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Forums - Nintendo - will soon see Saturn games on the VC

jman8 on 17 October 2007
routsounmanman said:
First of all welcome to the forum, dnnc. Saturn games, although mighty as they were, won't likely reach VC due to their big size; remember they were hosted in CDs, therefore they might well be even 750MB! Wouldn't fit Wii's flash memory and even if there's going to be a HDD, downloading them woulb be a pain in the ass (huge download times).

 750mb downloads on the PSN are pretty common occurences and usually only take 15 minutes max, so the only real hindrance is the flash memory in the Wii. Hard Drive support would be pretty awesome even if it was just a clunky external solution. I guess a major issue/cost for Nintendo could be creating the infrastructure to deliver so much content at such high speed, but as we all know, Nintendo is raking in the cash at the moment. Also, judging by the PC specs for Gametap Saturn games, I'm not so sure the Wii will be able to emulate the Saturn in order to play the games in the first place. What do you guys think? I can tell you right now I would buy a Wii in a second if I could play all the Saturn classics that I missed out on. As of right now, I can't quite justify the purchase. 



My Top 5:

Shadow of the Colossus, Metal Gear Solid 3, Shenmue, Skies of Arcadia, Chrono Trigger

My 2 nex-gen systems: PS3 and Wii

Prediction Aug '08: We see the PSP2 released fall '09. Graphically, it's basically the same as the current system. UMD drive ditched and replaced by 4-8gb on board flash memory. Other upgrades: 2nd analog nub, touchscreen, blutooth, motion sensor. Design: Flip-style or slider. Size: Think Iphone. Cost: $199. Will be profitable on day 1.

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fazz on 17 October 2007

Nah, the Wii should be able to emulate them very well. I mean, you need over 300 Mhz worth of CPU for an average SNES experience on PC (if I remember correctly)

About the size, I think compression techniques have been enhanced in the last 10 years, so it wouldn't be surprising to see them taking less space.



KruzeS on 17 October 2007

I don't think size is the real issue here. The average Saturn game size at GameTap is 85MiB, with the biggest one at under 150MiB (and we don't even know what kind of sound/video compression techniques they are using). This is well within range of them simply improving SD card support.

Whether the Wii has it in itself to emulate the Saturn, however... I don't know. Plus, has Sega ever released emulated Saturn games anywhere? With the Megadrive, they'd already re-reselased games on a number of plaforms, including on the Cube. It was pretty clear they had a working emulator. What about the Saturn?



Reality has a Nintendo bias.
andrewpeirce on 17 October 2007

what about SD cards? with a Wii SD card, could I fianlly play sonic jam? I want to run around in sonic world really badly :(
I also want nights, but $100 for an 8 year old game is a joke...



LordTheNightKnight on 17 October 2007
JMan said:
DarkNight_DS said:
krik said:
You can play Saturn games on the computer with GameTap (http://www.gametap.com)

We already have a few Saturn games in our catalog but more are coming every week. Phanzer Dragoon anyone?

http://www.gametap.com/home/play/gameDetails/130001150

PS: Without an harddrive Saturn games will never make it to the Wii. Saturn games are over 600Mb+

What system specs do you require to play these games? Also control pad support has always been sub par on the PC. I've got a 360 controller that I use sometimes on my PC and the computer reads the one analog stick as being off center. It works fine on the 360 though. The games may be cheaper on the PC but it's definately not as easy.


From the link for that specific game:

Minimum System Requirements
  • CPU speed greater than or equal to 2000 MHz
  • Physical memory greater than or equal to 512 MB
  • A video card greater than or equal to 128 MBmemory

edit: Also interesting, the size is 64.7MB.


 Only 64.7MB. That's not too bad. The thing with CDs is that actual game data is rarely that large. Most of the space comes from lots of high quality music, which can be compressed, lots of audio (like MGS1), which can be compressed, and lots of FMVs, which again can be compressed (especially since FMVs on CDs were MPEG-1).

As for the specs, it wouldn't need that much for the Wii. Gametap games need all those specs to handle several things at once, at the minimum, the game, Gametap service, the broadband network, the OS, and background processes. And again that's the minimum. The Wii just runs the games and the Wii channels. Plus if Nintendo does what I suspect, which is to optimize N64 games for performance, they may do the same to Saturn games. This is due to the atypical structures of both systems. 



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

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vanguardian1 on 17 October 2007

C'mon Sega! Give my Wii some Virtual On love! ;)



Nobody is crazy enough to accuse me of being sane.

choirsoftheeye on 17 October 2007
DarkNight_DS said:
choirsoftheeye said:
DarkNight_DS said:
krik said:
You can play Saturn games on the computer with GameTap (http://www.gametap.com)

We already have a few Saturn games in our catalog but more are coming every week. Phanzer Dragoon anyone?

http://www.gametap.com/home/play/gameDetails/130001150

PS: Without an harddrive Saturn games will never make it to the Wii. Saturn games are over 600Mb+

What system specs do you require to play these games? Also control pad support has always been sub par on the PC. I've got a 360 controller that I use sometimes on my PC and the computer reads the one analog stick as being off center. It works fine on the 360 though. The games may be cheaper on the PC but it's definately not as easy.


I've actually found that using a PS2 controller with an adapter from Radioshack is amazing in terms of a PC joypad experience. The PS2 controller is also capable of imitating most controllers that came before it, so if you've got old semi-functional games you'd rather play emulated... (Or if you're a pirate, I suppose)


I have an adapter for my PS2 controller... it only works half the time, the other times I have to mess with the drivers because it detected it wrong upon insertion into the USB slot. BTW those specs for what kind of computer you need is pretty ridiculous. You end up using aprox 200watts of electricity playing the game on your PC, while on a console you only use about 20watts.

It's a great service in theory but unless it supports every OS, comes with a decent controller etc. it will never win true console players over.


 Weird, I've never had any issues with my controller - not once.  It just detects it as a Joystick.

 Those specs are a little high, but software emulation requires a much more advanced machine than what's being emulated, especially when the specifics of how things are done within the emulated machine aren't available.  I have to assume that's what this service does, since decompiling each games code and porting it to the PC is stupidly hard.

 That being said, I know nothing about GameTap.



krik on 17 October 2007
LordTheNightKnight said:
JMan said:
DarkNight_DS said:
krik said:
You can play Saturn games on the computer with GameTap (http://www.gametap.com)

We already have a few Saturn games in our catalog but more are coming every week. Phanzer Dragoon anyone?

http://www.gametap.com/home/play/gameDetails/130001150

PS: Without an harddrive Saturn games will never make it to the Wii. Saturn games are over 600Mb+

What system specs do you require to play these games? Also control pad support has always been sub par on the PC. I've got a 360 controller that I use sometimes on my PC and the computer reads the one analog stick as being off center. It works fine on the 360 though. The games may be cheaper on the PC but it's definately not as easy.


From the link for that specific game:

Minimum System Requirements
  • CPU speed greater than or equal to 2000 MHz
  • Physical memory greater than or equal to 512 MB
  • A video card greater than or equal to 128 MBmemory

edit: Also interesting, the size is 64.7MB.


Only 64.7MB. That's not too bad. The thing with CDs is that actual game data is rarely that large. Most of the space comes from lots of high quality music, which can be compressed, lots of audio (like MGS1), which can be compressed, and lots of FMVs, which again can be compressed (especially since FMVs on CDs were MPEG-1).

As for the specs, it wouldn't need that much for the Wii. Gametap games need all those specs to handle several things at once, at the minimum, the game, Gametap service, the broadband network, the OS, and background processes. And again that's the minimum. The Wii just runs the games and the Wii channels. Plus if Nintendo does what I suspect, which is to optimize N64 games for performance, they may do the same to Saturn games. This is due to the atypical structures of both systems.


GameTap's size does not include any games. GameTap has a massive game catalog (over 1000 games) accross multiple consoles (Dreamcast, Saturn, 32x, etc), arcades and PC games.

So, 64.7Mb is only for GameTap and then from GameTap you can download/play any game from the entire catalog.

Good luck to Nintendo in their mission to get source code to any Sega Saturn game They will need it to optimize the games. It's easy to do when you own the system (N64) and the games (Mario, etc) not so easy when you don't own games or system.

 



PSN ID: krik

Optimistic predictions for 2008 (Feb 5 2008): Wii = 20M, PS3 = 14M, X360 = 9.5M

 

KruzeS on 17 October 2007
krik said:

So, 64.7Mb is only for GameTap and then from GameTap you can download/play any game from the entire catalog.


So, tell us then, why is it that they say it's 64.7MiB for the mentioned game, 25.3MiB for another Saturn game (the smallest), and 146.9MiB yet another (the largest)? System requirements also vary between games (though they're all the same for Saturn games).

krik said:

Good luck to Nintendo in their mission to get source code to any Sega Saturn game

Nintendo? Right... You are aware that Sega publishes Megadrive games right? That Hudson is responsible for Turbografx games, and SNK by NeoGeo?



Reality has a Nintendo bias.
LordTheNightKnight on 17 October 2007
krik said:
LordTheNightKnight said:
JMan said:
DarkNight_DS said:
krik said:
You can play Saturn games on the computer with GameTap (http://www.gametap.com)

We already have a few Saturn games in our catalog but more are coming every week. Phanzer Dragoon anyone?

http://www.gametap.com/home/play/gameDetails/130001150

PS: Without an harddrive Saturn games will never make it to the Wii. Saturn games are over 600Mb+

What system specs do you require to play these games? Also control pad support has always been sub par on the PC. I've got a 360 controller that I use sometimes on my PC and the computer reads the one analog stick as being off center. It works fine on the 360 though. The games may be cheaper on the PC but it's definately not as easy.


From the link for that specific game:

Minimum System Requirements
  • CPU speed greater than or equal to 2000 MHz
  • Physical memory greater than or equal to 512 MB
  • A video card greater than or equal to 128 MBmemory

edit: Also interesting, the size is 64.7MB.


Only 64.7MB. That's not too bad. The thing with CDs is that actual game data is rarely that large. Most of the space comes from lots of high quality music, which can be compressed, lots of audio (like MGS1), which can be compressed, and lots of FMVs, which again can be compressed (especially since FMVs on CDs were MPEG-1).

As for the specs, it wouldn't need that much for the Wii. Gametap games need all those specs to handle several things at once, at the minimum, the game, Gametap service, the broadband network, the OS, and background processes. And again that's the minimum. The Wii just runs the games and the Wii channels. Plus if Nintendo does what I suspect, which is to optimize N64 games for performance, they may do the same to Saturn games. This is due to the atypical structures of both systems.


GameTap's size does not include any games. GameTap has a massive game catalog (over 1000 games) accross multiple consoles (Dreamcast, Saturn, 32x, etc), arcades and PC games.

So, 64.7Mb is only for GameTap and then from GameTap you can download/play any game from the entire catalog.

Good luck to Nintendo in their mission to get source code to any Sega Saturn game They will need it to optimize the games. It's easy to do when you own the system (N64) and the games (Mario, etc) not so easy when you don't own games or system.

 


Easy in the sense of not needing to get the rights and knowing the hardware, but if Sega decides to put Saturn games on the VC, they would certainly want them to run well, especially since the VC and Gametap would finally give Sega a profit on the Saturn. 



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs