This.

Wait, so user prediction on VGC determine if a game is a flop now-a-days?

Then you can make a list of those dumbasses and say it's a failure to them, but generalizing is just as foolish. I don't think I need to tell you that those on these forums don't represent the average and also that those who are most vocal and whose opinions you most easily remember are not the ones with the most reasonable predictions. So keep a list and say to them it's a failure, but don't tell me it's a failure to the fanbase in general, because these forums do not represent the average user and those predictions and fanboys that attacked you don't even represent the average PS3 supporting poster on these same forums.

Basically, quit generalizing a large fanbase based on a few fools.

I'm not saying it is a failure in general ... I'm saying it was a failure relative to those expectations!

Relative : estimated by comparison; not absolute or complete

Learn the word before you get up on your high horse

Zack & Wiki was a critical and commercial success for what it was. It surpassed Capcom's expectations, by quite a bit. However it didn't match the expectations of people on sites like this.

In the same regard LBP will be a critical and commercial success (quite larger than Z&W) but likely will not meet the expectations of people on sites like this one either. PS3 is still way overpriced for the masses and so far PS3 is definately not a system to get if you're a fan of platformers (Wii & 360 have far more). LBP will sell well, just not phenominally well like the fanboys are hoping.

Well then here. I estimate that it was a relative success. Look we're both right because there's no way to make a comparison of "hype" and therefore no way to validate either of our statements. That way I can say the game was a success, and you can keep touting it as a failure. Everyone wins.

I never claimed that it was a failure ... I said it could be considered a failure when you compared it to unrealistic expectations (which you agreed with).

Besides this, I used Ratchet and Clank as an EXAMPLE of how success and failure is a relative concept that depends on what you're comparing it to because it works really well. When compared to other Ratchet and Clank games, or to general expectations, it could be considered a failure whereas when you look at it from a financial perspective it was a successful game. Somehow, in making this point (that you appear to agree with) I was somehow generalizing PS3 fans and bashing Ratchet and Clank ...

There are released Wii games (Boom Blox, Zack and Wiki, and No More Heroes) which also fall into this category, and future Wii games (The Conduit) which will also fall into this category, but I wanted to use a game where the success from a financial perspective was obvious ...

 thus the reason I said it would sell a minimum of 3x what Z&W did. Also, I do see similarities. Z&W had alot of internet hype, that is why it sold OK. LBP is a better game (from what I am hearing so far) it has more hype and such. That is why I handicaped it a 3x more than Z&W means it got Z&Wed. I can see it getting shunned by the mainstream, like Z&W, because of its differentness.

Alright, it's a failure to unrealistic people. We can agree with that. But when you take these unrealistic people and say it failed to "the fanbase in general" that's what I take issue with. You take the unrealistic expectations and make a blanket statement about the expectations of the fanbase in general, which I and many other very reasonable people are a part of. For every unrealistic LBP expectation at or above 5 I can bet you that I will find atleast 1 that's 2-3 mil from that very same fanbase.

I think SMG is a better comparison for LBP. They are both flagships for their brand and have full backing by their systems.