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Forums - Sales Discussion - Natal will put 360 on top for the rest of the generation

--OkeyDokey-- said:
binary solo said:
I dunno why everyone is so down on the PSWand. The success of the PSWand is dependant on exactly the same thing as Natal: compelling software.

PSWand releases with a decent serving of fun casual games, and innovative "hardcore" titles it will succeed. If it shows up with a couple of lame minigame titles and nothing to get the "hardcore" motivated it will fall and fade faster than the PSPGo.

Same goes for Natal.

It's that simple.

it looks ridiculous for one. It's even more button challenged than the Wii remote. There's no analogue stick. You have to hold a dualshock in one hand and the wand with the other to play RE5.

The E3 presentation was impressive but amateurish. Sony doesn't seem all that serious about it. It's like they heard Microsoft was going to have a big showing and they just slapped together whatever they had. As a result, Natal has the media on its side. And by the looks of it, 3rd parties, too.

So:

You've seen the commercially available PSwand to judge its look? If there's one thing you should trust Sony on (still) it's that they don't make shitty looking hardware. If the PSWand looks anything like the dev prototype it'll pretty much be the first time Sony has made an objectively crap looking product (other hardware isn't to people's taste looks-wise, but they definitely have aesthetic appeal to many. The lollipop wand would offend everyone's aesthetic sensibilities, except maybe those of an infant). Sony isn't going to get a massive marketing campaign into gear until they have the final look of the wand nailed down. Don't expect to see any big press until then.

And yeah, Sony has only spent who knows how much money on the R&D for the PSWand because they have sooo much money they can afford to throw it away on technology they don't believe in and aren't too worried about making a profit from.

Do we know the PSWand doesn't have 3rd parties on board? The only 3rd party studio I've read about who mentioned Natal also said they are working on the Wand too. And isn't RE5 made by a 3rd party...which is confirmed as having PSWand functionality? Only the VG geeks really care about names of studios lined up behind a new peripheral device with no announced games for it. The mass market will only sit up and take notice when the games themselves are announced, and better yet when the trailers for said games get released.

You may have a point on the ease of use, we'll see I guess. I would find it very surprising if the PSWand ended up as only capable of being used by people with 18+ dexterity, and still being fiddly.

What I wrote is still true: it will come down to software for both devices.

I have the PSEye already, if the PSWand has reasonable aesthetic style and it releases bundled with a kid friendly minigames title (that isn't total crap) at a reasonable price, then I'll be getting it fairly soon after release (provided I don't have another $1500 car repair bill between now and then). I WILL avoid the PSWand if it has the lollipop style, no matter how good the games.



“The fundamental cause of the trouble is that in the modern world the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt.” - Bertrand Russell

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace."

Jimi Hendrix

 

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NJ5 said:
You have to hold a dualshock in one hand and the wand with the other to play RE5.


Could Sony really be that stupid to have that as the final version?

 

 

yes



Atto Suggests...:

Book - Malazan Book of the Fallen series 

Game - Metro Last Light

TV - Deadwood

Music - Forest Swords 

Natal is just a nice addition to controls but it won't be required by many games. Those third party developers which support Natal are going to release games which use Natal as an optional control but you can play game without it just as well. It is just logical because there are a lot of 360 owners don't have Natal and they want to sell games to them too. I doubt that for example Fable III is going to require Natal because game sales would drop drastically with requirement (Natal is going to be used as option though). A lot of Fable fans don't want motion control.

If Natal would have some huge exclusive (first-party) games to showcase controls from the start then it might be huge success. Without huge games Natal can't be a success because controller is bought for games. Even Wii wouldn't have been nearly this successful without Wii Sports. I would say Wii Sports and other Wii games have been bigger console sellers than wiimote itself.



Hus said:
selnor said:
Hey I demand to be added as a believer in the OP. :)

I agree. I believe NATAL to be huge. Next years E3 will be ALL about NATAL. Nothing else will get press time.

Did you not learn your lesson about over hyping. 

Yahh in less then a year developers will make software worth a damn around game controls they have no experience with, id love to experience the lala land you live in.

The very proof that you follow me and pick up on my every word. I didnt even create the thread yet you single me out like this. Change the channel now, it's getting boring. It's my opinion.



binary solo said:
--OkeyDokey-- said:
binary solo said:
I dunno why everyone is so down on the PSWand. The success of the PSWand is dependant on exactly the same thing as Natal: compelling software.

PSWand releases with a decent serving of fun casual games, and innovative "hardcore" titles it will succeed. If it shows up with a couple of lame minigame titles and nothing to get the "hardcore" motivated it will fall and fade faster than the PSPGo.

Same goes for Natal.

It's that simple.

it looks ridiculous for one. It's even more button challenged than the Wii remote. There's no analogue stick. You have to hold a dualshock in one hand and the wand with the other to play RE5.

The E3 presentation was impressive but amateurish. Sony doesn't seem all that serious about it. It's like they heard Microsoft was going to have a big showing and they just slapped together whatever they had. As a result, Natal has the media on its side. And by the looks of it, 3rd parties, too.

So:

You've seen the commercially available PSwand to judge its look? If there's one thing you should trust Sony on (still) it's that they don't make shitty looking hardware. If the PSWand looks anything like the dev prototype it'll pretty much be the first time Sony has made an objectively crap looking product (other hardware isn't to people's taste looks-wise, but they definitely have aesthetic appeal to many. The lollipop wand would offend everyone's aesthetic sensibilities, except maybe those of an infant). Sony isn't going to get a massive marketing campaign into gear until they have the final look of the wand nailed down. Don't expect to see any big press until then.

And yeah, Sony has only spent who knows how much money on the R&D for the PSWand because they have sooo much money they can afford to throw it away on technology they don't believe in and aren't too worried about making a profit from.

Do we know the PSWand doesn't have 3rd parties on board? The only 3rd party studio I've read about who mentioned Natal also said they are working on the Wand too. And isn't RE5 made by a 3rd party...which is confirmed as having PSWand functionality? Only the VG geeks really care about names of studios lined up behind a new peripheral device with no announced games for it. The mass market will only sit up and take notice when the games themselves are announced, and better yet when the trailers for said games get released.

You may have a point on the ease of use, we'll see I guess. I would find it very surprising if the PSWand ended up as only capable of being used by people with 18+ dexterity, and still being fiddly.

What I wrote is still true: it will come down to software for both devices.

I have the PSEye already, if the PSWand has reasonable aesthetic style and it releases bundled with a kid friendly minigames title (that isn't total crap) at a reasonable price, then I'll be getting it fairly soon after release (provided I don't have another $1500 car repair bill between now and then). I WILL avoid the PSWand if it has the lollipop style, no matter how good the games.

First: i don't believe sony has put much money into the development of the Wand. because, and that's the beauty of it, they don't need to! its all put together from their existing technology, like the sixthaxis and the PSeye!  Compared to developing something like natal, Sonys dev cost is practically zero. They simply stuck a glowing ball to a sixthaxis and they had a motion controller with sub-pixel accuracy recognized in a full 3d Invironment. the only real Dev cost will be the software to detect the ball trough the PSeye and the final design of the wand.

..wich brings me to second: if by "lollipop style" you mean the glowing ball, then i can assure you it will have one, because the ball is how the system works! The PSeye detects the ball, and recognizes how far away it is by its size.

 



“It appeared that there had even been demonstrations to thank Big Brother for raising the chocolate ration to twenty grams a week. And only yesterday, he reflected, it had been announced that the ration was to be reduced to twenty grams a week. Was it possible that they could swallow that, after only twenty-four hours? Yes, they swallowed it.”

- George Orwell, ‘1984’

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because the ball is how the system works! The PSeye detects the ball, and recognizes how far away it is by its size.


That can easily be replaced by placing several markers on the controller itself. Doesn't need to exactly have a glowing ball on the end of it imho. Let's hope they can make the design slicker than it is now



papflesje said:
because the ball is how the system works! The PSeye detects the ball, and recognizes how far away it is by its size.


That can easily be replaced by placing several markers on the controller itself. Doesn't need to exactly have a glowing ball on the end of it imho. Let's hope they can make the design slicker than it is now

No it cant. They something prominent and of a easily seeable design. Something that when it moves further away can detect it shrinking in size. The eye on it's own cannot do depth unless it sees a glowing object that changes in size. So they could do Natal, but would have to where a glowing suit.



software will decide how well these motions tings will do, remember that. i reckon ps3 wands gonna have way better software, sony have so many 1st party developers whereas microsoft got hardly any.



OkeyDokey, I just thought you were trolling everyone this whole time. What are you doing? Do you really believe what you're saying?



 

 

selnor said:
papflesje said:
because the ball is how the system works! The PSeye detects the ball, and recognizes how far away it is by its size.


That can easily be replaced by placing several markers on the controller itself. Doesn't need to exactly have a glowing ball on the end of it imho. Let's hope they can make the design slicker than it is now

No it cant. They something prominent and of a easily seeable design. Something that when it moves further away can detect it shrinking in size. The eye on it's own cannot do depth unless it sees a glowing object that changes in size. So they could do Natal, but would have to where a glowing suit.

Hmm, how would "detecting a glowing ball" be the way to go, when detecting the size, distance and movement of (for example) three separate points/slits/circles/whatever on a controller basically gives you the same thing? (what am I missing that means a HUGE dot in front of a controller is required?) :s