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Forums - Politics Discussion - Surveys: Most Americans are "terfs".

eva01beserk said:

Wait a minute. I admit I could not read that entire thing as it was long as hell. But did he right in any part that he, the american people, jk Rowling or anybody was against trans right?

If I'm not mistaken peoples opinion are just that. Are these people now trying to take anything away from trans like by law or kicking them out of private places? Cuz I really dont think theres any movement of the sort.

The only thing im aware is hapening is that they want men out of female sports. And that to me sounds simple. Just make a trans league. Because you can identify as what you want but the genetic benefits you have at births dont go away. The same as the benefits women have when they go on testosteron when they switch to being a man.

"Are these people trying to take anything away from trans like by law"

Yes. If you don't think there is any movement on that front, look at Texas which has passed a law allowing the state to take your kids if you give them gender affirming care. This isn't just some low stakes conversation about sports (which is a much more complicated question than you are making it out to be), it is literally about whether these people should be allowed to exist as themselves.



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eva01beserk said:

Wait a minute. I admit I could not read that entire thing as it was long as hell. But did he right in any part that he, the american people, jk Rowling or anybody was against trans right?

If I'm not mistaken peoples opinion are just that. Are these people now trying to take anything away from trans like by law or kicking them out of private places? Cuz I really dont think theres any movement of the sort.

The only thing im aware is hapening is that they want men out of female sports. And that to me sounds simple. Just make a trans league. Because you can identify as what you want but the genetic benefits you have at births dont go away. The same as the benefits women have when they go on testosteron when they switch to being a man.

I wouldn't try to claim people as a whole feel one way or another about trans issues. There are definitely varied opinions, and there are those would would make certain spaces cis-female only. Not sure exactly of Rowling's stance on that.

As for sports, I don't think a trans league is a viable option. It's taken a ridiculously long time just to make female sports commercially viable, and there is no realistic way 2 more leagues will be workable (mtf and ftm, although maybe only one because few people object to ftm athletes competing with men for obvious reasons). In terms of trans women competing in female categories it may depend on the sport. The way they examine it is typically through age grading. Meaning, if a male to female competitor were the 20th best man in the world before transition, and after transition they were the 20th best woman, it would, likely, mean that there was no advantage to transitioning. This tends to be the case in a lot of distance sports like running/swimming/cycling where the difference between men and women are not great to begin with (the world record for a marathon is only about 15 minutes apart for males and females). So, while I'm not an expert, I would tentatively say in this case, a trans woman competing would probably be fine. In sports like lifting, it seems to be the case that transition does not mitigate the advantage of being born male, so my tentative position would be mtf athletes should not be able to compete in that category. 

That being said, it bears mentioning that even with people who aren't trans, there are issues. Castor Semenya is a South African runner who was assigned female at birth and identified female at birth, but is likely in some capacity intersex. Her testosterone levels are above limitations for women athletes, and there has been controversy over her ability to compete. She has not undergone any sort of hormone therapy to transition or anything. So, even when there are no trans people, there are still issues that can arise.

Sports in general though are far from the most important issue regarding trans rights. It is one that is frequently brought up because of the outsized importance we place on athletics. Firing someone for being trans for instance was perfectly legal until two years ago, and people are trying to get around that Supreme Court decision. I don't mean to devalue female sports but very few of us are going to ever be high level athletes, so on issues to figure out, I'd put that low on the totem pole. 

Last edited by JWeinCom - on 20 March 2022

JWeinCom said:
sundin13 said:

Wow, a bunch of Americans are transphobic? Color me shocked. I guess that makes it morally right to take away trans rights.

That was sarcasm, by the way. I don't give a fuck what the majority of Americans think.

Trans rights now.

What if I told you that 4 out of 5 dentists agreed?

The same 4 out of 5 dentists that want to put fluoride in our drinking water? Haven't you read Agenda 7-G? Wake up!



Does this site have a feature to block people and their posts?



TheWalrusCaesar said:

Does this site have a feature to block people and their posts?

I think so, but you got to pay for supporter. That's how they get you.



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JWeinCom said:
TheWalrusCaesar said:

Does this site have a feature to block people and their posts?

I think so, but you got to pay for supporter. That's how they get you.

Rip, nonetheless

trans rights and the original post of this discussion is disgusting. Goodbye y'all



sundin13 said:
eva01beserk said:

Wait a minute. I admit I could not read that entire thing as it was long as hell. But did he right in any part that he, the american people, jk Rowling or anybody was against trans right?

If I'm not mistaken peoples opinion are just that. Are these people now trying to take anything away from trans like by law or kicking them out of private places? Cuz I really dont think theres any movement of the sort.

The only thing im aware is hapening is that they want men out of female sports. And that to me sounds simple. Just make a trans league. Because you can identify as what you want but the genetic benefits you have at births dont go away. The same as the benefits women have when they go on testosteron when they switch to being a man.

"Are these people trying to take anything away from trans like by law"

Yes. If you don't think there is any movement on that front, look at Texas which has passed a law allowing the state to take your kids if you give them gender affirming care. This isn't just some low stakes conversation about sports (which is a much more complicated question than you are making it out to be), it is literally about whether these people should be allowed to exist as themselves.

But that's not true at all. Thats about helping real young kids to transition. And it makes sense that kids who dont know the first thing about sex or gender should have to buisness transitioning. There have been studies that show that most kids who transition at a young age just grow out of it. 



It takes genuine talent to see greatness in yourself despite your absence of genuine talent.

the-pi-guy said:
eva01beserk said:

Wait a minute. I admit I could not read that entire thing as it was long as hell. But did he right in any part that he, the american people, jk Rowling or anybody was against trans right?

If I'm not mistaken peoples opinion are just that. Are these people now trying to take anything away from trans like by law or kicking them out of private places? Cuz I really dont think theres any movement of the sort.

The only thing im aware is hapening is that they want men out of female sports. And that to me sounds simple. Just make a trans league. Because you can identify as what you want but the genetic benefits you have at births dont go away. The same as the benefits women have when they go on testosteron when they switch to being a man.

>Are these people now trying to take anything away from trans like by law or kicking them out of private places? 

Several states are making it illegal to give gender affirming care to kids. 

Several states are pushing other laws. 

>Just make a trans league

How many people are trans, how many people are athletes in some kind of competition? We are talking about a minority in a tiny minority. There are not enough people to set up a trans league. 

I answered to a previous post about the law.

Well that's just it about the sports. How is it ok for such a minority of the popelation to change the dinamics of a section of sports for women but its sudenly to hard for them to make their own league? If they are such a small population as you say then thered no need to bend any rules for them and they can compete with the other men.



It takes genuine talent to see greatness in yourself despite your absence of genuine talent.

JWeinCom said:
eva01beserk said:

Wait a minute. I admit I could not read that entire thing as it was long as hell. But did he right in any part that he, the american people, jk Rowling or anybody was against trans right?

If I'm not mistaken peoples opinion are just that. Are these people now trying to take anything away from trans like by law or kicking them out of private places? Cuz I really dont think theres any movement of the sort.

The only thing im aware is hapening is that they want men out of female sports. And that to me sounds simple. Just make a trans league. Because you can identify as what you want but the genetic benefits you have at births dont go away. The same as the benefits women have when they go on testosteron when they switch to being a man.

I wouldn't try to claim people as a whole feel one way or another about trans issues. There are definitely varied opinions, and there are those would would make certain spaces cis-female only. Not sure exactly of Rowling's stance on that.

As for sports, I don't think a trans league is a viable option. It's taken a ridiculously long time just to make female sports commercially viable, and there is no realistic way 2 more leagues will be workable (mtf and ftm, although maybe only one because few people object to ftm athletes competing with men for obvious reasons). In terms of trans women competing in female categories it may depend on the sport. The way they examine it is typically through age grading. Meaning, if a male to female competitor were the 20th best man in the world before transition, and after transition they wermen.i myself  20th best woman, it would, likely, mean that there was no advantage to transitioning. This tends to be the case in a lot of distance sports like running/swimming/cycling where the difference between men and women are not great to begin with (the world record for a marathon is only about 15 minutes apart for males and females). So, while I'm not an expert, I would tentatively say in this case, a trans woman competing would probably be fine. In sports like lifting, it seems to be the case that transition does not mitigate the advantage of being born male, so my tentative position would be mtf athletes should not be able to compete in that category. 

That being said, it bears mentioning that even with people who aren't trans, there are issues. Castor Semenya is a South African runner who was assigned female at birth and identified female at birth, but is likely in some capacity intersex. Her testosterone levels are above limitations for women athletes, and there has been controversy over her ability to compete. She has not undergone any sort of hormone therapy to transition or anything. So, even when there are no trans people, there are still issues that can arise.

Sports in general though are far from the most important issue regarding trans rights. It is one that is frequently brought up because of the outsized importance we place on athletics. Firing someone for being trans for instance was perfectly legal until two years ago, and people are trying to get around that Supreme Court decision. I don't mean to devalue female sports but very few of us are going to ever be high level athletes, so on issues to figure out, I'd put that low on the totem pole. 

i myself not really into sports. But the resent controversy seems dumb in my opinion. I I belive its the women who participate that are mak8ng things worse. For the s8mple fact that the ones to complain seem to be the ones kicked out the spotlight like the top 3 or 5 or what ever they do with medals. They ones that make it stay silent untill its theor turn. It means they are afraid to speak out untill it afects them or they dont belive it at all. Wjere they to rwally make a stand they should all say they wont participate. But they want to have it both ways. 



It takes genuine talent to see greatness in yourself despite your absence of genuine talent.

eva01beserk said:
sundin13 said:

"Are these people trying to take anything away from trans like by law"

Yes. If you don't think there is any movement on that front, look at Texas which has passed a law allowing the state to take your kids if you give them gender affirming care. This isn't just some low stakes conversation about sports (which is a much more complicated question than you are making it out to be), it is literally about whether these people should be allowed to exist as themselves.

But that's not true at all. Thats about helping real young kids to transition. And it makes sense that kids who dont know the first thing about sex or gender should have to buisness transitioning. There have been studies that show that most kids who transition at a young age just grow out of it. 

"Real young kids" are not "transitioning". Puberty blockers are not transitioning. 

Studies also don't show that. Studies do show that when kids have their gender affirmed by their parents and the systems around them, their suicidality drops dramatically. 

You don't know what you're talking about.