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Forums - Sony - 3 years PS3 - no innovation, just Shooters?

outlawauron on 13 May 2009
twesterm said:
forevercloud3000 said:
You want innovative? Its sitting all around you, staring you in the face.

Little Big Planet, enough said. That game has more innovation then anyone could possibly want. So many options and levels of customization it will make your head spin. Go see some of the levels people have made(like Luminous Dream that Jo21 and MM showed me) and tell me that is not crazy brilliantly innovative.

Resistance and Resistance 2 are not as "generic" as most like to peg them as. While they are shooters, I think their weapon selection is where they excel. I have never heard of a Bullseye like weapon in any other game(maybe becuz I never played shooters really b4 this gen). This goes for many of the Res universe of weaponry. THEY are what make those games fun.

Killzone2 is awesome, regardless of innovation. Why is innovation even necessary for every game? K2 does what FPS gamers love........RIGHT! It does change the game in small ways, such as the spawn grenades(which rectifies that little issue of people camping spawn points from other shooter).

Heavenly Sword was an awesome and unique game. You could use SIXAXIS for the "Aftertouch" throwing/firing mechanism which was loads of fun. The controler setup for Nariko's 3 stances was brilliant.

Valkyria Chronicles, Bet you have never played anything like it.......mainly because it doesnt exist.

Folklore utilized sixaxis functions as well in the MOST unique(and best) way I have seen. You actually grab/pull/tug/thrash Folk souls with the tilt by swaying it rapidly in different directions. Almost like fishing........but for souls, it was great.

and as you said, there are games like Eye of Judgment and so on floating around.

The thing is games shouldn't have to be innovative, bcuz you know what happens then? People feel unfamiliar about it so they don't go rushing out to buy it (Valkyria Chronicles, ICO, Folklore anyone?). They sell only decent maybe but not enough to warrent a sequel and in turn, more innovative games. Society likes their rehashes and doesn't like to be introduced to new things, even though we think we do.

First off, I'm going to start with I don't agree with the OP.  The PS3's library is just fine but I did want to mention some of the games mentioned.  Since this post had most of the games I thought were going to be mentioned, I just quoted it (and I didn't want to read the entire thread).

  • Little Big Planet -- You could have left it at enough said.  It's fairly well known I don't think it's the uber fantastic game everyone says it is but it is creative and innovative.
  • Resistance -- This was the biggest beef I had with your post.  Yes, it has some different weapons but these games just scream generic.  They aren't bad but they aren't anything special.  In fact, the first one is only not bad because it's a throwback to classic shooters.
  • Killzone 2 -- You're right when you say not every game needs innovation but wrong when you say Killzone 2 has it.  KZ2 is your basic shooter wrapped in a very pretty shell with some fantastic atmosphere and this is not a bad thing at all.  Yes, yes, I know OMG FIRST PERSON COVER!!, meh, cover has been done before and done better.
  • Heavenly Sword -- This game wasn't that awesome and wasn't that unique.  Yes, it had some SIXAXIS features that funny enough would be called gimmicks if it were on the Wii, but besides that it's God of War with tits.  This is an example of a good God of War clone whereas something like X Blades is an example of a bad God of War clone.
  • Folklore -- I agree that this is some of the best SIXAXIS controls but the good really stops there.  Still though, mark this one as a creative notch.
  • Valkyria Chronicles -- see LBP
  • Eye of Judgment -- Another innovative game but it was. just. so. bad.  The game is horribly unbalanced and pretty much turns into whoever goes first wins.  Also, the card recognition was sketchy at best.

Also, I completely agree with your last paragraph.  Innovation is a huge risk while same ol' same ol' is not.

 

But Heavenly Sword had Andy Serkis.......



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forevercloud3000 on 13 May 2009
Mirson said:
Valkyria isn't that unique. Hogs of War on the PS1 says hello.

If you want innovative on PS3, go try out some PSN games. They're the best the console has to offer. Echochrome comes to mind.

 

does Hogs of War have "Potentials", effectively giving each character(over 50) personality and unique in battle? Does it give a story in a History book like fashion? Does it give you the ability to use terrain to your advantage in a FPS like fashion(crouching in grass, watch towers, etc)? Can you upgrade and customize your team's weapons which also includes decking out tanks with new armor and weaponry?

While the game seems to give the same impression of being able to roam the field like VC, it ends there.



      

      

      

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Ajescent on 13 May 2009

So if VC isn't unique because of Hogs of War...why did you herald "You're in the movies" when eyetoy exists?



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lolita on 13 May 2009
Kantor said:

I'm with you on RPGs, but Action Adventure and Platformer are the PS3's two strongest genres...

-Ratchet and Clank games (two, with another releasing this year)  Guns.

-LBP This had potential to be considered good but I'm not too much into creating levels and such. I found the controls dodgy as well. The actual platforming gameplay of it is meh at best.

-Prince of Persia Okay game, a bit too repetitive. Also on 360.

-Uncharted

-Bionic Commando Rearmed

And quite a few more. Action Adventure...WOW:

-MGS4 Shooter/stealth... No thanks.

-Uncharted You said this one already.

-BioShock (it may be first person, but it's still Action Adventure)  Guns.

-inFamous Might be good, though I'm not into super heroes things.

-GTA4 Played some but it becomes very uninteresting after a while. I dislike anything to do with gangs, drugs, guns and such + also on 360.

-Ninja Gaiden Sigma 

-Resident Evil 5 I dislike anything involved with shooting.

-Devil May Cry 4 I might try that game sometime (blame Dante's sexyness) but also on PC and 360.

-Heavenly Sword Too much button mashing not enough adventuring/exploring. To be fair I'm going to say this game is okay.

-Saint's Row 2

-Assassin's Creed An okay game... Too repetitive imo. Also on 360 and PC.

-The Darkness Never heard of this. Will have to look it up.

And those are just 80+ on Metacritic...I don't own nearly all of those.

Okay this will look very picky but that's just how my gaming tastes are. I prefer fantasy settings, with swords and such... I dislike tactical RPGs (too slow) and I don't like games with guns, they're so bland. There isn't that many games I like due to this and to be fair, I'm a bit more into RPGs than other genres.



outlawauron on 13 May 2009

But Ratchet isn't violent in the ways that most games are.


And you won't like The Darkness. It has a nice love story but it's a shooter.



"We'll toss the dice however they fall,
And snuggle the girls be they short or tall,
Then follow young Mat whenever he calls,
To dance with Jak o' the Shadows."

Check out MyAnimeList and my Game Collection. Owner of the 5 millionth post.

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forevercloud3000 on 13 May 2009
twesterm said:
forevercloud3000 said:
You want innovative? Its sitting all around you, staring you in the face.

Little Big Planet, enough said. That game has more innovation then anyone could possibly want. So many options and levels of customization it will make your head spin. Go see some of the levels people have made(like Luminous Dream that Jo21 and MM showed me) and tell me that is not crazy brilliantly innovative.

Resistance and Resistance 2 are not as "generic" as most like to peg them as. While they are shooters, I think their weapon selection is where they excel. I have never heard of a Bullseye like weapon in any other game(maybe becuz I never played shooters really b4 this gen). This goes for many of the Res universe of weaponry. THEY are what make those games fun.

Killzone2 is awesome, regardless of innovation. Why is innovation even necessary for every game? K2 does what FPS gamers love........RIGHT! It does change the game in small ways, such as the spawn grenades(which rectifies that little issue of people camping spawn points from other shooter).

Heavenly Sword was an awesome and unique game. You could use SIXAXIS for the "Aftertouch" throwing/firing mechanism which was loads of fun. The controler setup for Nariko's 3 stances was brilliant.

Valkyria Chronicles, Bet you have never played anything like it.......mainly because it doesnt exist.

Folklore utilized sixaxis functions as well in the MOST unique(and best) way I have seen. You actually grab/pull/tug/thrash Folk souls with the tilt by swaying it rapidly in different directions. Almost like fishing........but for souls, it was great.

and as you said, there are games like Eye of Judgment and so on floating around.

The thing is games shouldn't have to be innovative, bcuz you know what happens then? People feel unfamiliar about it so they don't go rushing out to buy it (Valkyria Chronicles, ICO, Folklore anyone?). They sell only decent maybe but not enough to warrent a sequel and in turn, more innovative games. Society likes their rehashes and doesn't like to be introduced to new things, even though we think we do.

First off, I'm going to start with I don't agree with the OP.  The PS3's library is just fine but I did want to mention some of the games mentioned.  Since this post had most of the games I thought were going to be mentioned, I just quoted it (and I didn't want to read the entire thread).

  • Little Big Planet -- You could have left it at enough said.  It's fairly well known I don't think it's the uber fantastic game everyone says it is but it is creative and innovative.
  • Resistance -- This was the biggest beef I had with your post.  Yes, it has some different weapons but these games just scream generic.  They aren't bad but they aren't anything special.  In fact, the first one is only not bad because it's a throwback to classic shooters.
  • Killzone 2 -- You're right when you say not every game needs innovation but wrong when you say Killzone 2 has it.  KZ2 is your basic shooter wrapped in a very pretty shell with some fantastic atmosphere and this is not a bad thing at all.  Yes, yes, I know OMG FIRST PERSON COVER!!, meh, cover has been done before and done better.
  • Heavenly Sword -- This game wasn't that awesome and wasn't that unique.  Yes, it had some SIXAXIS features that funny enough would be called gimmicks if it were on the Wii, but besides that it's God of War with tits.  This is an example of a good God of War clone whereas something like X Blades is an example of a bad God of War clone.
  • Folklore -- I agree that this is some of the best SIXAXIS controls but the good really stops there.  Still though, mark this one as a creative notch.
  • Valkyria Chronicles -- see LBP
  • Eye of Judgment -- Another innovative game but it was. just. so. bad.  The game is horribly unbalanced and pretty much turns into whoever goes first wins.  Also, the card recognition was sketchy at best.

Also, I completely agree with your last paragraph.  Innovation is a huge risk while same ol' same ol' is not.

 

Ok, Ill give you Resistance and its weapons. Yet what about Killzone2? I have never heard of another game allowing you to lay down spawn grenades, that to me seems to be a fix long over due in a FPS. It corrects the long time cheat of camping spawn points for easy kills.

If you didn't like Heavenly Sword, we can no longer discuss it because I down right loved it. It was my first PS3 game I purchased and I down right adored the combat and Story. The only thing it lacked was length. and the "aftertouch" was a nice touch to HS, there is no denying that. And Nariko's Heavenly Blades were very different in the way they are handles compared to Kratos's. Kratos doesn't have the brilliant Speed,Strength, and Range seperated combat styles which actually adds to the level of creativity to battles. Everytime I play the game I somehow discover a new combo I previously had never done.

 



      

      

      

Greatness Awaits

PSN:Forevercloud (looking for Soul Sacrifice Partners!!!)

forevercloud3000 on 13 May 2009
lolita said:
Kantor said:

I'm with you on RPGs, but Action Adventure and Platformer are the PS3's two strongest genres...

-Ratchet and Clank games (two, with another releasing this year)  Guns.

-LBP This had potential to be considered good but I'm not too much into creating levels and such. I found the controls dodgy as well. The actual platforming gameplay of it is meh at best.

-Prince of Persia Okay game, a bit too repetitive. Also on 360.

-Uncharted

-Bionic Commando Rearmed

And quite a few more. Action Adventure...WOW:

-MGS4 Shooter/stealth... No thanks.

-Uncharted You said this one already.

-BioShock (it may be first person, but it's still Action Adventure)  Guns.

-inFamous Might be good, though I'm not into super heroes things.

-GTA4 Played some but it becomes very uninteresting after a while. I dislike anything to do with gangs, drugs, guns and such + also on 360.

-Ninja Gaiden Sigma 

-Resident Evil 5 I dislike anything involved with shooting.

-Devil May Cry 4 I might try that game sometime (blame Dante's sexyness) but also on PC and 360.

-Heavenly Sword Too much button mashing not enough adventuring/exploring. To be fair I'm going to say this game is okay.

-Saint's Row 2

-Assassin's Creed An okay game... Too repetitive imo. Also on 360 and PC.

-The Darkness Never heard of this. Will have to look it up.

And those are just 80+ on Metacritic...I don't own nearly all of those.

Okay this will look very picky but that's just how my gaming tastes are. I prefer fantasy settings, with swords and such... I dislike tactical RPGs (too slow) and I don't like games with guns, they're so bland. There isn't that many games I like due to this and to be fair, I'm a bit more into RPGs than other genres.

you are VERY picky of your game intersts, but that is your right. If you feel you cannot like any of the previously named games.(By the Way though, Heavenly Sword is NOT a button Masher, this is a common belief spread by people who never finished the game because there are MANY times throughout the game where you CANNOT face the enemy head on, you have to wait out an opening and pounce. It is no more a buttonmasher then anyother game).

You still should try Folklore, sounds like you might possibly like that...

PSN games seem to be the way for you at the time being. You should look into these games for the future...

Fat Princess

White Knight Chronicles

Demon's Soul

Pixel Junk series

 

 



      

      

      

Greatness Awaits

PSN:Forevercloud (looking for Soul Sacrifice Partners!!!)

insomniac17 on 13 May 2009
forevercloud3000 said:
lolita said:

Okay this will look very picky but that's just how my gaming tastes are. I prefer fantasy settings, with swords and such... I dislike tactical RPGs (too slow) and I don't like games with guns, they're so bland. There isn't that many games I like due to this and to be fair, I'm a bit more into RPGs than other genres.

you are VERY picky of your game intersts, but that is your right. If you feel you cannot like any of the previously named games.(By the Way though, Heavenly Sword is NOT a button Masher, this is a common belief spread by people who never finished the game because there are MANY times throughout the game where you CANNOT face the enemy head on, you have to wait out an opening and pounce. It is no more a buttonmasher then anyother game).

You still should try Folklore, sounds like you might possibly like that...

PSN games seem to be the way for you at the time being. You should look into these games for the future...

Fat Princess

White Knight Chronicles

Demon's Soul

Pixel Junk series

Yeah, it's kinda sad that you said no to R&C. Have you tried any of them? You should; some of the weapons are really crazy, and it's certainly not an average shooter game. If you like the platforming aspect Quest for Booty brings back a lot of the platforming focus, though it's very short. If you have tried them and don't like them, you've made me very sad. =(



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Mirson on 13 May 2009
forevercloud3000 said:
Mirson said:
Valkyria isn't that unique. Hogs of War on the PS1 says hello.

If you want innovative on PS3, go try out some PSN games. They're the best the console has to offer. Echochrome comes to mind.

 

does Hogs of War have "Potentials", effectively giving each character(over 50) personality and unique in battle? Does it give a story in a History book like fashion? Does it give you the ability to use terrain to your advantage in a FPS like fashion(crouching in grass, watch towers, etc)? Can you upgrade and customize your team's weapons which also includes decking out tanks with new armor and weaponry?

While the game seems to give the same impression of being able to roam the field like VC, it ends there.

Now you're just cherry-picking. The gameplay is basically the same as Valkyria. Hell, it even has multiplayer, the ability to upgrade your weapons, hogs, and change their classes, etc. You can roam around with vehicles. In a way, Hogs of War is more advanced than Valkyria. Other games used a storybook fashion to tell a story. No big deal.



Mirson on 13 May 2009
forevercloud3000 said:

you are VERY picky of your game intersts, but that is your right. If you feel you cannot like any of the previously named games.(By the Way though, Heavenly Sword is NOT a button Masher, this is a common belief spread by people who never finished the game because there are MANY times throughout the game where you CANNOT face the enemy head on, you have to wait out an opening and pounce. It is no more a buttonmasher then anyother game).

You still should try Folklore, sounds like you might possibly like that...

PSN games seem to be the way for you at the time being. You should look into these games for the future...

Fat Princess

White Knight Chronicles

Demon's Soul

Pixel Junk series

 

 

My friend, believe.