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Forums - Sony Discussion - PS5 Pro revealed. November 7th 2024. $699

chakkra said:
Chrkeller said:

PC.

They just announced a $700 console with no disc drive.. does that seem to you that they are worried about PC in any way?

Worried?  They are joining the PC bandwagon.  Last I checked all the top ps5 games are on PC.  

Given Sony is charging $700 for the Pro and is releasing all their games on PC, I think they are more interested in being a software company than a hardware.  



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Chrkeller said:
chakkra said:

They just announced a $700 console with no disc drive.. does that seem to you that they are worried about PC in any way?

Worried?  They are joining the PC bandwagon.  Last I checked all the top ps5 games are on PC.  

Given Sony is charging $700 for the Pro and is releasing all their games on PC, I think they are more interested in being a software company than a hardware.  

Idk about that. Unlike Microsoft, Sony has always been in the hardware business. 

That being said though, PC gaming has the most to gain going forward. A lot of people try to say that PC gaming isn't in the same market as Xbox or PlayStation, but it absolutely is. I hate to break it, but if I buy the upcoming Silent Hill 2 on PC, which I am planning on doing, that's a sale that ISN'T going in favor of Sony despite the game being "exclusive." Same thing goes for any 3rd party game that's available on both PS5 and PC when I choose to buy the game on PC. Of course the rule also applies to Xbox. And if console prices continue to go up, which it seems they most certainly are, there are going to be those that will just make the jump to PC. 

Xbox already supports Achievements, Saves, and Gamerscore on PC the way you would on an Xbox console. Now that it seems all future PlayStation games being ported to PC will now require a PSN account, even single player games, with Ghost of Tsushima being the first to have Trophy support, it seems like it's only a matter of time before PlayStation is fully incorporated into PC gaming the way Xbox is now. Granted, minus day one new AAA single player games........for now.



Chrkeller said:

Worried?  They are joining the PC bandwagon.  Last I checked all the top ps5 games are on PC.  

Given Sony is charging $700 for the Pro and is releasing all their games on PC, I think they are more interested in being a software company than a hardware.  

It does seem like Sony would rather sell $600 consoles and aim for an 80m user base than a $400 console and a 160m user base. That does fit with how the overall company outside of SIE has always operated.

Their games are released later on PC anyway, so no loss of potential software revenue.

I have my doubts if it's a winning strategy, long-term, but for the moment that's how things are looking like.



 

 

 

 

 

This does raise the question of how much the PS6 is gonna cost.
If it arrives in 2027/2028, the hardware needed to provide a substantial perceptual leap over PS5 Pro is not going to come cheap, especially given diminishing returns.
The pursuit of high end graphics could see a large portion of the console audience simply priced out of the market.



IcaroRibeiro said:
curl-6 said:

If I'm going to drop like $700-800 AUD on a brand new next generation console, then I want brand new experiences, not just the same games I've been playing since 2017 with some extra pixels and frames. There's nothing exciting or interesting about just playing Switch 1 games in 4K.

The point of a new generation is to enable new experiences.

But they are not the same games

They are newer games

Most Nintendo games are not technically demanding. Why should Nintendo not release their smaller games on both systems if they are perfectly able to run on both? Majority of Switch library of first 3 years are basically refurbished Wii U games, either straight ports or just games they withhold from releasing on Wii U since it was already a dead console

Seems a strange feeling. You want people to not be able to play games their console is perfectly able to run because you want to feel "exclusive"

If next gen exclusive type games can be made so they also work on last gen hardware, even if the last gen version plays poorly, that's not really a problem as long as the game can truly achieve it's next gen vision on the newest hardware. (It would be somewhat of a problem from a PR point of view if last gen players complain about how poorly the game functions, which could hinder the next gen version sales.)

That would be an extreme rarity. Few studios would bother to do that because of how much work it would be. Big AAA exclusive type games cost too much to make and take way too long already. They would either focus on making the game next gen exclusive only, or water down that next gen game so it works on last gen.

This is why some games, enough games, should be next gen exclusive. What's enough doesn't have a solid number or percentage to it though. Everybody will see it a bit differently as to what's enough. Now many games, like COD for example, can remain on last gen for years and nobody is really going to care much, so it's not like all games have to immediately jump to next gen.

The cost itself also matters. If PS5 Pro was slotting in at $499, and PS5 was dropping to $399, then while obviously buyers would want to see some new games showing off what the new Pro can do, it wouldn't have to be as many games. It's a value thing. The more that hardware is going to cost, the more someone is going to expect out of it. The fact SNY didn't show that at all just makes it sting all the worse for a buyer hyped to see what new games will be coming to the PS5 platform and what those experiences would be like on the Pro.



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curl-6 said:

This does raise the question of how much the PS6 is gonna cost.
If it arrives in 2027/2028, the hardware needed to provide a substantial perceptual leap over PS5 Pro is not going to come cheap, especially given diminishing returns.
The pursuit of high end graphics could see a large portion of the console audience simply priced out of the market.

If the economy continues to "wtf" us, they should target lower specs like the PS4 or even Xbox One, and "portabilize" it midgen as an enthusiast optional SKU. PS5 DE was an incredible system at launch as far as "power per buck". But its value significantly decreased over the years.

The new generation of gamers by 2028 will have not experienced "perceptual leaps" as we old console gamers knew them. Console generational leaps since the PS5 launched are a lot more similar to upgrading from a console to a PC within the same generation (so basically higher resolution, framerate, settings, and little else. You're rarely going to see nextgen games that are visually or mechanically jawdropping in the PS6 gen regardless of specs).

A "cheap" PS6 launching in 2028 should still have much better specs overall than PS5 Pro, because base consoles serve a different purpose than enthusiast devices and pack a lot more power per dollar.



curl-6 said:

This does raise the question of how much the PS6 is gonna cost.
If it arrives in 2027/2028, the hardware needed to provide a substantial perceptual leap over PS5 Pro is not going to come cheap, especially given diminishing returns.
The pursuit of high end graphics could see a large portion of the console audience simply priced out of the market.

You could end up with a $600-$750 PS6, where there are no exclusive PS6 games at all, or at least for a really really long time. The PS4 Pro Pro meme would basically become a full blown reality.

Wasn't there rumors of a potential, like PS4 Premium after the Pro? That could be another possibility, where we get PS5 Premium instead for $600-$750 in another 4 years, and the gen ends up being 12 years long or something like that.

The only way next gen remains somewhat normal at all, is if there is some eureka tech moment soon, or if inflation drops like a rock.



Kyuu said:
curl-6 said:

This does raise the question of how much the PS6 is gonna cost.
If it arrives in 2027/2028, the hardware needed to provide a substantial perceptual leap over PS5 Pro is not going to come cheap, especially given diminishing returns.
The pursuit of high end graphics could see a large portion of the console audience simply priced out of the market.

If the economy continues to "wtf" us, they should target lower specs like the PS4 or even Xbox One, and "portabilize" it midgen as an enthusiast optional SKU. PS5 DE was an incredible system at launch as far as "power per buck". But its value significantly decreased over the years.

The new generation of gamers by 2028 will have not experienced "perceptual leaps" as we old console gamers knew them. Console generational leaps since the PS5 launched are a lot more similar to upgrading from a console to a PC within the same generation (so basically higher resolution, framerate, settings, and little else. You're rarely going to see nextgen games that are visually or mechanically jawdropping in the PS6 gen regardless of specs).

A "cheap" PS6 launching in 2028 should still have much better specs overall than PS5 Pro, because base consoles serve a different purpose than enthusiast devices and pack a lot more power per dollar.

If the economy and inflation don't really change much, PS6 won't be able to be cheap and powerful. It just won't be possible.

Plus unless MS makes some serious moves with XB hardware, SNY will have little reason to make next gen cheap. The only reason we got the $399 PS5 Digital is because of the Series S. As soon as SNY knew they had enough momentum behind PS5, which came by the time PS5 Slim launched, they decided they didn't need to try and compete with Series S really. That's a big reason why the price went up.

A 'cheap' PS6 in 2028, as of now, isn't going to be that much more powerful than PS5 Pro and will cost $499.

In retrospect, PS5 should've been like 8TF and $399, or SNY shouldn't have launched the PS5 Pro.



Kyuu said:
curl-6 said:

This does raise the question of how much the PS6 is gonna cost.
If it arrives in 2027/2028, the hardware needed to provide a substantial perceptual leap over PS5 Pro is not going to come cheap, especially given diminishing returns.
The pursuit of high end graphics could see a large portion of the console audience simply priced out of the market.

If the economy continues to "wtf" us, they should target lower specs like the PS4 or even Xbox One, and "portabilize" it midgen as an enthusiast optional SKU. PS5 DE was an incredible system at launch as far as "power per buck". But its value significantly decreased over the years.

The new generation of gamers by 2028 will have not experienced "perceptual leaps" as we old console gamers knew them. Console generational leaps since the PS5 launched are a lot more similar to upgrading from a console to a PC within the same generation (so basically higher resolution, framerate, settings, and little else. You're rarely going to see nextgen games that are visually or mechanically jawdropping in the PS6 gen regardless of specs).

A "cheap" PS6 launching in 2028 should still have much better specs overall than PS5 Pro, because base consoles serve a different purpose than enthusiast devices and pack a lot more power per dollar.

The leaps will come in physics rather than visuals. Astrobot already hos tons of physically animated objects, however mostly just for show. Yet the physics based destruction is already adding to the game play. (ugh cutting out stuff on the crumbling platforms) The fluid simulation is also pretty cool and a promise for later games to actually treat water like a substance with volume rather than faking it. More games like From Dust, not hampered by small map size.

Mechanically jaw dropping games will come. We already had one, TotK, what you can do when you don't prioritize graphics. Problem with MS and Sony is, all the juice is used for looks. Yet now Hellblade 2 turned out not to sell, priorities might finally shift.

Basically the leaps will come from better distributed processing on the CPU side. More cores to handle more physics. While RT will change the look of games.

Anyway I still see perceptual leaps. Playing Miles Morales after Spider Man 2 was quite a downgrade. Plus we don't know yet what the 'generational leap' is, typically it takes to the end of the generation for the games to come out that show what the hardware is fully capable of.

Early PS3 games didn't feel like a generational leap either, despite going from SD to HD.

PS6 might have a 16 core CPU, probably 24GB RAM, the juice needed for simulating worlds. With 1440p upscaled to 4K being more than enough for the TV experience, priorities should shift to the simulation part rather than all on rendering.



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EricHiggin said:

If the economy and inflation don't really change much, PS6 won't be able to be cheap and powerful. It just won't be possible.

Plus unless MS makes some serious moves with XB hardware, SNY will have little reason to make next gen cheap. The only reason we got the $399 PS5 Digital is because of the Series S. As soon as SNY knew they had enough momentum behind PS5, which came by the time PS5 Slim launched, they decided they didn't need to try and compete with Series S really. That's a big reason why the price went up.

A 'cheap' PS6 in 2028, as of now, isn't going to be that much more powerful than PS5 Pro and will cost $499.

In retrospect, PS5 should've been like 8TF and $399, or SNY shouldn't have launched the PS5 Pro.

With the recent inflation, $499 in 2020 is already $590 today. I don't see PS6 launching for anything less than $599.

Maybe $549 without disc drive.

The Series S sold much better than Series X despite being on par with XBox One X. Sony could follow and launch 2 different power tiers at the start of next generation as well. Then the cheaper one could be $399, premium one $599.

If they both have the same CPU with the difference on the GPU side, maybe we will get more physics rather than more pixels!