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Forums - PC Discussion - When will pc graphics start to really outpace console (this gen) graphics?

greenmedic88 on 27 September 2009
shio said:
KillerMan said:
shio said:
KillerMan said:
BxN said:
The thing is, people always state Crysis to show how great the glorious PC graphics are, but when you think of it, Crysis is the only game that really outmatches the consoles graphics. There's very little multiplatform games that look significantly better on PC than on PS360, and I'm sorry but I've never seen a pc game (not called Crysis) that looked better than Killzone 2 or Uncharted 2.

Reason for that is that PC versions are almost always ports from console versions so games are made with consoles limitations and then ported to PC. (saddest example is GTA IV)

Dude, the console versions of GTA IV are around the LOW SETTINGS of the PC version. Even Rockstar themselves said it.

BxN said:
The thing is, people always state Crysis to show how great the glorious PC graphics are, but when you think of it, Crysis is the only game that really outmatches the consoles graphics. There's very little multiplatform games that look significantly better on PC than on PS360, and I'm sorry but I've never seen a pc game (not called Crysis) that looked better than Killzone 2 or Uncharted 2.

PC version of GTA IV is very poorly optimized and developed. You need quad core processor, over 2gb RAM and new DX10 graphics card to run it decently. At the beginning game also had so many bugs and glitches that is was almost unplayable. Rockstar made very lazy port.

It further helps my case. Imagine if GTA IV was optimized, the game would've been able to get an even better Top Settings and have lower specs. Optimization aside, it doesn't change the fact that the console versions are only around the low settings of the PC version.

FKNetwork said:
shio said:

There are some people that already argue that PC is more accessible than Xbox 360.

LMAO, nice try shio....

Steam:

  1. Power on PC
  2. Buy Game
  3. Download Game
  4. Play

After you bought the game is like

  1. Power on PC
  2. Play

Steam even streamlines patches and updates, so that you never need to hunt them down.

Console:

  1. Go to Store
  2. Buy Game
  3. Go Back Home
  4. Power on Console
  5. Put in Disk
  6. Play
  7. Put Disk Away After Played

After you bought the game is like

  1. Power on Console
  2. Put in Disk
  3. Play
  4. Put Disk Away After Played
greenmedic88 said:
And Crysis doesn't play at very high settings with playable frame rates on a $400 PC, even assuming the $100 OEM copy of Windows was free.

Not unless you crank down the resolution or are playing on a very small display which pretty much defeats the purpose of all that detail.

I love building overclocked systems as much as the next PC guy, but seriously, you have to call BS when you smell it.

A build that played very high settings, let alone mod extreme settings would require about a $200-300 CPU (a highly overclocked E8400 $165 CPU is about rock bottom for this performance level) and a $300 plus dual GPU VGA solution (at least the equivalent of a HD4870x2) for realistically playable frame rates (no less than 30 fps) at resolutions above 1680x1050 without turning off AA.

A $400 PC still plays Crysis on High Settings, which consoles are unable to. And don't even speak of resolution when most top console games aren't even true HD.

And it's funny you base your argument on resolution. You see, when games like GTA IV, Halo 3, etc.... are around 600p on consoles, you can't criticise PC gamers, because 600p is nearly the minimum resolution that PC games allow these days. Console gamers are basically playing on PC's minimum resolutions.

 

 

Show hardware build specs, play settings and benchmarks or you're just blowing smoke.

Blowing smoke at someone who builds and overclocks systems and knows full well what every bit of hardware is capable of I might add.

And since you brought up resolution; for every game that runs below 1280x720 on a console, there are probably a good 20+ that do.



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shio on 27 September 2009
greenmedic88 said:

Show hardware build specs, play settings and benchmarks or you're just blowing smoke.

Blowing smoke at someone who builds and overclocks systems and knows full well what every bit of hardware is capable of I might add.

And since you brought up resolution; for every game that runs below 1280x720 on a console, there are probably a good 20+ that do.

And pretty much the console games that play at 720p aren't pushing the tech like the ones that play at below 720p.

As for the hardware specs:


US GAF'S ULTIMATE $400 GAMING RIG

[CPU/MOTHERBOARD/MEMORY COMBO (2.8ghz E6300 / ECS G31 / OCZ SLI 4GB 800mhz)]: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboD...t=Combo.215870 ($157 +$23 MIR)
[DVDRW (Samsung 22x SATA)]: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16827151187 ($27)
[GPU (Sapphire E HD 4850 512M)]: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814102824 ($100)
[HDD (WD CAVIAR BLUE 640GB )]: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16822136218 ($60)
[CASE/PSU COMBO (Coolermaster Centurion 5 / Coolermaster 460w): http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboD...t=Combo.208506 ($75)


$418.92 - $33 rebates = $395.93

 

And keep in mind that this build is slightly old, and is able to play Crysis in Very High!



http://i48.tinypic.com/120qaon.jpg
Domicinator on 27 September 2009

Actually, it goes more like this:

PC:

1. Buy game either online or in a store.
2. Install game.
3. Realize the game is not patched to the latest version.
4. Download a 500 MB file.
5. Start the game.
6. Reinstall the game because the patch ruined your install. (especially if we're talking EA)
7. Reinstall the patch.
8. Start the game.
9. Stop the game because it's a slide show.
10. Adjust settings.
11. Download the latest drivers for your video card.
12. Buy a new video card.
13. Rinse, wash, repeat.

Consoles:

1. Buy the game.
2. Put it in the box.
3. Download a small update. (On the PS3, you do usually have to sit through an annoying install.)
4. Play the game.

Yes, messing around with your PC is all part of the hobby of PC gaming, but I just personally got really sick of it. Yes, PC gaming is usually what drives the consoles because the research and development is usually all done on the PC, but when you have a 2 year old to feed, PC gaming becomes less and less viable. I could buy 10 games with the amount of money I spent on my last video card.

And finally, no, it is NOT easier to build a decent PC gaming rig and hook it up to an HDTV. I am well aware that PC games can be played with console controllers. (I forget who was challenging me on this, and I really don't care who it was.) I have been playing PC games with an Xbox 360 controller since the day they came out. But Joe Schmoe Gamer who doesn't know anything about anything is NOT going to build a gaming PC and hook it up to the TV.

PC gaming is a niche. It always has been and always will be. And that's probably how it needs to stay. But if you think it's the force that it once was, you are very seriously delusional. I personally left it not only because of the expense, but also because I'm not into RTS or MMO games AT ALL, and those are pretty much the only thing that the PC does anymore that's unique. The consoles are where it's at now, whether they can push the same graphics or not. Sorry.




Foibbles on 27 September 2009

Is this a joke?

PC games have looked better this gen more than any other. You just need a decent computer to turn all the settings up to max and you're most likely looking at graphics better than consoles not even released.



Foibbles on 27 September 2009

Although thats BS that a $400 dollar PC can run Crysis on high...Certainly not with a frame rate higher than 20fps. Not a chance.



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shio on 27 September 2009
Foibbles said:
Although thats BS that a $400 dollar PC can run Crysis on high...Certainly not with a frame rate higher than 20fps. Not a chance.

I just posted a $400 PC that runs Crysis on Very High 20 minutes ago.



http://i48.tinypic.com/120qaon.jpg
Mudface on 27 September 2009
Domicinator said:
PC gaming is a niche. It always has been and always will be.

A niche? With tens of millions of participants playing a massively diverse range of games, from multi-plat blockbusters to browser-based MMO's and everything in between? The stereotype of PC gaming- the 1337 geek in his bedroom with a £2000 rig and a container of liquid nitrogen to keep his massively overclocked parts cool- would be a niche. The reality is anything but.

As for the original question- as many others have said, the day the consoles were released was the day they were behind in terms of graphics.



Soleron on 27 September 2009

PCs have much higher theoretical graphics power. The PS3's GPU is a 7900GS, and current GPUs such as the HD 5870 have maybe eight times the processing power of that, in fillrate, TFLOPS, shader count and everything else.

The limitation is that games can't get much better visually without spending enough money and time to make the whole game unprofitable. Until we get raytracing to cut graphics engine costs and find a cheaper to model things.



Untamoi on 27 September 2009
shio said:
greenmedic88 said:

Show hardware build specs, play settings and benchmarks or you're just blowing smoke.

Blowing smoke at someone who builds and overclocks systems and knows full well what every bit of hardware is capable of I might add.

And since you brought up resolution; for every game that runs below 1280x720 on a console, there are probably a good 20+ that do.

And pretty much the console games that play at 720p aren't pushing the tech like the ones that play at below 720p.

As for the hardware specs:


US GAF'S ULTIMATE $400 GAMING RIG

[CPU/MOTHERBOARD/MEMORY COMBO (2.8ghz E6300 / ECS G31 / OCZ SLI 4GB 800mhz)]: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboD...t=Combo.215870 ($157 +$23 MIR)
[DVDRW (Samsung 22x SATA)]: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16827151187 ($27)
[GPU (Sapphire E HD 4850 512M)]: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814102824 ($100)
[HDD (WD CAVIAR BLUE 640GB )]: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16822136218 ($60)
[CASE/PSU COMBO (Coolermaster Centurion 5 / Coolermaster 460w): http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboD...t=Combo.208506 ($75)


$418.92 - $33 rebates = $395.93

 

And keep in mind that this build is slightly old, and is able to play Crysis in Very High!

This is enough to reach around 20 fps at very high details at 720p, no more than that. Even then, you are missing OS and keyboard and mouse from your configuration (you can't use PC at all without them unless you steal them).



Smidlee on 27 September 2009
Soleron said:
PCs have much higher theoretical graphics power. The PS3's GPU is a 7900GS, and current GPUs such as the HD 5870 have maybe eight times the processing power of that, in fillrate, TFLOPS, shader count and everything else.

The limitation is that games can't get much better visually without spending enough money and time to make the whole game unprofitable. Until we get raytracing to cut graphics engine costs and find a cheaper to model things.

I believe you hit the nail of the head. Crysis is almost 2 years old yet it still uses as an example top PC graphics. So in the future I believe graphics will be limited by cost instead of hardware limitations. While 5870 has a lot of power I haven't seen too many PC games where I need that power.