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Forums - Microsoft - why Japanese not support xbox? but US has a lot ps fans

marc said:
It looks to me that Japan doesnt want home consoles any more and therefor they will be less likely to buy multiple consoles. Look at it from their point of view, if you were to buy just 1 console, and you were Japanese, which console would buy? The unproven 360 with a few Japanese games and a shaky relationship with your favorite companies or a Nintendo/PS3 with a long history of great japanese games? The answer is clear just as it is clear for us in the USA. Our choice here would be the 360 and the choice there is the Wii/PS3.

The 360 had more Japanese games than Sony (including Japanese exclusives) whilst they still denied it. It was not unproven. Sony was the brand that never proved themselves until the first two years were up.



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Neoraf said:
huaxiong90 said:
MontanaHatchet said:
This is what happens every time someone asks this question (and this question has been asked here many, many times):

1. One guy comes in and insults the Japanese.

2. A couple people claim that the Japanese are really xenophobic.

3. Everyone misses the real point.

Microsoft royally fucked up with the first Xbox. They came into the market with nothing but Dead or Alive 3 to appeal to the Japanese market. The original Xbox had everything going against it. The console itself was huge, which was terrible for Japanese homes. The controller was also enormous, which was terrible for Japanese hands. And the system itself was plentiful with shooters and action games, but very little that appealed to the Japanese market. Then, Microsoft made the same idiotic mistakes again with the 360, and they thought they could fix them a couple years later by buying off developers to make some fairly "meh" JRPGs for the system. It gave them a great sales boost, and the 360 sold more than the PS3 several times (and even more than the Wii a couple times!). But eventually the Japanese realized that these RPGs that the 360 had were fairly average, that the system was pretty much absent of games that appealed to them besides those, and that if they wanted RPGs, they should just go to the handheld consoles.

Microsoft will likely never win the Japanese market, they should just give up.

Well, it's not just that, but also because some of those games are getting an upgraded version exclusively for the PS3.

Wait... it's a non-issue,
it applies only on 2 games from the 360's JRPG library.
2 out of 12 games.

Tales of Vesperia (OK)
Star Ocean 4: The Last Hope (OK)
Eternal Sonata (same on 360/PS3)
Enchanted Arms (same on 360/PS3)
Final Fantasy XI (upgraded version from PS2)
Phantasy Star Universe (upgraded version from PS2)
Lost Odyssey (Microsoft exclusive)
Spectral Force 3 (Microsoft exclusive)
The Last Remnant (Microsoft exclusive)
Magna Carta 2 (Microsoft exclusive)
Blue Dragon (Microsoft exclusive)
Unfinite Undiscovery (Microsoft exclusive)


In reality, Xbox360 is (today) the JRPG undisputed home-console champion.
Biggest collection to this day.
Add to that the biggest collection of WRPG with exclusives like Mass Effect, Fable2, Oblivion, Kingdom Under Fire and you got 'THE' RPG console.


Exactly! The 360 has been the definitive RPG console.



1337 Gamer said:
its because the Xbox doesn't have the type of games that Japanese gamers want. Besides that Japanese gamers tend to buy products made in japan.

Your latter sentence is correct. Secondly the Xbox 360 had games Japanese people wanted to buy. The backed them into a corner forcing them to buy the 360 with all the JRPG's.



arsenicazure said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
arsenicazure said:
To suggest that the rest of the world should be thankful for american over-consumerism is ridiculous. I guess we should thank them for climate change, high oil prices, the current recession and wars in the middle east too then.

Asia and Europe contribute to global warming as well in a major way. The more industrialized those nations get the worse the CO2 emissions will get. High oil prices are not just an American problem but an Asian problem as well. The American people are not to blame for the recession. Blame the banks and the community reinvestment act for causing subprime levels to go through the roof. America is not alone in the worlds problems.

Before I am booed off sounding anti american,I suggest you do some research youself. Sub prime mortgage crisis is what kicked off this huge crisis. The banks, all of which were responsible for this crisis- were primarily american- over 120+ failed banks in the US the past year. Americans have the highest per capita fuel consumption the world- hovering near 25 barrels of oil per capita per annum. how about asian giants like India and China.. its somwehre near 0.5-3 barrels per capita. Guess which country didnt sign the kyoto protocol: USA. Guess which country contibutes the most to pollution. USA.  To say that americans themselves are not responsible for their own banks is ludicrious. You cant excuse ignorance. Wars in the middle east are partly responsible for the high oil prices. And guess who has fought the last 2 wars in the middle east. USA.

So before you go blaming Asia and europe I suggest you read up a lil on your own backyard.

I basically just told you that the subprime crisis that was caused by the community reinvestment act enacted by Jimmy Carter. I don't need to research this any more, because i've already done it. The banks accepted the deal and overinflated the market. Americans have the highest per capita fuel consumption because our electric car market was destroyed by special interest oil companies. Our MPG should have average over 70/100 miles per electrical charge because the electric car patent was made in america and destroyed by the oil companies. As I said...our automobile industry was sabotaged, thus making American people look like slaves. China has made a deal with Venezuela and other parts of South America to take up a large quantities of oil that we were once getting. China has huge pollution problems as well. Wars in the middle east are not raising oil prices. It's making sure we have MORE oil to consume. The oil companies who take over inflated the prices beyond demand thus the reason for the huge drop in gasoline demand before Bush left office. America may be a great disturbance in the middle east.....but I think you should learn a little lesson. Warring in the middle east doesn't help America, but a few wealthy business interests who profit off of war and happen to by chummy with those in power (IE: Bush). 

I already know about things in my own backyard and your media is just as biased as ours. If you don't think you're anti-American you kinda are. You need to learn to blame the proper people instead of blaming the population whom are controlled by them. I blame your media for why you guys are mainly anti-American and I blame my media for feeding us bullshit about europe. As for consumption Europe has a higher population of people coupled with highly industrialized nation, therefore you need to take some responsibility with global warming as well. Secondly if I were you I would calm down, because if the American dollar were ever to fall the Euro goes with it.



Neoraf said:
huaxiong90 said:
MontanaHatchet said:
This is what happens every time someone asks this question (and this question has been asked here many, many times):

1. One guy comes in and insults the Japanese.

2. A couple people claim that the Japanese are really xenophobic.

3. Everyone misses the real point.

Microsoft royally fucked up with the first Xbox. They came into the market with nothing but Dead or Alive 3 to appeal to the Japanese market. The original Xbox had everything going against it. The console itself was huge, which was terrible for Japanese homes. The controller was also enormous, which was terrible for Japanese hands. And the system itself was plentiful with shooters and action games, but very little that appealed to the Japanese market. Then, Microsoft made the same idiotic mistakes again with the 360, and they thought they could fix them a couple years later by buying off developers to make some fairly "meh" JRPGs for the system. It gave them a great sales boost, and the 360 sold more than the PS3 several times (and even more than the Wii a couple times!). But eventually the Japanese realized that these RPGs that the 360 had were fairly average, that the system was pretty much absent of games that appealed to them besides those, and that if they wanted RPGs, they should just go to the handheld consoles.

Microsoft will likely never win the Japanese market, they should just give up.

Well, it's not just that, but also because some of those games are getting an upgraded version exclusively for the PS3.

Wait... it's a non-issue,
it applies only on 2 games from the 360's JRPG library.
2 out of 12 games.

Tales of Vesperia (OK)
Star Ocean 4: The Last Hope (OK)
Eternal Sonata (same on 360/PS3)
Enchanted Arms (same on 360/PS3)
Final Fantasy XI (upgraded version from PS2)
Phantasy Star Universe (upgraded version from PS2)
Lost Odyssey (Microsoft exclusive)
Spectral Force 3 (Microsoft exclusive)
The Last Remnant (Microsoft exclusive)
Magna Carta 2 (Microsoft exclusive)
Blue Dragon (Microsoft exclusive)
Unfinite Undiscovery (Microsoft exclusive)


In reality, Xbox360 is (today) the JRPG undisputed home-console champion.
Biggest collection to this day.
Add to that the biggest collection of WRPG with exclusives like Mass Effect, Fable2, Oblivion, Kingdom Under Fire and you got 'THE' RPG console.


Hence why I said "some". Aside from Lost Odyssey, all these JRPG's didn't do great sales numbers or critic scores. Not that I'm taking a jab at these games, but that's the truth of it. The Japanese aren't going to trust Xbox 360 JRPG exclusives anymore.

 

WRPG's have nothing to do with the argument at hand. But I'm glad to see you love your Xbox 360 so much (No sarcasm intended).



Rockstar: Announce Bully 2 already and make gamers proud!

Kojima: Come out with Project S already!

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S.T.A.G.E. said:
Neoraf said:
huaxiong90 said:
MontanaHatchet said:
This is what happens every time someone asks this question (and this question has been asked here many, many times):

1. One guy comes in and insults the Japanese.

2. A couple people claim that the Japanese are really xenophobic.

3. Everyone misses the real point.

Microsoft royally fucked up with the first Xbox. They came into the market with nothing but Dead or Alive 3 to appeal to the Japanese market. The original Xbox had everything going against it. The console itself was huge, which was terrible for Japanese homes. The controller was also enormous, which was terrible for Japanese hands. And the system itself was plentiful with shooters and action games, but very little that appealed to the Japanese market. Then, Microsoft made the same idiotic mistakes again with the 360, and they thought they could fix them a couple years later by buying off developers to make some fairly "meh" JRPGs for the system. It gave them a great sales boost, and the 360 sold more than the PS3 several times (and even more than the Wii a couple times!). But eventually the Japanese realized that these RPGs that the 360 had were fairly average, that the system was pretty much absent of games that appealed to them besides those, and that if they wanted RPGs, they should just go to the handheld consoles.

Microsoft will likely never win the Japanese market, they should just give up.

Well, it's not just that, but also because some of those games are getting an upgraded version exclusively for the PS3.

Wait... it's a non-issue,
it applies only on 2 games from the 360's JRPG library.
2 out of 12 games.

Tales of Vesperia (OK)
Star Ocean 4: The Last Hope (OK)
Eternal Sonata (same on 360/PS3)
Enchanted Arms (same on 360/PS3)
Final Fantasy XI (upgraded version from PS2)
Phantasy Star Universe (upgraded version from PS2)
Lost Odyssey (Microsoft exclusive)
Spectral Force 3 (Microsoft exclusive)
The Last Remnant (Microsoft exclusive)
Magna Carta 2 (Microsoft exclusive)
Blue Dragon (Microsoft exclusive)
Unfinite Undiscovery (Microsoft exclusive)


In reality, Xbox360 is (today) the JRPG undisputed home-console champion.
Biggest collection to this day.
Add to that the biggest collection of WRPG with exclusives like Mass Effect, Fable2, Oblivion, Kingdom Under Fire and you got 'THE' RPG console.


Exactly! The 360 has been the definitive RPG console.

Of course I won't disagree, but that has nothing to do with my point.



Rockstar: Announce Bully 2 already and make gamers proud!

Kojima: Come out with Project S already!

S.T.A.G.E. said:
LordMatrix said:
gamelover2000 said:
japanese devs dont really support the Xbox 360 so it gets little attention over there.. nationalism plays a huge role to

Actually japanese developers are supportign the X360 quite nicely. It's the japanese consumers that are hardly supportign it. It's a crime I say!

AS for OP NA has a huge number of X360 fans. A lot more in fact than the PS3 does. The reason it might seem like there might be more for PS3 is simply because Sony fanboys like to act liek that annoying neighbor you have down the street that always swears up and down they are right and you are wrong and you keep wishing you could just get rid of them because their nothing but a nuisance.

Yeah, the Japanese devs supported the 360 real good this year. It took Microsofts development and timed-exclusive money to make PS3 games cause Sony refused to pay them a cent. Not only did they remake the games, they made them superior for a country that will barely even support those titles even though they are Japanese style action/ JRPG's.

I totally understand  what you are getting at. My opinion/view on the matter is this: If you looked back at last gen compared to this gen there are a TON of major japanese developed games on or coming to X360 and it's nearly equal to it on PS3 as far as major franchises from japan are concerned. During the Xbox days we got maybe one jrpg called Metal Dungeon which was atrocious. Metal Gear Solid 2 came out but it was such a quiet release hardly anyone knew or seemed to care. We also never got Resident Evil, Tekken, Final Fantasy, Tales of..., Star Ocean, Devil May Cry, Ace Combat etc. Not only that but looking at this current gen we have HUGE support from Namco Bandai, Square-Enix, Sega, Konami, Tecmo-Koei etc. Support has skyrocketed in Japan IMO. Another interesting tidbit is that this gen X360 is even getting some more of the niche games like: Cross Edge Dash, Agarest Wars and Spectral Force 3. If you asked me in early 2005 if anything like this would have happened for X360 I would have admited it be awesome but likely never happen. Well here we are in late 2009 and some of my biggest dreams I never thought would ever come to fruition are now a reality!

As for your comment on feeling a bit screwed with certain games I can agree on that but to me it hardly holds a candle to what said above. Ninja Gaiden Sigma 2 is BS, Tales of Vesperia PS3 is BS and so on. I have to also look at it this way though. I would have rather been able to play these games when they came out for X360 than wait an extra year or more for the same game with additonal features added. Tales of Vesperia PS3 might not even release outside Japan and Star Ocean:TLH PS3 comes out here so much later than it did on X360 that the game is old news to me now. Ninja Gaiden Sigma 2 has some nice additions but a lot of it feels tacted on to me and just didn't feel right. I can deal with waiting a few months for a game to come out on my prefered platform but the amount of time these games had/have been taking is WAY too long for my taste.



 How our favorite systems are just like humans and sometimes have issues finding their special someone...

Xbox 360 wants to KinectPS3 wants to Move!  Why are both systems having such relationship problems?  The reason is they both become so infactuated with desire while watching the Wii as it waggles on by. They simply want what they can't have.

 Official member of the Xbox 360 Squad

I love how people in this thread are calling the Japanese xenophobic and then insulting every citizen of Japan.



(Former) Lead Moderator and (Eternal) VGC Detective

huaxiong90 said:

Hence why I said "some". Aside from Lost Odyssey, all these JRPG's didn't do great sales numbers or critic scores. Not that I'm taking a jab at these games, but that's the truth of it. The Japanese aren't going to trust Xbox 360 JRPG exclusives anymore.

Third-party Xbox 360 jrpg exclusives, I can understand. But the first-party exclusives aren't going anywhere so there's absolutely zero risk in buying Blue Dragon, Lost Odyssey, Infinite Undiscovery (owned by MS), etc. Also contrary to popular perception, the majority of Japanese third-party Xbox 360 exclusives stayed exclusive.

The problem is, these games don't have big names like Final Fantasy, Gran Turismo, MGS or Hot Shots Golf (big in Japan). The Japanese gamer may look at the Xbox 360 and think it has merit because of all the jrpgs, quirkly Japanese games (Idolmaster), visual novels, dating sims and shmups it has but if they are only going to choose one console, they are going to go with the console that has the name brands they are used to. It's as simple as that. To ask Japanese gamers to pay $300 more for an extra piece of hardware when they can invest that money in games for consoles they already have, not every gamer is going to be up for that. Especially when the home console market in Japan has shrunk so much.

At the end of the day, M$ succeeded in building a hardcore following in Japan that accounts for 8.5% of current gen hardware and 10.6% of current gen software. That is a big moral victory for the Xbox division. The Xbox 360 has a very strong niche appeal: a mix of western games with niche Japanese games. And the hardcore fanatics are crazy enough to buy timed exclusives first on the 360 because they can't wait.

The Last Remnant sold 180k in Japan even though it was already announced before release that TLR would later on be released to Windows and PS3 (at the time we didn't know the PS3 version would be cancelled). And considering that The Last Remnant was one of the top selling 360 games (sold a little less than ToV on 360), even though the Japanese expected the PC and PS3 versions to come out later, that shows that timed exclusivity actually works. Obviously ideally first-party exclusives are better but third-party timed exclusivity can win over a lot of hardcore Japanese gamers.

Also while the Tales and Star Ocean moneyhatting pissed off a lot of Tales and Star Ocean fans that went out and bought a 360 for just these games, I think this scenario also influenced some 360 buyers to give the more niche Japanese games (that have remained exclusive) and western games a try. Think about it. Say you already own a PS3 and now a 360 because you bought it for Tales and SO. Are you just going to sell off your 360 because Tales and SO jumped ship later on? You might as well make the most of your purchase and try the niche Japanese games and western games that have remained exclusive. You already paid for the console, might as well use it right?



loves2splooge said:
huaxiong90 said:

Hence why I said "some". Aside from Lost Odyssey, all these JRPG's didn't do great sales numbers or critic scores. Not that I'm taking a jab at these games, but that's the truth of it. The Japanese aren't going to trust Xbox 360 JRPG exclusives anymore.

Third-party Xbox 360 jrpg exclusives, I can understand. But the first-party exclusives aren't going anywhere so there's absolutely zero risk in buying Blue Dragon, Lost Odyssey, Infinite Undiscovery (owned by MS), etc. Also contrary to popular perception, the majority of Japanese third-party Xbox 360 exclusives stayed exclusive.

The problem is, these games don't have big names like Final Fantasy, Gran Turismo, MGS or Hot Shots Golf (big in Japan). The Japanese gamer may look at the Xbox 360 and think it has merit because of all the jrpgs, quirkly Japanese games (Idolmaster), visual novels, dating sims and shmups it has but if they are only going to choose one console, they are going to go with the console that has the name brands they are used to. It's as simple as that. To ask Japanese gamers to pay $300 more for an extra piece of hardware when they can invest that money in games for consoles they already have, not every gamer is going to be up for that. Especially when the home console market in Japan has shrunk so much.

At the end of the day, M$ succeeded in building a hardcore following in Japan that accounts for 8.5% of current gen hardware and 10.6% of current gen software. That is a big moral victory for the Xbox division. The Xbox 360 has a very strong niche appeal: a mix of western games with niche Japanese games. And the hardcore fanatics are crazy enough to buy timed exclusives first on the 360 because they can't wait.

The Last Remnant sold 180k in Japan even though it was already announced before release that TLR would later on be released to Windows and PS3 (at the time we didn't know the PS3 version would be cancelled). And considering that The Last Remnant was one of the top selling 360 games (sold a little less than ToV on 360), even though the Japanese expected the PC and PS3 versions to come out later, that shows that timed exclusivity actually works. Obviously ideally first-party exclusives are better but third-party timed exclusivity can win over a lot of hardcore Japanese gamers.

Also while the Tales and Star Ocean moneyhatting pissed off a lot of Tales and Star Ocean fans that went out and bought a 360 for just these games, I think this scenario also influenced some 360 buyers to give the more niche Japanese games (that have remained exclusive) and western games a try. Think about it. Say you already own a PS3 and now a 360 because you bought it for Tales and SO. Are you just going to sell off your 360 because Tales and SO jumped ship later on? You might as well make the most of your purchase and try the niche Japanese games and western games that have remained exclusive. You already paid for the console, might as well use it right?

Trust me, I know that, and I never implied all of them jumped ship. As for Lost Odyssey and Blue Dragon, I wasn't including them in the whole 1 year timed exclusivity deals. I was just talking about their quality and sales, and neither one did great numbers in Japan than they normally would (meaning if it was on the PS3 instead, or even the Wii) or with critics, unfortunately... LO did much better than expected in the west, though.

 

As for the blue, I sure do hope you're right. I do feel the Japanese should be giving more console games a try, instead of limiting themselves to handhelds.



Rockstar: Announce Bully 2 already and make gamers proud!

Kojima: Come out with Project S already!