By Core IP I was assuming you meant targetting the 'hard'core audience, as in not directed towards the casual gamer. But new IPs have been very successful on the HD consoles this generation as well.

Madworld, NMH were not core IPs by your definition either and the HotD: Overkill fits the description and didn't meet sales expecations.

No more Heroes wouldn't made money on the other consoles it would cost twice at much to make. And we know that for sure it cost less to make games on the wii. Also you should examples taht are similiar to no more heroes.... so post a cell shaded japaneese action game that sold well on HD consoles for examples not games that are base on establish ip's and games in completely different genres.

@cklmb But how many new HD ip's would you consider sleeper hits in the way that NMH was, that is to say that they werent backed up by massive advertising campaigns.

Good to see you back BTW, even if you have a different opinion you can argue it logically and calmly, good to see!

The shelf-space thing is an effect of the root problem, and not the cause. The root problem is that no-one is willing ot invest big budget, top-tier stuff. Make a big game, and the stores will give it shelf space, it will get advertised, and (hopefully) get sales. Epic Mickey will be the first big litmus test for this effect in the West, but it's already been proven in Japan (as the tried franchises come to Wii with great results)

Going by your definition of a core game Call of Duty is a core franchise.

CoD 3 Wii version sold over 1.2 million and the CoD:WaW sold over almost 1.3 million

CoD 3 360  version sold 2.33 million and CoD:WaW sold almost 5.9 millon despite having a much smaller userbase.

COD 3 PS3 was outsold by the Wii version by 2-1 ratio, but CoD:WaW outsold the Wii version by over a 2-1 ratio despite the Wii having a userbase over twice the size of the PS3's worldwide.

Yes, I had mentioned that a game on HD consoles would have cost more to make than a Wii game and how common is a non sequel cel shaded Japanese action game on any of the three consoles?

I don't consider NMH a sleeper hit, but I can also not recall with 100% how much marketing all new IPs have gotten, but for example Lost Odyssey didn't get much marketing and has sold over 700 thousand outside of Japan.

Test Drive Unlimited has sold almost 700 thousand.

The Darkness has sold almost 700 thousand on 360 and PS3 combined.

Also, as far as I can remember Bioshock and Left 4 Dead 2 didn't get a huge marketing push just a few ads which NMH also got through Ubisoft publishing it.

Dirt didn't get too many ads and it has sold almost 1 million on 360 alone.

Grid has sold over 1.5 million across both 360 and PS3.

And I'm leaving before I derail this thread any further.

Fixed. Userbase does not sell a game. Mass appeal does, and CoD was merely a hit series before 4, not a mega hit series. But I figured you would make that mistake. It's one of the most common on Wii haters (I personally would like all the consolsed to get good support, just the HD systems already have it and the Wii deserves more).

Lost Odyssey got a lot of marketing. I recall seeing the ad for it on TV all the time. Remember this?

Anyway, I don't know why people argue for NMH, or even MadWorld selling great on HD consoles. The older comparisons you made are not as good examples as the developers' previous games are - see how well Killer7, Okami, Viewtiful Joe, and God Hand did on the PS2. They may be great games, but they aren't million selling material on any console. Putting them on the HD consoles isn't going to change this.

@ckmlb

You've been perpetrating some wonky information throughout the last few pages, so I'll just comment on these few.

Crackdown sold 1.5m and still underperformed. Prince of Persia underperformed.

Using LittleBigPlanet as the sole example of a PS3 "casual" userbase won't fly either.

Wolfenstein is tanking in sales, forget about that? And for No More Heroes, it was Suda 51's best-selling game ever and his strongest IP. He threw a party once it sold 250k, and now it is at 450k. A sequel is coming and he has stated countless times how happy he is with the series, and how it will stick on a Nintendo console. Heck, he wants Travis in the next Smash Bros.