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Forums - General - Would you like Europe to become a "real country": United States of Europe.

Lostplanet22 on 27 February 2009
im_sneaky said:
Tremble said:
No way he did say that??? The assh****. New members are very boring, they always have something to complain about. They knew what the EU is and how it works, it that didn't suit them, why joining they eu???

 

Because everyone else is in it. Who are they going to trade with? Russia?

Actually, good idea! Russia should join the EU! rofl! That would be hilarious..... not that it will happen.

 

Well chouldn't harm them look to Norway and Switzerland. Anyway Tremble is right we saw some very shocking comments from East Europe about the European Union.

This reminds of a a minister from poland who said 'It is not fair that Germany has more votes in he EU simply because they have a bigger population' 'It is the Germans mass murdering during WOII that our population is so low'.



 

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draik on 27 February 2009
Kasz216 said:
draik said:
Kasz216 said:

Eh. Depends on the laws obviouslly. Don't live in europe. But i know i'd like to see some racist laws removed from some countries before i'd agree to it if i lived in an Europeon country. (I'm looking at you france.)

Which laws exactly?

The headscarf ban in town halls etc.? Because you can't wear crosses either, government = separation of religion and state.

 

We all know who that law was targetted at.  And that's not seperation of religion and state.   That's religious persecution.

When someone believes they HAVE to wear something based on their religion it's just plain bigotry.

Seperation of Church and State means that the state is seperate from a church.  IE doesn't favor one.  Not that if your on state grounds you can't so any sign of faith.

Once next?  Arresting people who look like they are praying?

 

You can wear scarfs and crosses on state ground, but if your working for the state you can not wear it (during work hours). You can go pray or whatever during your break.



 

Tremble on 27 February 2009

Yeah it's the same in belgium: no cross, no scarfs! I think it's normal, religion is a private thing.



Kasz216 on 27 February 2009
draik said:
Kasz216 said:
draik said:
Kasz216 said:

Eh. Depends on the laws obviouslly. Don't live in europe. But i know i'd like to see some racist laws removed from some countries before i'd agree to it if i lived in an Europeon country. (I'm looking at you france.)

Which laws exactly?

The headscarf ban in town halls etc.? Because you can't wear crosses either, government = separation of religion and state.

 

We all know who that law was targetted at.  And that's not seperation of religion and state.   That's religious persecution.

When someone believes they HAVE to wear something based on their religion it's just plain bigotry.

Seperation of Church and State means that the state is seperate from a church.  IE doesn't favor one.  Not that if your on state grounds you can't so any sign of faith.

Once next?  Arresting people who look like they are praying?

 

You can wear scarfs and crosses on state ground, but if your working for the state you can not wear it (during work hours). You can go pray or whatever during your break.

What about people who are forced to wear such things for their belief structure?

Aka the scarves being banned in schools.  For students.  Making those students choose between education and their beliefs.

By telling people they can't wear their headscarves on grounds... you are preventing muslims from having government jobs.

Not allowing people to express their faith is pure bigotry... espiecally when it is seen as required by their religion.

 



Tremble on 27 February 2009

@kasz216: well they simply have to make a choice: law or religion ... You really have to understand something: in our countries, religion is a private thing, something that you practice in a private space. Public space must be "religion free".



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SciFiBoy on 27 February 2009
Tremble said:
@kasz216: well they simply have to make a choice: law or religion ... You really have to understand something: in our countries, religion is a private thing, something that you practice in a private space. Public space must be "religion free".

 

lucky you, i long for the day i can say that about the UK...



Kasz216 on 27 February 2009
Tremble said:
@kasz216: well they simply have to make a choice: law or religion ... You really have to understand something: in our countries, religion is a private thing, something that you practice in a private space. Public space must be "religion free".

 

Yeah... that's called bigotry... and hate laws.



Tremble on 27 February 2009

that's not bigotry that's simply logic! I prefer living in my system than in yours, where the president finish every sentence by "god something" or "god said that".



Final-Fan on 27 February 2009
Tremble said:
@kasz216: well they simply have to make a choice: law or religion ... You really have to understand something: in our countries, religion is a private thing, something that you practice in a private space. Public space must be "religion free".

I don't think you comprehend the ideal of free expression of ideas. 

that's not bigotry that's simply logic! I prefer living in my system than in yours, where the president finish every sentence by "god something" or "god said that".

So you'd prefer that the President be PROHIBITED from mentioning his faith? 



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Kasz216 on 27 February 2009
Tremble said:
that's not bigotry that's simply logic! I prefer living in my system than in yours, where the president finish every sentence by "god something" or "god said that".

Simple logic?  It's bigotry and the supression of peoples ideas.

That is simple logic.

Freedom is letting people do what they want so long as it doesn't hurt others.

Wearing a cross doesn't hurt anybody.  Disallowing someone to wear one does.

The same with headscarves.

The laws against it are illogical.