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Forums - Movies & TV - Wonder Woman Is "A Step Backwards..."

I mostly disagree with Cameron here, even though two of my favorite female protagonists became decidedly more badass in the two sequels he directed. Wonder woman was excellent in this movie; you don't need to be ugly or an alcoholic to be a positive portrayal of a female protagonist.

Given that she was brilliant, strong, and had a strong moral compass that she stuck by even after being confronted with the reality of the world, I have to think his real criticism is simply that she was hot as hell. That last quality does not make her a poor protagonist, just as so many great male protagonists through the years have been crazy attractive as well.



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Ariakon said:

I understand his logic, that hollywood only allows women to be strong when they are also gorgeous and nurturing, rather than grizzled and tough, but I do not think it applies to Wonder Woman. She is very beautiful in the movie, yes, but I do not see her as objectified. She is, like the male superheroes, attractive and still strong, and there is nothing wrong with that. It is true that we need more women like Sarah Connor in our action movies (God I loved Linda Hamilton in T2), but that does not mean that we should negate the other positive representations of strong female characters. After all, men get to have representations such as Henry Cavill as Superman (a very handsome man) and tough, grizzled characters such as Clint Eastwood in the spaghetti westerns. Women are allowed to have a wide range of representation in their heroes, as well. 

Exactly. Is Thor a step back for men because I get to see a hunky Australian actor shirtless for a scene?  Female characters get put under a microscope as having to represent a whole sex than just being a character.  Most of us are not so fragile as to be shamed because someone is attractive or powerful.



Hynad said:
Aeolus451 said:
A step backward? What? A beautiful woman in a leading heroic role is not objectifying women.

What the heck are you talking about?

Aren't beautiful women supposed to be objects? :-O

Sarcasm?



In Japan, there is backlash over the movies marketing campaign, something along the lines of "she is a superhero, but she is also innocent, and has never known love". Hearing about that made me realize that they are not wrong.

The premise of Wonder Woman is that a very very powerful woman goes to the normal world, where she is naïve to most things in it (rotating doors, ice cream, people in general), at the end of the movie she is losing to Ares when she remembers what her male love interest told her before he died, "I love you". This confession of love allows her to SUDDENLY BE STRONG ENOUGH TO CURBSTOMP Ares, and the climax of the story ends with her literally talking about the power of love.

As pertaining to what James Cameron said, it's not a step back really, what it is instead I view it as a take contrary to what is the current progressive narrative to women. Instead of being just like a man but better, it is a story of embracing the qualities that women have been associated with throughout history and showing them as a source of power rather than weakness.



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Aeolus451 said:
Hynad said:

What the heck are you talking about?

Aren't beautiful women supposed to be objects? :-O

Sarcasm?

Your detector isn't completely broken.



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I get both points, and I enjoyed the hell out of wonder woman so I'll stick with that lol



Hynad said:
Aeolus451 said:

Sarcasm?

Your detector isn't completely broken.

I have to make sure because this forum tests it constantly. lol



Well PC talkers can all stab each other in the back for all I care.

And sorry to tell the other director. But no, women and men won't be the same in movies or any other place by the simple reason they are different.

Sigourney Weaver or Sarah Connor strenght is believable as females. WW can be believed as it's fiction on Super Heroes... but you can't really portray a female general of WW2 on the front, a swordsman in dark age or other roles that men or women haven't really participated in history, with swapped gender and think it's believable.

Also you can't really make a movie about "real people" that have a woman being the strongest person in the world in muscle aspects. She can win a battle through strategy and wits, but not on physical strength. And even considering strategy and all, there are physical limitations for people.

So anytime a movie goes too much beyond what can be believable it becomes shit (even fictional work if it breaks what is believable inside its own lore can get this feeling).



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

Arminillo said:
In Japan, there is backlash over the movies marketing campaign, something along the lines of "she is a superhero, but she is also innocent, and has never known love". Hearing about that made me realize that they are not wrong.

The premise of Wonder Woman is that a very very powerful woman goes to the normal world, where she is naïve to most things in it (rotating doors, ice cream, people in general), at the end of the movie she is losing to Ares when she remembers what her male love interest told her before he died, "I love you". This confession of love allows her to SUDDENLY BE STRONG ENOUGH TO CURBSTOMP Ares, and the climax of the story ends with her literally talking about the power of love.

As pertaining to what James Cameron said, it's not a step back really, what it is instead I view it as a take contrary to what is the current progressive narrative to women. Instead of being just like a man but better, it is a story of embracing the qualities that women have been associated with throughout history and showing them as a source of power rather than weakness.

And that is what I love in some games that have female leads (like RE), you make the female a strong and good character by making her excell in what you can believe is achievable, not to just make a dudebro with female face.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

Oh look, a gender war.



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