Look, isn't it obvious. No one on this post wants to recognize Microsoft for doing anything at all for gaming period. The people who are speaking up are just being told to kindly shush, only Sony and Nintendo have accomplished anything.

When I said original Xbox it wasn't a fanboy thing, the original Xbox was the LAST system I bought that generation after owning a dreamcast, PS2 and gamecube. Oddly enough it was also the most advanced in terms of features and growth for the industry.

But we've long since established this post is all about popularity not innovation. Although I could argue that being a Halo freak was a cool as cool could be and you started seeing X-boxs on TV shows and movies, which made it mainstream which helped 360 take the place it has now.

And I agree the NES should be number 1. Gaming was near the dying point before Mario revitalized it. Plus the NES was as mainstream as you could get back in the day. All the neighborhood kids had them in their houses and the adults played things like Duck Hunt. Wii may be a beast but it only saved Nintendo, gaming as a whole was doing better than ever before it was released. You could argue gaming was more mainstream than it had ever been in the Pac-Man days when children and adults alike all flocked to Sears to buy Ataris and played arcade games in droves.

lol ure half rite :P halo did come out first, but only a year before SOCOM :P my appologies

Yeah, and until this generation, many games didn't take that long to develop. Particularly if the engine was already made, like it was for SOCOM.

I've omitted the last paragraph in your post because it opens up a completely different can of worms (albeit one that is tangentially related to the topic). If you wish, we can address it later.

The problem you have with arguing that the Xbox belongs in the list is that while it may be advanced, and it did introduce some innovations to the console field, it's tough to argue that it really made gaming more "mainstream." Granted that many of its games, most notably Halo, were multi-platinum sellers, but there is little to indicate that the appeal of those games, or the system they're hosted on, expanded their reach beyond a single (albeit sizeable) niche of 16-25 year old males. Indeed, if the Xbox line made inroads into the mainstream, it would not only have sold far more units than it did, but Microsoft would not be exerting anywhere near as much effort to change its image towards being a more family-friendly console.

As a single example, consider last year's E3. Nintendo was widely expected to offer more "hardcore" games, because they knew that the Wii and DS had already locked up the mainstream gamers. By contrast, everyone expected Microsoft to offer more "casual" games so as to entice that very same mainstream. And that "everyone" includes Nintendo: it is no coincidence that it highlighted Wii Sports Resort, Animal Crossing, and Wii Music at its conference, rather than titles like Pikmin 3, Punch-Out, etc. After all, Nintendo expected that Microsoft would begin to court the expanded audience. And you don't court an audience that you already have...

In short, Microsoft is pursuing the mainstream because it does not yet have it. Its behavior belies the claim that the 360, let alone the original Xbox, was truly in the "mainstream."

Little late to this party and probably already mentioned.... but Xbox should be on list due to entrance of Internet gameplay and capabilities that no one else really pushed anywhere near as good. Dreamcast was ok, but, the xbox really made it a must have for any home console.

Other than that I concur with your ideas.

noname2200, casual and mainstream are two different things. But I don't disagree with half of what your saying I just think this whole topic has gone crazy. The OP has already made it more than clear it's about popularity and mainstream appeal. I am arguing under the topic name "most important video game consoles." I guess my overall point is "important" shouldn't mean it was important because it sold a lot of systems or appealed to new players but "important" because the systems innovate and advance the field itself. What's "important" to you?

And I'm sorry I didn't address half of what you said but I'm at work and I'm exhausted. From now on out I'm just going to state my opinion and leave it at that. I really don't have anything to prove, as countless other posts on this topic have backed me up that the original Xbox, not the 360, deserve credit. If it was fanboy tripe based on favorite systems I'd pick the 360 in a heartbeat over the original. I'm not doing that, I had logical well stated reasons why I felt the original broke ground. And all that's been done is that every single thing I say is picked apart word by word as everyone just rips into it one way or another. You think after all this time I would realize that debating anything online is pointless, but thank you for your views and opinions and I do respect them.

Your criticism about the thread title is valid, I think. "Important" is a broader term than how it is used in this thread, so the thread title is a bit misleading.

As to the second part of your post, keep your chin up! You'll find that just posting your opinion, without engaging in discussion, gets dull REAL quick. I realize it can become tiresome to bang your head against the same wall time and again, but then I've also found that making the effort often pays off: you learn from these discussions, sometimes because your fellow posters have new information/insights, and sometimes because you sharpen your skills at spotting losing battles.

I can't deny, though, that it can get to you if you don't take a step back every now and again.

In any case, hope your work day's almost done, and that you can get home, plop yourself on the couch, and play some games soon. I've found that a session with friends can soothe all but the worst aches of the day.

Sony and Microsoft stole all it's ideas?

Interactive Camera, built in online play standard, a bunch of other stuff i can't even remember.

I could see the arguement under some criteria.  Though this is based on a market one so...

noname2200, thanks. It's almost that time! I'll be couch-a-plopping.

Anybody whining about XBox Live needs to remember that Battle.Net has more active users and it's only compatible with 5 games.

And anybody whining about Halo making FPS mainstream doesn't remember how big Doom, GoldenEye, or Half-Life were. Doom was so huge that Bill Gates actually lived inside the game to advertise for Windows 95.