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Forums - Microsoft - Microsoft: Natal may cost you

Garnett on 08 October 2009

Im not paying more than $50 for this, i dont care if it puts me in a room full of horny naked girls, i can buy real girls for that much.



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mike_intellivision on 08 October 2009

The statement sounds a lot like what Sony said about the PS3 (though not as bad).

Given Microsoft's track record for pricing peripherals, it will probably be more expensive than it needs to be or should be. So instead of a $100 price point, we might be looking at a $150 price point.

Of course, the market for this will not be that great. At best it will sell to one-third of Xbox 360 owners. This is based on the track record of add-on controllers. And other than (any) bundled software or a killer ap (game), everything will have to still work with regular controllers if it wants to sell well.

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daroamer on 08 October 2009
mike_intellivision said:
The statement sounds a lot like what Sony said about the PS3 (though not as bad).

Given Microsoft's track record for pricing peripherals, it will probably be more expensive than it needs to be or should be. So instead of a $100 price point, we might be looking at a $150 price point.

Of course, the market for this will not be that great. At best it will sell to one-third of Xbox 360 owners. This is based on the track record of add-on controllers. And other than (any) bundled software or a killer ap (game), everything will have to still work with regular controllers if it wants to sell well.

Mike from Morgantown

There is an obvious difference in that MS charges outrageous prices for peripherals that people "need".  I know thats somewhat relative but if you have an HDTV and need component cables you have no options really, you need to buy theirs.  If you can't get a wired connection to your Xbox you need to get their wireless add-on.

Natal is not really something people NEED to buy, it's something MS is HOPING people buy.  I don't think they'll price it at obvious rip-off prices unless they are offering some kind of must-have title with it.



PlaystaionGamer on 08 October 2009

needs to be super cheap
i think sony will make the 'wand' around £30-£40 (quate me on that)
if Natal is £100 - £150 they might aswell not bother



ironman on 09 October 2009
Mitsurugi said:
By Fall 2010, won't the arcade be like 150$.
If Sony's wand comes out 6 months before Natal and at a fraction of the asking price (50-70 for both the ps eye and a wand) couldn't MS's response be to just bundle Natal with the arcade for 299.99 and initially sell it at a $50 loss. Which they'd quickly make back when misinformed consumers are left with no choice but to buy a $100-200 HDD so they can have access to more XBLA games and Natal games.

Misinformed consumers? WTF are you smoking. Nobody is telling the people they don't need the HD. And there is plenty of information out there about what one would need the HD for. Seriously, don't you have anything better to do? You won't need the HD to play NATAL games, NATAL has an onboard processer, and connects via USB. meaning, it will act like the webcam in that you don't need a HD to use it.

@gamelover...why aren't you banned yet? last time I called somebody an idiot, I got banned for a week...just goes to show how biased the mods are.



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gamelover2000 on 09 October 2009

I was banned for a day, VGchartz has some strict rules but I guess the week ban was not needed as my "huge insult" was (partly) justified



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gamelover2000 on 09 October 2009

@ ironman, your bias is pretty obvious but its your loss really.. I am not a fanboy and I favour Playstation platforms, but I would NEVER post something biased, apparently posting things like these makes you hated amongst some 360 fans.. its sad really..



Currently playing: MAG, Heavy Rain, Infamous

 

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kitler53 on 09 October 2009
daroamer said:
Impulsivity said:
Who didn't expect this? I mean seriously, its Microsoft.

They charge 100 dollars for a friggin cheapo wireless adapter (free for Wii and PS3), charge 150 dollars for a 120GB HD (you can get a 3rd party Terabyte drive into the PS3 for less then that), charge 49 dollars for online gaming (which is free on every single other device be it PC, Mac, PS3, Wii, PSP, DS or anything else) and led the charge to the 59.99 for Next Gen games price point.

If this is less then 200 dollars I'll be amazed. I have no idea why anyone would pay that personally, I mean it looks kind of interesting but really only a step above what the eyetoy has done for years. I'm certainly much happier to pay 30 bucks for a Wii or PS3 style motion stick then any insanely expensive "exiting new thing" solution.

Incidentally you can use all kinds of cameras with the PS3 even, yes, the Xbox live camera of all things. You can also use just about any mic, not just the PS3 mic, any keyboard/mouse, not just Sony branded ones (if sony branded keyboards even exist). I'm 90% sure you'll be able to use a 3rd party Motion controller soon enough as well, thats just how Sony rolls.

For those estimating nearly 100 dollars for the PS3 version of motion controllers I bet the real cost will be half that, or one fourth the Natal price tag (much like Wii costs for motion controls)

I REALLY wish people would understand what the hell Natal is before speaking.  If Natal was nothing more than Eyetoy it wouldn't be getting the buzz from developers that it is.

What people seem to fail to realize is that it's NOT just a camera and microphone.  It has software built in to analyze and interpret the data is receives. 

For example, any microphone can listen to you and record what you're saying, but it doesn't UNDERSTAND you.  That job requires software to interpret the sounds that the microphone is hearing into words that games can understand.  Sure, the developer can program their own speech recognition software, but Natal is built on the Microsoft speech recognition software that they have been developing for YEARS.   This is complex stuff. 

The same goes for the realtime skeletal tracking and face recognition.  Beyond the fact that Eyetoy cannot see depth, something has to take this data and construct it into something that developers and actually use.  Face recognition?  Same thing.  Eyetoy can see if there is a face there, but can it determine who you are?  No.

All of these are things that different devices can do to varying degrees, but what Microsoft has done is combine these into a cohesive package that is more than the sum of it's parts.

Developers don't need to take raw data like sounds, images and depth information and create software to interpret that data into something USEABLE, Natal does that internally.  All developers need to do is access the output and THAT is why they are excited.

so natal is the eyetoy with software to interpet the data?

but anywho...

1. according to Peter M. Milo doesn't reconize what you are saying - it only reconizes tone.  it was in his explanation of the "tricks" milo was using to create the experience shown at E3.  I follow natal pretty close cause i find it interesting and i haven't seen even a faint suggestion that natal has the software support for full voice reconition.  if you have prove otherwise i would greatly apprecite seeing that.

2. (...and more importantly.)  it's not like MS's software support is writing games for third party developers.  Natal does a lot of interpitation, true, but the output from that interpitation is the skeletal system and the game developers still have to interpit that data in terms of how it controls their games. 

let me put it this way, Nintendo (like MS) has all sorts of software support to help developers interpit what the controller is doing.  The big difference (to me at least) is the wiimote/wand are going to be giving detailed information on 1 point; x/y/z location, acceleration, ect. Natal on the other hand is going to be giving the same information for something like 48 points if i remember correctly.  so tell me this,...how is that going to be any more useable to the developer?

...if the developer is going to make a "breakout" game where the full avatar is represented 1:1 on screen than yeah, that's pretty easy to put on screen.  but any game that is looking for more of a guesture based motion control things are more than likely going to be just like they are on the wii - laggy, unresponsive, ect.



JaggedSac on 09 October 2009
kitler53 said:

so natal is the eyetoy with software to interpet the data?

but anywho...

1. according to Peter M. Milo doesn't reconize what you are saying - it only reconizes tone.  it was in his explanation of the "tricks" milo was using to create the experience shown at E3.  I follow natal pretty close cause i find it interesting and i haven't seen even a faint suggestion that natal has the software support for full voice reconition.  if you have prove otherwise i would greatly apprecite seeing that.

2. (...and more importantly.)  it's not like MS's software support is writing games for third party developers.  Natal does a lot of interpitation, true, but the output from that interpitation is the skeletal system and the game developers still have to interpit that data in terms of how it controls their games. 

let me put it this way, Nintendo (like MS) has all sorts of software support to help developers interpit what the controller is doing.  The big difference (to me at least) is the wiimote/wand are going to be giving detailed information on 1 point; x/y/z location, acceleration, ect. Natal on the other hand is going to be giving the same information for something like 48 points if i remember correctly.  so tell me this,...how is that going to be any more useable to the developer?

...if the developer is going to make a "breakout" game where the full avatar is represented 1:1 on screen than yeah, that's pretty easy to put on screen.  but any game that is looking for more of a guesture based motion control things are more than likely going to be just like they are on the wii - laggy, unresponsive, ect.

It uses tone to determine the emotional level of the spoken words.  Molyneaux said they are using a token/dictionary for word recognition.



JaggedSac on 09 October 2009

"We’re building up a profile of the emotion in your voice so we know when your voice is strained or excited or calm or passive. That coupled with Milo’s vocabulary of words he understands and what he’s doing on screen creates this illusion – and I’m not pulling any wool over people’s eyes – the illusion that Milo understands and is sentient. And couple that with really cheeky tricks that we’re using. For example, Milo will download dialogue very regularly behind the scenes which updates his database with current events. So, if Britain’s Got Talent is on, he’ll comment on certain acts, so that makes him feel so relevant and real that you start believing it, even if you’re a sceptic."

http://www.edge-online.com/features/interview-peter-molyneux-milo-and-kate