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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - The state of Microsoft's 1st/2nd party

makingmusic476 on 25 October 2008
goddog said:
makingmusic476 said:
thekitchensink said:

Reserved this spot for after I finish reading that epic post.

 

EDIT: Okay, I've read it now.

1. Bungie ain't first-party no more--haven't been for over a year.

2. That's a great read, and it's interesting when you lay all the facts out on the table like that.  However, didn't they hire most of the Ensemble guys directly into their MS Game Studios team?

 

I kind've lumped Bungie in as second party, though I suppose it's possible that after Halo 3 Recon they'll look for another publisher.

As for Ensemble, many were spread out amongst MGS, many split off to form a new studio, and many just outright left for other studios, or plan to leave after Halo Wars is finished.  You can find out a bit more about what happened via the link in the article.  The whole thing just kind've hit them by surprise, and they certainly weren't happy about it.

 

bungie is a weird studio now, they have rules they must fallow when looking for a publisher, one of which requires them to give MS a chance to publish any titles, though i do not know if they can trun down an ms offer, really what bungie wanted was creative freedom to work on new games and they have that now, so i do expect to see new ip's it will be interesting to see if ms chooses to be publisher on any of them

 

I originally thought that as well, until I saw this:

http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3170768

However, given Bungie's relationship with Microsoft I don't think they'll look for another publisher, and they certainly won't get bought out by another larger publisher like BioWare or Bizarre, since they were specifically trying to get away from all that by leaving Microsoft. 

They'll probably be Microsoft's Insomniac.



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makingmusic476 on 25 October 2008
Munkeh111 said:
Great read, I have also heard rumours about Rare being closed because their games have not been too great, but I still doubt that.

Anyway, I think Sony's method, of investing in first party studios and doing a lot of 2nd party work is much better than just buying the 3rd party timed exclusives.

There are still questions, of course, how much control Microsoft have over the Gears and Mass Effect IPs and if they go, the only major ones that they will have left are Halo and Fable....

 

Rare won't be closed.  Or at least, I don't see why they would be closed.  But then again, Ensemble was completely out of the blue...

But I guess Rare is now Microsoft's counter to LittleBigPlanet, so I'm sure they'll stick around.

As for Gears, the IP is owned by Epic, and the original contract between MS and Epic gave MS the rights to publish the first two titles in the series. The third (and Epic has stated it will be a trilogy) is technically up for grabs, but I don't see why MS wouldn't ink another contract for that one as well.

As for Mass Effect, I guess it's up to whatever deal MS can work out with EA.  BioWare has always owned all of their IPs, so they're now under the control of EA.  EA even published the PC version of Mass Effect.



goddog on 25 October 2008
makingmusic476 said:
goddog said:
makingmusic476 said:
thekitchensink said:

Reserved this spot for after I finish reading that epic post.

 

EDIT: Okay, I've read it now.

1. Bungie ain't first-party no more--haven't been for over a year.

2. That's a great read, and it's interesting when you lay all the facts out on the table like that.  However, didn't they hire most of the Ensemble guys directly into their MS Game Studios team?

 

I kind've lumped Bungie in as second party, though I suppose it's possible that after Halo 3 Recon they'll look for another publisher.

As for Ensemble, many were spread out amongst MGS, many split off to form a new studio, and many just outright left for other studios, or plan to leave after Halo Wars is finished.  You can find out a bit more about what happened via the link in the article.  The whole thing just kind've hit them by surprise, and they certainly weren't happy about it.

 

bungie is a weird studio now, they have rules they must fallow when looking for a publisher, one of which requires them to give MS a chance to publish any titles, though i do not know if they can trun down an ms offer, really what bungie wanted was creative freedom to work on new games and they have that now, so i do expect to see new ip's it will be interesting to see if ms chooses to be publisher on any of them

 

I originally thought that as well, until I saw this:

http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3170768

However, given Bungie's relationship with Microsoft I don't think they'll look for another publisher, and they certainly won't get bought out by another larger publisher like BioWare or Bizarre, since they were specifically trying to get away from all that by leaving Microsoft. 

They'll probably be Microsoft's Insomniac.

that didnt change what i said,  they are not tied to ms which means they can shop for one while pitching ms, most likely they will go for best offer, ms might have the option to match to keep it, but we dont know the true nature of the agreement

 



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EaglesEye379 on 25 October 2008

As a 360 fan, I am not at all worried about the current state of Microsoft Games Studios as you put it. If you want to compare the top MS vs Sony developed or published games, you are comparing Halo 3, Gears, Forza 2, Mass Effect vs Motorstorm, Resistance, Uncharted, Gran Turismo Prologue.

And with that, MS wins on both sales, popularity and critical acclaim. Since I havent played those Sony games, this is the neutral way we can compare them and lets not kid around, on neutral scales, MS made better games that sold more. Why would I be worried or doubt they will come up with the goods again? Arguably, the fastest selling exclusive game for PS3 this gen so far is MGS4 which is third party so theres still alot to prove. The question is whether LBP can hit the lofty levels that Sony wants and that is yet to be seen.

Rare/Lionhead/Turn 10 and the internal MGS studio has very big projects upcoming and I still say Mass Effect 2 will most likely be exclusive.



Munkeh111 on 25 October 2008
EaglesEye379 said:
As a 360 fan, I am not at all worried about the current state of Microsoft Games Studios as you put it. If you want to compare the top MS vs Sony developed or published games, you are comparing Halo 3, Gears, Forza 2, Mass Effect vs Motorstorm, Resistance, Uncharted, Gran Turismo Prologue.

And with that, MS wins on both sales, popularity and critical acclaim. Since I havent played those Sony games, this is the neutral way we can compare them and lets not kid around, on neutral scales, MS made better games that sold more. Why would I be worried or doubt they will come up with the goods again? Arguably, the fastest selling exclusive game for PS3 this gen so far is MGS4 which is third party so theres still alot to prove. The question is whether LBP can hit the lofty levels that Sony wants and that is yet to be seen.

Rare/Lionhead/Turn 10 and the internal MGS studio has very big projects upcoming and I still say Mass Effect 2 will most likely be exclusive.

 

No you are not, Sony also have Ratchet, Warhawk, Heavenly Sword. Sony have a much better 1st party line-up, with titles like inFamous, Killzone 2, MAG, God of War III all in the pipe line



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heruamon on 25 October 2008

Interesting read...I think or M$, they needed to make a full court press to get 3rd parties to commit to developing for the console...mission accomplished in a MAJOR way, with most selling just as strong, if not better on the 360. I think the current movies by M$ points to consolidation of 1st parties under a MGS banner. Is this the best move...maybe...maybe not, but I think we will need to see some results before issuing any proclamations of failure or success.



"...You can't kill ideas with a sword, and you can't sink belief structures with a broadside. You defeat them by making them change..."

- From By Schism Rent Asunder

DOATS1 on 25 October 2008
EaglesEye379 said:
As a 360 fan, I am not at all worried about the current state of Microsoft Games Studios as you put it. If you want to compare the top MS vs Sony developed or published games, you are comparing Halo 3, Gears, Forza 2, Mass Effect vs Motorstorm, Resistance, Uncharted, Gran Turismo Prologue.

And with that, MS wins on both sales, popularity and critical acclaim. Since I havent played those Sony games, this is the neutral way we can compare them and lets not kid around, on neutral scales, MS made better games that sold more. Why would I be worried or doubt they will come up with the goods again? Arguably, the fastest selling exclusive game for PS3 this gen so far is MGS4 which is third party so theres still alot to prove. The question is whether LBP can hit the lofty levels that Sony wants and that is yet to be seen.

Rare/Lionhead/Turn 10 and the internal MGS studio has very big projects upcoming and I still say Mass Effect 2 will most likely be exclusive.

you missed out a few sony first/second party exclusives.

EDIT: as munkeh point out.

 




Bitmap Frogs on 25 October 2008
Tbone said:
Great read.

I think that Microsoft is focusing more on getting Sonys exclusive games rather making their 1:st and 2;nd party games.

 

Those games you mention were never sony's own. They belonged to third parties.





Current-gen game collection uploaded on the profile, full of win and good games; also most of my PC games. Lucasfilm Games/LucasArts 1982-2008 (Requiescat In Pace).

DOATS1 on 25 October 2008
Bitmap Frogs said:
Tbone said:
Great read.

I think that Microsoft is focusing more on getting Sonys exclusive games rather making their 1:st and 2;nd party games.

 

Those games you mention were never sony's own. They belonged to third parties.

he never said they were sony's own. but they were exclusive to sony's consoles.




Seece on 25 October 2008
Gamer4eva said:
But are they in a better position? Their gaming division has lost 7billion dollars whilst Sony has still got their 2.5 billion to fall back on. Not to mention I think they posted a profit last Quater, so Sony are in a decent position. I rely hope SONY destroys MSOftz gaming division, LOL.

 

Actually its just a shade over 6 Billion seen as Microsoft posted a profit last year and this last quater. Sony won't be making huge profits any time soon, look on the front page.

Not only that but its the entertainemnt division not the gaming division, its all lumped into one. Xbox 360, Surface, Zune ect