My developer is better than your developer and I will waste my time trying to prove it to you on a website and possibly rage in my futile attempt to do so.

I ask for the sake of arguement....what has Kojima done in the innovation department?

You can't? Really now....

You've impled that Miyamoto is only CAPABLE of Mario type games and Wii games in an earlier post, which frankly, sounds like a knee-jerk reaction, or prodding.

Now you're out and out stating that Miyamoto "isn't that great" with a justification of logic being "what has he done for us lately." Allow me to retort.

1. Miyamoto designed the arcade game Donkey Kong which is still competitively played to this day. The level of depth and quality in that game surpass most current gen games, and look what he had to work with. Look what videogames were at the time.

2. In 1998, Miyamoto was inducted into the Academy of Interactive Arts and Sciences' Hall of Fame He was the first inductee.

3. Here is a list of games he created or helped create according to Wikipedia:

• Donkey Kong (1981)
• Mario Bros. (1983)
• Super Mario Bros. (1985)
• Super Mario Bros. 2 (1986)
• The Legend of Zelda (1987)
• Super Mario Bros. 3 (1988)
• The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past (1991)
• Super Mario Kart (1992)
• Pokémon Red and Blue (1996)
• Super Mario 64 (1996)
• The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time (1998)
• Super Smash Bros. Melee (2001)
• Super Mario Sunshine (2002)
• Metroid Prime (2002)
• The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker (2002)
• Super Mario Galaxy (2007)
• Super Smash Bros. Brawl (2008)
• New Super Mario Bros. Wii (2009)

No, I'm not leaving out the "bad" ones. Those are them. That's the list. Unedited.

I'll leave it to you, to work out how those games influenced gaming from that point onward.

4. On November 28, 2006, Miyamoto was featured in TIME Asia's "60 Years of Asian Heroes," alongside Hayao Miyazaki, Mahatma Gandhi, Mother Teresa, Bruce Lee and the Dalai Lama^.

5. He was later chosen as one of Time Magazine's 100 Most Influential People of the Year in both 2007 and also in 2008, in which he topped the list with a total vote of 1,766,424.

6. Both GameTrailers and IGN placed Miyamoto first on their lists for the "Top Ten Game Creators" and the "Top 100 Game Creators of All Time" respectively.

7. In a survey of game developers by industry publication Develop, 30% of the developers chose Miyamoto as their "Ultimate Development Hero". Miyamoto has been interviewed by companies and organizations such as CNN's Talk Asia and NextLevel.com.

7. He's helped reinvigorate Nintendo and the casual market by brainstorming games based on his hobbies.

8. He's been involved with many games not in the earlier list, many of which are considered "AAA". He has also contributed to the evolution of videogame hardware with ideas and insight.

9. His game Ocarina of Time is vastly popular, and generally accepted as the highest reviewed game of all time with a 97.66 average on gamerankings, a record approaching the 12 year mark.

Information obtained from Wikipedia.com and my personal deductions, and should be taken as "opinion" when applicable.

Also, let's look at Kojima. Great developer. He's developed MGS1, 2, 3, and 4, MGS spinoffs and the Zone of Enders series amongst other games. As stated earlier, he innovated in the stealth-action department with gameplay and narrative length(which no game has ever really emulated, so I don't see how that has been a very influential innovation(and it certainly is one many people complain about)). Let me not diminish him, he is a great developer.

....but Miyamoto has changed gaming.

....has Kojima changed gaming, and influenced vast amounts of other games with his work?

....do you believe that Miyamoto hasn't?

Whatever you think of Miyamoto's recent work, that doesn't change the innovations he has brought to the industry, and saying that "he is not that great" is a detriment to his legacy imho, but you have a right to your opinion.

Not only is he "that great" imo, he is almost certainly the greatest developer of all time, according to the largest minority, or perhaps the only majority of gaming industry journalists currently living I would wager.

I think that Ueda has just as much of an argument as "best developer." However, neither of those developers created games that influence the majority of games that followed them. Nor have they been as recognizned for their achievements, nor have they developed with enough consistancy and success(critical and monetary) to compare them to the a developer like Miyamoto. I don't even think Kojima has a huge loyal following, considering how many fans on this website threw him under the bus in the Ueda vs Kojima post after Rising was announced.

Sure, you have your opinion, but I strongly disagree.

Now I'm not really a devout follower of Miyamoto, but I recognize great achievements when I see them, and it's easy to make light of them without giving it much thought, but I'm not sure you realize how much effort and talent has been put forth and what monumental achievements those I've listed above are for one person to achieve in one short lifetime.....Just because you didn't like Wii Music DOES NOT mean he is "not that great."

...and for the record, you are implying that the MGS series is better than the Mario series, right, and that the Mario series itself is "not that great" or "not a significant accomplishment" on its own?

Kojima the most legendary developer in the business? I lol'd. XD

Also, LttP was, imho, a great revamping of the series on the SNES, and one of my favorite games ever made. Also, Zelda II was completely different from the first game....

I mean, yeah bro, at the very least MGS AND the Mario/Zelda series' are all great, and opinion comes down to which one is best.....not fact....also, one thing that I'm against is the "what have you done for us lately" argument. I think of it as "what have you done for gaming, and how have you changed gaming?" Has Kojima changed gaming? Miyamoto has, numerous times, correct?

Also, LTTP was, imho, a great revamping of the series on the SNES, and one of my favorite games ever made. Also, Zelda II was completely different from the first game....

I mean, yeah bro, at the very least MGS AND the Mario/Zelda series' are all great, and opinion comes down to which one is best.....not fact....also, one thing that I'm against is the "what have you done for us lately" argument. I think of it as "what have you done for gaming, and how have you changed gaming?" Has Kojima changed gaming? Miyamoto has, numerous times, correct?

This is a double post caused by "site is under maintainance" indication. Please ignore it.

Zone of The Enders
Botaki
Snatcher
Polienauts

Tokimeki Memorial Drama

And pretty soon we can put Castlevania under his belt too

It can be argued that it was Kojima's games that created and/or revitalized the stealth Genre. We can also safely say that because of Kojima games have started to take a more cinematic apporach to the way they deliever their story-telling. Miyamoto is great but when defending him please don't try and take anything away from Kojima-san.

I personally believe they both can be mentioned in the same breath together because of their body of works....Gabe Newell on the other hand I don't think so.