functional than the patients I take care of. Fox is a conservative network and was never going to like Hillary. And was never ever going to be fair to her even if she was a decent candidate due to her ties with Obama. They were never on point and would defend Trump even if he raped a child. 

And using the word liberal to equate to spin is the same as conservative equates to lunatics since you have Info Wars saying Michelle Obama is a man and Fox promoting the Seth Rich conspiracy theory. So nah nah nah, you gonna hate one, you gotta hate the other. Both groups have made me lose most of my hope in humanity. At worst, this will blow over in 4-8yrs, at best the US crumbles to the ground. Trump is a bad businessman, politician, son, husband, father, and president. He would have you shot dead if it gave him 5 minutes of fame. He's petty, weak, insecure. You do not want that man to represent you. Whether or not he committed crimes doesn't negate him being a terrible human being.

My main reasons for being anti-Trump are his lack of care for the environment and his agenda on pushing any shitty health plan just to say, "Ha! Suck it!" to people he is against. Which in turn hurts MY clients, people I care for. The other shit is just icing on the cake. You might say, "Well he said otherwise" but his actions speak differently. He has proven he has little regard for life on earth and the people he is supposed to represent. 

 

The reason I use liberal to describe CNN and such is because up until Trump I considered myself more a Liberal-Democrat than anything else. I voted for Bill Clinton and Obama, Hell I voted for Al Gore. I agree with Some of what Bernie says and still think that if the DNC didn't screw him over that he would have won over Trump. What lost me about that party and really my state ( California ) is that I actually paid attention this time around. I read every last detail of everything on the Ballot, who was for and against each measure and came to the realization that the Democrats and Liberals, in this state at least are generally idiots. They put no thought into the ramifications of what they want to accomplish. Every last measure on the ballot that was funded and supported by Democrats took away voters rights and ability to have a say. When reading them I thought there was no way any Democrat would pass such idiotic measures but alas, every single one passed. Watching CNN plainly lie about what Trump said in his debates...which I watched in their entity, turned me to Fox to see what they had to say. I never really watched Fox before this election. Fox was actually pretty much on point with what Trump said and even Hillary. They bashed some of what he said because they didn't want him to win either and still bash him on occasion. CNN however did nothing of the sort. They would take snippets of the speech, out of context and incomplete and twist them into something they weren't and debate about it for an hour. Then Ana Navarro decided to start calling Trump a racist and saying he called all Mexicans murderers and Rapists. I watched that entire speech from start to finish, Live and thats not what he said. She has continued to say that same false narrative every time she is on the show. If you watch Fox its not that way, they bash Hillary yes, but they also bash Trump and a lot of other republicans on various issues. They will give those same people credit when they deserve it and unlike CNN wont take another backhanded jab right after any praise if any is given at all. CNN even twisted what he said about good people being on both sides during that protest where the women was run over. Not all of the people were violent or racist, it only takes a few to start trouble just ask Antifa. Fox does have some people that are far right in their beliefs but honestly for the most part the shows I watch are far better than the trash CNN is spewing these days. Hell, watching the election results on CNN when Hillary got off to an early lead was comical. They were all giddy and I told ya so up until Trump started to take some states he wasn't supposed to, then they switched the tone to "its still early" and "he will have to sweep these to have a chance". They didnt even want to call it in Trumps favor once it was clear he had won.

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kowenicki said:
monocle_layton said:

 

'Buh Obama!'

 

Ok, now what about Trump? Why is it that any criticism avout Trump will always be directed to Obama or Hillary? Stop beating the bush and answer the actual problem.

I thought I was quite clear.  The problem is politicians... all politicians.  

But it is a fair point to ask why Obama got such a free ride, given his incompetence and failure to deliver.  He left a legacy of division leading to a Trump win.  Undeniable.

 

 

 

What lead to a Trump win was Hillary.  She was just to weak and had way to much baggage even against someone like Trump.  Also if you think Obama brought division in the US, you probably live on the side that never new it existed for decades.  Nothing you see today is something that just happens.  Just like any condition it has been brewing for years.  

Also, not sure why Obama making money has anything to do with inequality.  Inequality means peoople do not have the means to move from where they at because of systems in place to keep them from succeeding.  Examples would be white males making more money in the same position as a Female.

Also everything you listed is the going price for a President to speak.  How making money and charging the usual price for your services has anything with inequality, I am not seeing how this adds up.



Superman4 said:
StarOcean said:

I have to watch them both every night. CNN is anti-Trump, which doesn't make you liberal. It's common sense to be anti-Trump. I'm not a liberal and I think Trump is a disgrace to the entire world. Fox is pro-Trump. Well they flipped when all the other Rep candidates lost to him, anyway. CNN, no, any news network even need to twist his words because all he does is lie and say stupid shit. He's less functional than the patients I take care of. Fox is a conservative network and was never going to like Hillary. And was never ever going to be fair to her even if she was a decent candidate due to her ties with Obama. They were never on point and would defend Trump even if he raped a child. 

And using the word liberal to equate to spin is the same as conservative equates to lunatics since you have Info Wars saying Michelle Obama is a man and Fox promoting the Seth Rich conspiracy theory. So nah nah nah, you gonna hate one, you gotta hate the other. Both groups have made me lose most of my hope in humanity. At worst, this will blow over in 4-8yrs, at best the US crumbles to the ground. Trump is a bad businessman, politician, son, husband, father, and president. He would have you shot dead if it gave him 5 minutes of fame. He's petty, weak, insecure. You do not want that man to represent you. Whether or not he committed crimes doesn't negate him being a terrible human being.

My main reasons for being anti-Trump are his lack of care for the environment and his agenda on pushing any shitty health plan just to say, "Ha! Suck it!" to people he is against. Which in turn hurts MY clients, people I care for. The other shit is just icing on the cake. You might say, "Well he said otherwise" but his actions speak differently. He has proven he has little regard for life on earth and the people he is supposed to represent. 

 

The reason I use liberal to describe CNN and such is because up until Trump I considered myself more a Liberal-Democrat than anything else. I voted for Bill Clinton and Obama, Hell I voted for Al Gore. I agree with Some of what Bernie says and still think that if the DNC didn't screw him over that he would have won over Trump. What lost me about that party and really my state ( California ) is that I actually paid attention this time around. I read every last detail of everything on the Ballot, who was for and against each measure and came to the realization that the Democrats and Liberals, in this state at least are generally idiots. They put no thought into the ramifications of what they want to accomplish. Every last measure on the ballot that was funded and supported by Democrats took away voters rights and ability to have a say. When reading them I thought there was no way any Democrat would pass such idiotic measures but alas, every single one passed. Watching CNN plainly lie about what Trump said in his debates...which I watched in their entity, turned me to Fox to see what they had to say. I never really watched Fox before this election. Fox was actually pretty much on point with what Trump said and even Hillary. They bashed some of what he said because they didn't want him to win either and still bash him on occasion. CNN however did nothing of the sort. They would take snippets of the speech, out of context and incomplete and twist them into something they weren't and debate about it for an hour. Then Ana Navarro decided to start calling Trump a racist and saying he called all Mexicans murderers and Rapists. I watched that entire speech from start to finish, Live and thats not what he said. She has continued to say that same false narrative every time she is on the show. If you watch Fox its not that way, they bash Hillary yes, but they also bash Trump and a lot of other republicans on various issues. They will give those same people credit when they deserve it and unlike CNN wont take another backhanded jab right after any praise if any is given at all. CNN even twisted what he said about good people being on both sides during that protest where the women was run over. Not all of the people were violent or racist, it only takes a few to start trouble just ask Antifa. Fox does have some people that are far right in their beliefs but honestly for the most part the shows I watch are far better than the trash CNN is spewing these days. Hell, watching the election results on CNN when Hillary got off to an early lead was comical. They were all giddy and I told ya so up until Trump started to take some states he wasn't supposed to, then they switched the tone to "its still early" and "he will have to sweep these to have a chance". They didnt even want to call it in Trumps favor once it was clear he had won.

The thing is, do you want a bad Rep like Trump in office? You called yourself a Lib/Dem. If you are theres no way I could see you truly supporting him unless its out of protest. If you want a good Republican, John Kasich is a great one to follow. I don't see Bernie running in 2020. I think a decent Dem to look at for 2020/2024 is Joe Kennedy. But hey, that's my 2 cents. And really, Fox is still bad. Politics-wise. I'll always maintain that Fox and CNN make really good non-political peices though.



teamsilent13 said:
Signalstar said:
If he gets rid of the estate tax that is the ultimate tax cut on the rich. We should fight against that as hard as possible.

Well I definately am for loweirng the estate tax, but do you have evidence he would remove it entirely. That being said, I might be in support of removing it entirely. I believe many rich get away with not paying it anyway with good tax planning and loopholes, but it hurts the small businesses that cannot afford such tax planning. 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/robertwood/2017/02/23/trump-vows-estate-tax-repeal-but-california-plans-its-own-40-estate-tax/#1c67150f1e2d

Trump said he would abolish it.

You're right that many rich people get away with not paying it. That's why those loopholes should be covered, instead of scraping the estate tax. Senator Sanders proposed a bill to do just that.
As for small businesses, this only applies to those who have estates worth over $5,4 million. Double that if you are married.

The estate tax affects 0.2 percent of the population. 99.8% of people do not qualify to pay the estate tax.
Out of 5,500 estates each year, only 80 of them are farms and small businesses. Basically, less than 0.1%.

Even Steve Mnuchin, the secratary of treasury, admitted that the repeal of estate tax disproportionally benefits rich people.



The Koch family for example stand to gain $33 Billion if this goes through. So paying politicians hundreds of millions to advocate this for them is pocket change in comparison.
Such corruption should not be encouraged. Rather, the loopholes should be filled in so some rich people can't get out of paying it.



kowenicki said:
monocle_layton said:

 

'Buh Obama!'

 

Ok, now what about Trump? Why is it that any criticism avout Trump will always be directed to Obama or Hillary? Stop beating the bush and answer the actual problem.

I thought I was quite clear.  The problem is politicians... all politicians.  

But it is a fair point to ask why Obama got such a free ride, given his incompetence and failure to deliver.  He left a legacy of division leading to a Trump win.  Undeniable.

 

 

 

Well, that's complete bull, and it can be smelled from an ocean away.

Under Obama:

* Ended the recession brought on by the Bush administration.
* Funded the upgrade of the US auto-Industry, preventing it from complete collapse.
* Lowered the deficit year over year from 1.4 trillion USD at the end of the Bush administration down to 400 B USD, or a 72% reduction. And at the same time cut taxes for the working class.
* Healthcare reformation.
* Cut back on expensive US military operations, saving hundreds of billions of US taxpayer dollars.
* Instituted bank regulations to prevent the kind of economic collapsed caused by the Bush administration and their removal of prior regulations.
* Eliminated Osama Bin Laden, after the Bush administration had failed to do so for its entire 8 year administration.
* Raised fuel efficiency standards, which is pro-environment and pro-consumer.
* Reduced carbon emissions through the US. 
* Solved the nuclear crisis with Iran, and has catalyzed the rise of liberal causes in Iran.
* Created more jobs than any other President outside of Bill Clinton. After Bush had the lowest success in 100 years, rivalled only by his father Bush Sr. and Eisenhower (both Republicans).

This is all in spite of Republicans trying to obstruct everything the Democrats were trying to achieve. The major problem with Obama wasn't the Democrats, it was the pig-headed Republican obstructionism.

 

On the other hand, the current Republican administration has achieved nothing, Donald Trump runs his mouth on Twitter like an whiney crybaby, dropping the world opinion of the US substantially. He has had to fire many of his own "expertly handpicked staff" for incompetence. The Republican government has not passed anything, the only things that have happened are Trumps really terrible executive orders to hurt the people of the United States and the country as a whole. He has ordered the launch of several disastrous military offenses in support of Sunni extremist groups and Saudi Arabia, costing American lives.

 

Question: Why are Americans so clueless about their own country? Sometimes I think Western Europe knows more about what's happened in the US than the majority of actual Americans do. Is the news/propaganda umbrella really that terrible in the US? Why is it that Americans think Obama did nothing when the rest of the world can see he achieved quite a lot? Or is this just certain states who are under propaganda umbrellas? Or is it just ignorant republicans?



I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

Final-Fan said:
Zoombael said:
If you think hard and long about it, it actually makes sense.

Poor/muddle class people may tend to hoard their money, and saved money isn't spend money, less tax for the state. Rich people on the other hand spend more money the more money they have, which in turn is good for state and economy, and good for the little man. See. All is good and well.

I can't tell from your post—are you being sarcastic?  This is literally the opposite of reality as I understand it.  Poor people generally can't afford to save much of their income because of their expenses, and usually turn around and spend the money very quickly, either by buying things they've needed/wanted for a while but couldn't afford yet or paying off debt (increasing their purchasing power).  The people who can hoard their wealth are the ones whose basic expenses (food etc.) make up a smaller proportion of their total income.  The rich. 

Yes.



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