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Forums - Sales Discussion - Sony may have a profitability problem from falling PS3 software sales.

GreyianStorm said:
Kenryoku_Maxis said:
dolemit3 said:
The collapsing sales from PS2 and PSP will hurt more

Not really.  While the PSP sales are hurting, they can drop the platform eventually if they want to.  And PS3 SHOULD have been a replacement for PS2 long ago.  There's just 2 major reasons it hasn't been replaced yet.  One, its overwhelming past success which is still keeping it afloat as a viable platform and because the PS3 has yet to perform well enough to allow the PS2 to be retired.

In the end, these figures (as posted by the opening post) just tend to confirm one thing.  That Sony's moves with the PS3 are not a major improvement that will make them overtake its competition or a wild hail mary which somehow made the PS3 more popular, but more of a 'last resort' of price cuts and backdoor deals to just help the PS3 somehow break even.  And even then, it may only hold the system off for a couple years before Sony is once again back to losing muti-millions of dollars, even with a system that has a larger userbase and more third party support.

In a few years, Sony *should* be breaking even on the hardware, so they shouldn't be back to "losing multi-millions of dollars" (they are now, but we're talking about falling momentum causing losses, not the current scenario). In that case, it will be more a case of not being able to earn enough to make up for past losses. In a couple of years though, Sony should not be losing money on the PlayStation 3 per quarter/year etc, it will just be an overall loss (that will either move towards even quickly or slowly, though may never reach it completely).

We shall see.

As Microsoft has shown us, you can have a console with increasing marketshare and popularity, but that is losing more and more money each fiscal quarter.  Even though Sony had an upswing this year, they're not out of the woods.



Six upcoming games you should look into:

 

  

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LOOOOL
and of course ps3 is doomed.



PLAYSTATION®3

Squilliam has a point, but at this point SONY just needs to work on cutting PS3 hardware costs while lasting out this generation.

IMO SONY needs to aim for $60 - $70 in hardware reductions by holiday 2010 (at which point a $50 price drop would be useful)



RolStoppable said:

However, none of the numbers presented in the original post are of any real use. You can't draw a definite conclusion from a single year of data from only a few consoles. You would have to look at more years and past consoles. Unfortunately, that's not really possible since the sales database for anything prior to this generation is incomplete.

Then again, it isn't necessary anyway. It's common sense that Sony may/will have profitability problems from (possibly) falling PS3 software sales. The PlayStation business posted losses for three years straight (with the exception of one holiday quarter) and the PS2 and PSP (the current money makers) are approaching the end of their lifecycles. Since PS3 hardware isn't likely to make any significant profit in the foreseeable future, it all comes down to how much PS3 software they are able to sell, because this is the only system they have left which isn't on its way out. Also, the real money in the video game business is always in the software.

Im actually basing this thread on data provided by Thesource with much more indepth analysis from memory. Unfortunately I didn't have the foresight to bookmark the post. In it he showed that the sales software peak between 6 months and a year after the hardware peak. So what he said was 'software peak year 4, hardware peak year 3' or something along those lines. I can't find this much better and in depth proof after some searching. I simply don't really have the motivation to give a complete proof as most people who read it will dismiss it out of hand anyway.

The thing is the software sales which the PS3 relies upon are not rising in a 1:1 fashion with their hardware sales. The reason why I point it out specifically in their case is because they unlike the other two console makers rely the most on overall software sales to be high as their other sources of revenue aren't as strong. Microsoft has Xbox Live and cheaper hardware and Nintendo has the cheapest hardware and a massive stack of accessory sales. Furthermore they unlike the other two are the furthest from profit and are still going in the wrong direction to achieve their goals.

Another point I wished to make in another thread was that the Wii proves that Sony's business strategy in the console business was or is flawed. Even their strategy with the PS1 and PS2 which was to aggressively engage in price competition with weaker selling consoles cost them a lot of profit and in the end failed to drive out more than one competitor from the market (Sega). For example they if they cut the price of the PS2 by $50 and both Nintendo and Microsoft do the same, because they sold 5x the quantity of consoles as the other two then they take 5x the hit in engaging in aggressive price wars.

 

 



Tease.

u guys can't read? dont feed the stealth troll



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So which software numbers are you using exactly to make your point ?

Because the total software sales on VGChartz are not accurate, even ioi has already mentioned this in the past...

Secondly you're assuming PS3 peaked this year , nooone knows this...

Finally software sales and attach rate for a console tend to peak and stabilize once it starts to reach more casual customers that tend to purchase less software...
With 30 or so million PS3 sold I don't think the percentage of casual owners is that huge....



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !

Finally here is a Gamasutra analysis that contradicts your own.
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/25740/Analysis_Wii_Software_Sales_Slow_Down_In_2009.php

First 9 months of 2009, PS3 software sales were up 20% in the US...
At the same time PS3 hardware sales were down .

Kinda doesn't match your ' hardware sales need to go up by 33% for software sales to be stable' analysis.........



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !

Ail said:
So which software numbers are you using exactly to make your point ?

Because the total software sales on VGChartz are not accurate, even ioi has already mentioned this in the past...

Secondly you're assuming PS3 peaked this year , nooone knows this...

Finally software sales and attach rate for a console tend to peak and stabilize once it starts to reach more casual customers that tend to purchase less software...
With 30 or so million PS3 sold I don't think the percentage of casual owners is that huge....

The software numbers from the weekly software charts. The individual titles may not be accurate, but the overall sales of software are and Sony and Microsoft and Nintendo have all released attach rates from which overall software sales can be extrapolated.

For the PS3 to peak next year they will have to sell greater than 12.5M consoles and they if all else remains the same they will almost certainly be down in terms of total hardware YOY from September onwards. I would say its possible that the last time they are up YOY for the generation could be in June or so next year when GT5 ships.

With 30M consoles sold then who have they sold their consoles to? The software sales for individual titles don't indicate a hardcore dominated audience, the attach rates are the same as casual platforms like the Wii...



Tease.

Btw thats NPD and not the world.



Tease.

Squilliam said:
Ail said:
So which software numbers are you using exactly to make your point ?

Because the total software sales on VGChartz are not accurate, even ioi has already mentioned this in the past...

Secondly you're assuming PS3 peaked this year , nooone knows this...

Finally software sales and attach rate for a console tend to peak and stabilize once it starts to reach more casual customers that tend to purchase less software...
With 30 or so million PS3 sold I don't think the percentage of casual owners is that huge....

The software numbers from the weekly software charts. The individual titles may not be accurate, but the overall sales of software are and Sony and Microsoft and Nintendo have all released attach rates from which overall software sales can be extrapolated.

For the PS3 to peak next year they will have to sell greater than 12.5M consoles and they if all else remains the same they will almost certainly be down in terms of total hardware YOY from September onwards. I would say its possible that the last time they are up YOY for the generation could be in June or so next year when GT5 ships.

With 30M consoles sold then who have they sold their consoles to? The software sales for individual titles don't indicate a hardcore dominated audience, the attach rates are the same as casual platforms like the Wii...

 

Actually it's the opposite.

Data for indivudal titles, especially those that sell in the top 50 is pretty accurate , it's the overall data that is less....

As for the data released by Sony/Microsoft and Nintendo, that data is based on shipped software, not sold software....



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !