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Forums - Sony Discussion - VGChartz Playstation Trophy League

REDZONE on 01 June 2011

Thanks for the update.I should have killzone3 and LA Noire plat by next week.



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Ail on 01 June 2011
fadetoone said:

Hell, I think 2 stars for Portal 2 is pushing it.  It's quite simple.

 

Arcturus said:
fadetoone said:

Sweet.  My TWO copies of Infamous 2 I won showed up today!


How the hell did you manage to win two copies of Infamous 2!?

I think several people got 2 (one from the Subway game and one from the Subway Fire Drill/Frenzy thing).

I actually got 2 from the game.  I figured they'd only send me one, or maybe even cancel out my first win, but they sent both.

#WINNING


I have only one thing to answer to this.

Jimmy Jones >>>>>>>> Subway.

sucky sandwishes aren't an excuse for games !!!



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !

fadetoone on 01 June 2011
Ail said:


I have only one thing to answer to this.

Jimmy Jones >>>>>>>> Subway.

sucky sandwishes aren't an excuse for games !!!

No one ever said I ate there.

I will say about Infamous 2 though, I hope the game has an explanation for why Cole's voice actor is completely different.



EncodedNybble on 01 June 2011
fadetoone said:
Ail said:


I have only one thing to answer to this.

Jimmy Jones >>>>>>>> Subway.

sucky sandwishes aren't an excuse for games !!!

No one ever said I ate there.

I will say about Infamous 2 though, I hope the game has an explanation for why Cole's voice actor is completely different.

I doubt it.  Just be thankful that they brought his original game model back.  He woulda had a completely different voice and look!



chenguo4 on 01 June 2011

I think the best way to settle this, any everything is to properly define trophy ratings.

I propose the following:

1) Map difficulty to 5 star scale - use ps3trophies.org polls, when > N ppl have voted, or game has been out for 1 month

2) Map time to 5 star scale - maybe something like
    1-15 h: *
    16 - 35h: **
    36 - 80h: ***
    81 - 150h: ****
    151h or more: *****

3) Find an appropriate weight. Game score = A * diffciculty stars plus B * time stars. Maybe something like A/B = 3 or A/B = 4 works. I feel difficulty is more important than time, but time obviously does still carry significant weight.

4) Normalize: that is, we'll get a wide range of values using the above formula. We map the lowest 20% to 1 star, the next 20% to 2 stars, or whatever.
Or if we want to do a bell curve-ish kinda thing, lowest 10% = *, next 20% = **, next 40% = ***, next 20% = ****, last 10% = *****


Now there's always the issue sometimes DLC makes the game easier, or overtime the online dies and trophies become very difficulty/impossible. I don't think there can ever be a good solution for that.

This is just a conversation starter, with the hope of working something out. For example, one flaw with this system is that ps3trophies.org difficulty ratings may already factor in time.




PSN: chenguo4
Current playing: No More Heroes

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HideoK on 01 June 2011
fadetoone said:

No one ever said I ate there.

Wait, if you never ate there then how did you win the games?

Two free copies of inFamous 2 a week before release? I'm jealous.



fadetoone on 01 June 2011
EncodedNybble said:

I doubt it.  Just be thankful that they brought his original game model back.  He woulda had a completely different voice and look!

You'd be hard pressed to even call it his original game model.  The game seems to have a starkly different art style.

 

HideoK said:
fadetoone said:

No one ever said I ate there.

Wait, if you never ate there then how did you win the games?

Two free copies of inFamous 2 a week before release? I'm jealous.

There were many reusable free codes you could use to play, and the Frenzy things only required you follow them on Twitter (that's how I won the PS Move Heroes and a $5 subway card).



Arcturus on 01 June 2011
chenguo4 said:

I think the best way to settle this, any everything is to properly define trophy ratings.

I propose the following:

1) Map difficulty to 5 star scale - use ps3trophies.org polls, when > N ppl have voted, or game has been out for 1 month
- the ps3trophies.org polls usually reflect both difficulty and time (just noticed your last sentence)
- some obscure games only have a few people who play and rate it. These games may never meet the > N ppl voted requirement
- we have some people who get the platinum for a game in the first week of its release. How would we record the platinum trophy, but not the rating if we had to wait until a game has been out for more than a month to capture its rating from the poll? This could be a bit messy.

2) Map time to 5 star scale - maybe something like
    1-15 h: *
    16 - 35h: **
    36 - 80h: ***
    81 - 150h: ****
    151h or more: *****
- where do we get this information?
- estimates on the time it takes to earn a platinum trophy can vary greatly. Would we take an average of > N estimates? Is there a reliable place to collect these estimates?

3) Find an appropriate weight. Game score = A * diffciculty stars plus B * time stars. Maybe something like A/B = 3 or A/B = 4 works. I feel difficulty is more important than time, but time obviously does still carry significant weight.

4) Normalize: that is, we'll get a wide range of values using the above formula. We map the lowest 20% to 1 star, the next 20% to 2 stars, or whatever.
Or if we want to do a bell curve-ish kinda thing, lowest 10% = *, next 20% = **, next 40% = ***, next 20% = ****, last 10% = *****
- although not difficult to change, the ratings would constantly be in flux


Now there's always the issue sometimes DLC makes the game easier, or overtime the online dies and trophies become very difficulty/impossible. I don't think there can ever be a good solution for that.

This is just a conversation starter, with the hope of working something out. For example, one flaw with this system is that ps3trophies.org difficulty ratings may already factor in time.

Great conversation starter! Let me poke a few holes, or add extra challenges to think about...however you want to interpret it :)

See my comments above.



Tbone on 01 June 2011
chenguo4 said:

I think the best way to settle this, any everything is to properly define trophy ratings.

I propose the following:

1) Map difficulty to 5 star scale - use ps3trophies.org polls, when > N ppl have voted, or game has been out for 1 month

2) Map time to 5 star scale - maybe something like
    1-15 h: *
    16 - 35h: **
    36 - 80h: ***
    81 - 150h: ****
    151h or more: *****

3) Find an appropriate weight. Game score = A * diffciculty stars plus B * time stars. Maybe something like A/B = 3 or A/B = 4 works. I feel difficulty is more important than time, but time obviously does still carry significant weight.

4) Normalize: that is, we'll get a wide range of values using the above formula. We map the lowest 20% to 1 star, the next 20% to 2 stars, or whatever.
Or if we want to do a bell curve-ish kinda thing, lowest 10% = *, next 20% = **, next 40% = ***, next 20% = ****, last 10% = *****


Now there's always the issue sometimes DLC makes the game easier, or overtime the online dies and trophies become very difficulty/impossible. I don't think there can ever be a good solution for that.

This is just a conversation starter, with the hope of working something out. For example, one flaw with this system is that ps3trophies.org difficulty ratings may already factor in time.

If this was the case then we would have alot more 5 stars platinum.

Like i said before people look into how much time they spent on the game then actual challenge.



 

chenguo4 on 01 June 2011
Arcturus said:
chenguo4 said:

I think the best way to settle this, any everything is to properly define trophy ratings.

I propose the following:

1) Map difficulty to 5 star scale - use ps3trophies.org polls, when > N ppl have voted, or game has been out for 1 month
- the ps3trophies.org polls usually reflect both difficulty and time (just noticed your last sentence)
- some obscure games only have a few people who play and rate it. These games may never meet the > N ppl voted requirement
- we have some people who get the platinum for a game in the first week of its release. How would we record the platinum trophy, but not the rating if we had to wait until a game has been out for more than a month to capture its rating from the poll? This could be a bit messy.

2) Map time to 5 star scale - maybe something like
    1-15 h: *
    16 - 35h: **
    36 - 80h: ***
    81 - 150h: ****
    151h or more: *****
- where do we get this information?
- estimates on the time it takes to earn a platinum trophy can vary greatly. Would we take an average of > N estimates? Is there a reliable place to collect these estimates?

3) Find an appropriate weight. Game score = A * diffciculty stars plus B * time stars. Maybe something like A/B = 3 or A/B = 4 works. I feel difficulty is more important than time, but time obviously does still carry significant weight.

4) Normalize: that is, we'll get a wide range of values using the above formula. We map the lowest 20% to 1 star, the next 20% to 2 stars, or whatever.
Or if we want to do a bell curve-ish kinda thing, lowest 10% = *, next 20% = **, next 40% = ***, next 20% = ****, last 10% = *****
- although not difficult to change, the ratings would constantly be in flux


Now there's always the issue sometimes DLC makes the game easier, or overtime the online dies and trophies become very difficulty/impossible. I don't think there can ever be a good solution for that.

This is just a conversation starter, with the hope of working something out. For example, one flaw with this system is that ps3trophies.org difficulty ratings may already factor in time.

Great conversation starter! Let me poke a few holes, or add extra challenges to think about...however you want to interpret it :)

See my comments above.


I'll try to answer 1 by 1.

1) Not enough ppl plat obscure games: the 1 month thing is to combat this. The time to wait can be debated.

2) Ppl platting before we have a rating: so we award them points for the overall league, but wait until we have a rating to award them points in the stars based leaderboards. In the meanwhile we'll just have the rating by blank. For each blank game we can just track who's gotten it, then once we have a score award those ppl the points.

3) Time to plat: Actually, ps3trophies.org roadmaps usually include a time estimate. Multiple sources (if we can find them) might be good. In the case of ranges, we'll take the average. For multiple sources, naturally we'll take the average, unless there's some hugh outlier over/underestimating it.

4) Ratings in flux: so I was thinking that now we have quite a few games in the trophies list, we have enough of a sample size where, from here on out we can expect little variation. Therefore, we can make thresholds based off of the current games in the list, then go from there. Unless 1000x really easy Move games come out the next couple of years, the thresholds won't change that much, since we already have a couple hundred games listed.




PSN: chenguo4
Current playing: No More Heroes