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Forums - Sales Discussion - Media Create/Famitsu/Dengeki - 28th Aug - 3rd Sep 2017

tbone51 on 07 September 2017
ryuzaki57 said:
Symbios63 said:

User bases

Vita : 5.696.448 (45%), Switch : 1.578.036 (12.5%), PS4 : 5.276.853 (42%)

NoA2 FW sales

Vita : 7168 (24%), Switch (15%) : 4463, PS4 : 18207 (61%)

I don't think you chose the best example to illustrate your point here. Switch number are pretty much as expected based on total NoA2 sales and user bases.

Sorry but the user base argument isn't telling absolute truth. Look, if the user base is directly linked to sales figures, then why did NoA2 PS4 sell half of the first one, released when PS4 user base was much lower? Why did this week's Etrian Odyssey sell so much less than past episodes while 3DS user base is at its zenith? Why did NoA2 Switch sell 10 times less than NoA1 did on PS4 when PS4 user base was more or less equivalent to Switch's now?

Besides, how do you know the 5m Vita user base is 100% active users? It's an old system, it surely has much less active users now, while Switch is recent and probably every switch owner is using it.

See, there is no linear mathematical link between user base and sales figures, there are so many more more important factors.

hiska-kun said:

So Switch is the one to blame for subpar graphics and not Vita that also has a version and it's inferior than Switch.

Blue Reflection had a Vita version and yet has shown the best graphics ever for Gust on PS4. Therefore, Switch is naturally the culprit. The time wasted to develop the Switch version from scratch is as much time not used to do their best on the PS4 version. 

Kresnik said:

Eventually, Switch will absorb more of the type of gamer that Gust target just naturally as Vita declines further.

No, PS4 has more chance to absorb the waning Vita sales (trophies, brand loyalty)

Its hard to accept things when you look at it only in 1 way. No offense but anything nintendo related you come off as the most biased poster. You have that history of course and last i checked its transitioning to ps4/switch multiplat so your wrong "brand loyalty"



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rodea_sky_soldier on 07 September 2017

 

Kresnik said:
Symbios63 said:

User bases

Vita : 5.696.448 (45%), Switch : 1.578.036 (12.5%), PS4 : 5.276.853 (42%)

NoA2 FW sales

Vita : 7168 (24%), Switch (15%) : 4463, PS4 : 18207 (61%)

I don't think you chose the best example to illustrate your point here. Switch number are pretty much as expected based on total NoA2 sales and user bases.

One Piece Unlimited World Red on Switch outsold the PS4 version. But that never happened right, because PS4 has more consoles sold?

Attach ratios hold very little value - especially for games that are going to sell < 100k. If this was a new Monster Hunter game that needed a 4m userbase then it would be a different story, but it's not, this is a niche game that only needs a few tens of thousands of people to buy it.

People only use this kind of argument when they have an agenda to push or want to do damage limitation lol.

I didn't read the others posts, I had to stop here. You're saying a lot of crap. Take a look at Famitsu's list and will see a very interesting thing:

Yoru no nai Kuni 2 for Switch sold just ~4400 copies on Switch? Yes. BUT, this mean 40%~60% of the first shipment, or, Gust just sent ~10.000 copies to the stores. So, The game didn't sold THAT BAD at all.

Vita's 9k ~40%/60% too (they should sent like 15~18k to the stores

PS4 at 20k = 60%~80% (~30k on the stores)

 

IN OTHER WORDS, Gust KNEW would sell low, and didn't expected so mutch. And the Switch version was just fine.

 

For One Piece, ~4500 on Switch was 20%~80% of the shipments (Namco overshipped 20k/25k and/or the game underperformed).

I'll even talk about the flopped PS4's and it's ridiculous 2k's first week.

 

PS: My post goes to @ryuzaki57 too.



Symbios63 on 07 September 2017
ryuzaki57 said:
Symbios63 said:

User bases

Vita : 5.696.448 (45%), Switch : 1.578.036 (12.5%), PS4 : 5.276.853 (42%)

NoA2 FW sales

Vita : 7168 (24%), Switch (15%) : 4463, PS4 : 18207 (61%)

I don't think you chose the best example to illustrate your point here. Switch number are pretty much as expected based on total NoA2 sales and user bases.

Sorry but the user base argument isn't telling absolute truth. Look, if the user base is directly linked to sales figures, then why did NoA2 PS4 sell half of the first one, released when PS4 user base was much lower? Why did this week's Etrian Odyssey sell so much less than past episodes while 3DS user base is at its zenith? Why did NoA2 Switch sell 10 times less than NoA1 did on PS4 when PS4 user base was more or less equivalent to Switch's now?

Besides, how do you know the 5m Vita user base is 100% active users? It's an old system, it surely has much less active users now, while Switch is recent and probably every switch owner is using it.

See, there is no linear mathematical link between user base and sales figures, there are so many more more important factors.

Oh sure, it is not telling absolute truth. It is not what I said though...

In your post, you used ratio of NoA2 sold on switch (13% based on famitsu number) to suggest Switch owners are not interested in Gust games (which may be true, we just don't know yet). The thing is switch is still hard to find in Japan, and Gust game audience is probably not the most likely to rush on a nintendo product at launch. So user base may still have an impact in this case.

I do believe that switch will build a better audience for those kind of game compared to previous Nintendo system, and NoA2 sales, as bad as they are overall, are certainly not telling me otherwise (if the game sold 50k on PS4, 30k on Vita and 4k on switch, you might have a point). They are not conforting my point either, they are just, as mentionned previously, in line with what you could expect so early in the console lifespawn for a bad selling game.

Therefore those sells are not a good support for the strong conclusions you drew in your previous post IMO.



Lawlight on 07 September 2017

PS4 making the most out of a dead region.



Kresnik on 07 September 2017
rodea_sky_soldier said:


I didn't read the others posts, I had to stop here. You're saying a lot of crap.

Your argument falls apart once you realise that retailers decide the size of shipments by placing orders; not developers. Sure companies like Square-Enix can force extra copies of Final Fantasy XV out into the wild if they really really try, but ultimately a retailer is going to decide how many copies of a game to order.

So... yeah. I don't understand why you're being so aggressive, but try another argument if you want to prove a point.



Read my Vita reviews here

Famitsu Japan Digital Sales Archive
Vita Media Create physical sales database
Vita vs. COMG Japan Sales Comparison

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Acevil on 07 September 2017
Ka-pi96 said:
Acevil said:

Both bombed pretty badly. I cannot understand how anyone can spin any of these numbers as decent. 

These threads may as well be called the "VGC Official spin threads" so...

Some people just have such strong agenda. It flopped everywhere. 



 

GuyDuke on 07 September 2017
tbone51 said:
guiduc said:

I was waiting all week for your analysis.

Its been only 1 day though :p

Felt like a week waiting for Kero



tbone51 on 07 September 2017
Acevil said:
Ka-pi96 said:

These threads may as well be called the "VGC Official spin threads" so...

Some people just have such strong agenda. It flopped everywhere. 

It didnt flop though, stop being a fanboy xD



ryuzaki57 on 07 September 2017
rodea_sky_soldier said:

BUT, this mean 40%~60% of the first shipment, or, Gust just sent ~10.000 copies to the stores. So, The game didn't sold THAT BAD at all.

The retailers didn't want the Switch version. Switchers didn't want the few units retailers reluctantly accepted. Yeah, that seems perfectly fine... 

rodea_sky_soldier said:

IN OTHER WORDS, Gust KNEW would sell low, and didn't expected so mutch. And the Switch version was just fine.

Then maybe they should just stop developing those Switch multiplats, if they KNOW it won't sell.



 

Blog -> https://ryuz4ki57inenglish.wordpress.com/

rodea_sky_soldier on 07 September 2017
ryuzaki57 said:
rodea_sky_soldier said:

BUT, this mean 40%~60% of the first shipment, or, Gust just sent ~10.000 copies to the stores. So, The game didn't sold THAT BAD at all.

The retailers didn't want the Switch version. Switchers didn't want the few units retailers reluctantly accepted. Yeah, that seems perfectly fine... 

rodea_sky_soldier said:

IN OTHER WORDS, Gust KNEW would sell low, and didn't expected so mutch. And the Switch version was just fine.

Then maybe they should just stop developing those Switch multiplats, if they KNOW it won't sell.

spin what i wrote whatever maner you like, gust knew this game would undersell overall. period.