1st bolded: Demographics DO matter. MadWorld is being proclaimed as a great game, yet it's not selling. Yet Carnival Games has sold multiple millions of copies. You think demographics don't matter? I would say "it's the casual gamers' fault" because every time a decent third party game comes out, they don't buy it, but as soon as some crappy game like Cooking Mama comes out, they eat it up

2nd bolded: Look at Resident Evil 5, every CoD on the HD consoles, new IPs like Assassin's Creed and Bioshock. Do those "platinum selling" games on the Wii hold a candle, no...the DIMMEST LIGHT to the sales of those HD games?

3rd bolded: Inspite of the big third party games? Being a gamer, those games should matter. The Wii may sell the most third party software, but it isn't the Tekken's, the Final Fantasy's, the Fallout's, the Resident Evil's, the GTA's, etc. type games that give it title. It's the Cooking Mama's, the Carnival Games, the Game Party's, the Raving Rabbids, the High School Musical's, and the Deca Sports type games that are selling (ahem...crappy shovelware).

All in all, I think you're approaching this all wrong. Metal Gear Solid 4 is hailed as one of the best games this generation. If it didn't break 500k, would you blame the game, or the people who own PS3s? Don't act like your confused when the topic of demographics comes to play. In the attempt to gain the "expanded audience", Nintendo has succeeded. They've gotten every grandma, soccer mom, and average Joe to buy a Wii. But how many self proclaimed gamers own that system? Dare I say, not that many? Otherwise, MadWorld would've sold better. Despite getting a sequel, No More Heroes would have sold better. CoD:WaW would have sold in the same area as the HD consoles. Those three games alone cover a broad spectrum of genres of games, so don't try and pull the "niche" card. Because that happens all to often. Assassin's Creed is "niche", but that didn't stop it from selling nearly 8 million copies combined (that was sarcasm btw)

I often wonder why sales on Wii games (and lesser extent on the DS, GTA) are always held under a larger microscope than its competitors are. Games are immediately called flops and used as 'evidence' that "Wii can't sell XYZ". Meanwhile, games such as Lair, or more recently Bionic Commando are largely ignored and not evidence of anything worth proving. The Godfather 2 hasn't been tearing up the charts lately but again games that underperform are ignored and never used to showcase a systems short comings. In fact many people argue that the game itself was lacking. It wasn't the systems fault for the game not selling, it wasn't the systems "demographics" fault for the game not selling, the game simply lacked something or just wasn't fun enough. This is the right attitude to have, but it seems the Wii games that underperform aren't because the games themselves fail to deliver something it is the Wii's fault, the casual gamers' fault.

Madworld is called a flop and shown as proof that mature games can't sell on Wii, but games like HOTD and RE4, CoD, and Red Steel are all platinum selling games...that happen to be rated mature.

I fail to see the logic in 'compared to userbase' arguments or the "Wii can't sell third party software" when inspite of the big third party franchises Wii still sells the most third party software. Maybe I'm missing something.

Deadly Creatures is a flop, its not the Wii's fault the game flopped. Perhaps the game was just lacking the same thing Bionic Commando lacked.

Funny thing about Wii flops though, is I guess these dumb developers don't know when to quit because games proclaimed by forum goers to be flops are seeing sequels, NMH2, Boom Blox, maybe even De Blob.

Again maybe I'm missing something. What do you all think? What is your perspective on all of this?