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Forums - General Discussion - Evidence for the existence of God

Phendrana said:
 

I never understood why a loving and infinitely forgiving God would throw you into a pit of eternal suffering for something as simple as not believing in him during such a short time as your life (when compared to all of eternity). This also brings other things into question as well. Not all religious people are morally good, and not all non-religious people are morally bad. So would the religious person be allowed into Heaven over the non-religious person just for having faith? If life were a test of the goodness of a person, why would faith in the existence of God decide if you get into Heaven? Faith has nothing to do with how moral a person is. Or perhaps life is a test of devotion. In that case, wouldn't God make his existence a little more obvious?

Look, i can forgive you for saying i don't exist, and I can invite you to my house, but if you keep insisting it doesn't exist, despite the numerous people that say "yeah, he's just head down that road, you can't miss him", how the hell are you ever going to get there?

Seppukuties is like LBP Lite, on crack. Play it already!

Currently wrapped up in: Half Life, Portal, and User Created Source Mods
Games I want: (Wii)Mario Kart, Okami, Bully, Conduit,  No More Heroes 2 (GC) Eternal Darkness, Killer7, (PS2) Ico, God of War1&2, Legacy of Kain: SR2&Defiance


My Prediction: Wii will be achieve 48% market share by the end of 2008, and will achieve 50% by the end of june of 09. Prediction Failed.

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chriscox1121 said:
Have you all forgotten what the Bible prophesied that the hearts of many would wax cold in the last days. Knowledge will be a big contributor to many peoples hearts waxing cold. Alot of people's God on this website is their "intelligence", which is deceiving them and they don't even realize it. We live in a world where the Devil is the prince of it. The Bible calls him the "Deceiver" Revelations refers to him as " the one who decieved the nations" Alot of you are following in your Father's footsteps (the devil). Why was he kicked out of heaven, because he rebelled against the authority of God and wanted to put His throne above God's. " I will ascend above the most high" And you here today are reflecting the same actions by putting yourself above God. Belittling Christians because you are "above our thinking". Because God is "beneath you", and it's only for the ignorant and unlearned and weak minded. But, he said in His Word the he uses the foolish things to confound the wise and the weak to overcome the strong. He his a revealer of secrets. No amount of this world's wisdom and understanding can obtain it. But it's only through the power of His spirit. For it is written "eye has not seen nor ear has heard nor has it entered into the heart of man, unless it be revealed by the spirit of God." (true wisdom and understanding) Paul said if you want to be wise, become a fool for Christ. Please seek him while it's still day, because night cometheth when no man shall be able to work.

In Him

 Wait wait wait... this is too convenient...

 Bush = Devil?



Numbers: Checker Players > Halo Players

Checkers Age and replayability > Halo Age and replayability

Therefore, Checkers > Halo

So, Checkers is a better game than Halo.

Phendrana said:
chriscox1121 said:
Have you all forgotten what the Bible prophesied that the hearts of many would wax cold in the last days. Knowledge will be a big contributor to many peoples hearts waxing cold. Alot of people's God on this website is their "intelligence", which is deceiving them and they don't even realize it. We live in a world where the Devil is the prince of it. The Bible calls him the "Deceiver" Revelations refers to him as " the one who decieved the nations" Alot of you are following in your Father's footsteps (the devil). Why was he kicked out of heaven, because he rebelled against the authority of God and wanted to put His throne above God's. " I will ascend above the most high" And you here today are reflecting the same actions by putting yourself above God. Belittling Christians because you are "above our thinking". Because God is "beneath you", and it's only for the ignorant and unlearned and weak minded. But, he said in His Word the he uses the foolish things to confound the wise and the weak to overcome the strong. He his a revealer of secrets. No amount of this world's wisdom and understanding can obtain it. But it's only through the power of His spirit. For it is written "eye has not seen nor ear has heard nor has it entered into the heart of man, unless it be revealed by the spirit of God." (true wisdom and understanding) Paul said if you want to be wise, become a fool for Christ. Please seek him while it's still day, because night cometheth when no man shall be able to work.

In Him

So intelligence and knowledge are negative things? I'm not looking down on anyone for their beliefs, but when religion starts telling me to take blind faith over critical thinking, I have a problem. If I were trying to sell you a dog, but I said it was invisible and impossible to detect it in any known way, would you buy it? That's what organized religions seem like to people who don't follow them. It's hard to convey why you don't believe in something someone else does without sounding arrogant. I'm sorry if any of this sounds like belittling to you. It's not meant to. 

Unfortunately, this is where most of the misunderstanding comes from.  The difference in faith and blind assumption. 

The Christian God does not demand that a potential convert take a blind leap into assumption.  What He does want is that the person submit themselves to Him via the revelation they already have of Him. Christian theology does dictate that, in some form, all people have a knowledge of God which they cannot deny  (an example of which would be the universal moral law, which is supported in Christian theology.  I'll give an exegesis of it if wanted). Herein lies God's problem with above-mentioned empiricism ( secular evolution-science, effectively (to distinguish from just science in general, which doesn't contradict Him)).  To rely on one's senses, one's own understanding, is to rebel against the inherent knowledge of Him, is to think that you could somehow trust yourself more than He.  Therefore, when God accuses us of a lack of faith, he is not condemning those who do not assume His existence, but those who do no trust him. 

By the way, the scienctific method, by itself, can't actually prove anything.  Need I mention The Matrix?  Taking our senses as truth is just as assumptuous as the situation presented in the above post.  Not that I'm saying science, from  a Christian perspective, is useless, as it can be used to help others remove their other objections.

 



Okami

To lavish praise upon this title, the assumption of a common plateau between player and game must be made.  I won't open my unworthy mouth.

Christian (+50).  Arminian(+20). AG adherent(+20). YEC(+20). Pre-tribulation Pre-milleniumist (+10).  Republican (+15) Capitalist (+15).  Pro-Nintendo (+5).  Misc. stances (+30).  TOTAL SCORE: 195
  http://quizfarm.com/test.php?q_id=43870 <---- Fun theology quiz

What always bothered me about religion is that whenever anyone today claims to be talking to or have talked to God almost everyone assumes the person is crazy or lying yet many people seem to have no problem entering a Church and believing the exact same claims made be people thousands of years ago.  Why are they any more credible than the people who make the same claims today?



Why are you still talking about this? Religion is gay, gay is religion. Noone needs to say more, as the full truth has hereby been spoken. Shhh!



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Grey Acumen said:
Phendrana said:
 

I never understood why a loving and infinitely forgiving God would throw you into a pit of eternal suffering for something as simple as not believing in him during such a short time as your life (when compared to all of eternity). This also brings other things into question as well. Not all religious people are morally good, and not all non-religious people are morally bad. So would the religious person be allowed into Heaven over the non-religious person just for having faith? If life were a test of the goodness of a person, why would faith in the existence of God decide if you get into Heaven? Faith has nothing to do with how moral a person is. Or perhaps life is a test of devotion. In that case, wouldn't God make his existence a little more obvious?

Look, i can forgive you for saying i don't exist, and I can invite you to my house, but if you keep insisting it doesn't exist, despite the numerous people that say "yeah, he's just head down that road, you can't miss him", how the hell are you ever going to get there?

I have studied the bible for many, many years. Please show me where the bible teaches the doctrine of hellfire. Thats something I have never seen.

And, be careful. You are insinuateing that God is actually not a loving and benvolent being. But is instead vindictive and hate filled. If you go on teaching that... it could be slander. So you will need very concrete evidence.

Here's what I know from the bible.

1)The first thing wen need to ask is "Who Sins?" Well all people make mistakes and sin. No one is perfect. So everyone is in this "sin boat"

2)So then, what is the punishment for sin? Romans 6:23 states specifically that the cost of sin is death. So if one dies...then he is absolved of his sins, he paid his debt so to say.

3)Then we ask, what does this death punishment entail? Ecclesiastes 9:5 says that those who die are conscious of nothing at all. It fails to say the dead are sent to the devil to be tortured for their sins.

4)And finally, how long does this punishment last? Due to Jesus ransom, those who die have the gift of being brought back life. This ressurection according to bible prophecy happens after Armegeddon.

So death is a temporary punihment for sins and it includes no torture... just being dead. Atleast, that is what the bible teaches.  

 

Another thing about the hellfire idea. Satan rebelled against God for his own selfish ideals. Why would he willingly take employment or an assignment from God to torture sinners? Last time I checked, rebels don't decide to do as told.



_____________________________________________________

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senseinobaka said:

And, be careful. You are insinuateing that God is actually not a loving and benvolent being. But is instead vindictive and hate filled. If you go on teaching that... it could be slander. So you will need very concrete evidence.

If this God is so loving and benevolent why did he/she/it set up an Animal Kingdom that is so incredibly cruel?  Or do you think a system in which the meek and weak are viciously torn apart is the handiwork of a loving and benevolent being?



Revelation 20: 15 directly states "And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire". Jesus himself refers to the judgement of Hell, e.g., "... It is better for you to lose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to go into hell". There are many, many other verses that say the like. And furthermore, contrary to popular belief, the devil doesn't actually reign over hell. He is supposed to be sent there in the end as well.



Okami

To lavish praise upon this title, the assumption of a common plateau between player and game must be made.  I won't open my unworthy mouth.

Christian (+50).  Arminian(+20). AG adherent(+20). YEC(+20). Pre-tribulation Pre-milleniumist (+10).  Republican (+15) Capitalist (+15).  Pro-Nintendo (+5).  Misc. stances (+30).  TOTAL SCORE: 195
  http://quizfarm.com/test.php?q_id=43870 <---- Fun theology quiz

Watch this movie, it's 2 hours long, but worth it...

http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/



Legend11 said:
senseinobaka said:

And, be careful. You are insinuateing that God is actually not a loving and benvolent being. But is instead vindictive and hate filled. If you go on teaching that... it could be slander. So you will need very concrete evidence.

If this God is so loving and benevolent why did he/she/it set up an Animal Kingdom that is so incredibly cruel? Or do you think a system in which the meek and weak are viciously torn apart is the handiwork of a loving and benevolent being?

Maybe because then you value being a human being? Well, I do at least. WE are supposed to be God's children, and you're saying he's supposed to be worrying about all the animals too? They aren't considered equal to humans, and really, would you want to be raised by parents who treat their pets better than they treat you?

It's harsh, sure, but that's kinda the point. We aren't living in Heaven, we're living on EARTH. A cruel rough place that we've got to be able to grow up and out of if we want to be able to experience something that's perfect.

 Oh, and if you're going to argue, why doesn't he just let us into heaven to begin with, if it's such a great place. Well, quite frankly, i don't know about you, but the amount of enjoyment I get from beating a game is always directly proportional to how difficult it was to beat. If the game started off with me beating it without even having to play it, it wouldn't have any value to me at all.



Seppukuties is like LBP Lite, on crack. Play it already!

Currently wrapped up in: Half Life, Portal, and User Created Source Mods
Games I want: (Wii)Mario Kart, Okami, Bully, Conduit,  No More Heroes 2 (GC) Eternal Darkness, Killer7, (PS2) Ico, God of War1&2, Legacy of Kain: SR2&Defiance


My Prediction: Wii will be achieve 48% market share by the end of 2008, and will achieve 50% by the end of june of 09. Prediction Failed.

<- Click to see more of her