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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Outer World game design are held back by PS4 and Xbox One , another prove that Next gen will be held back by current gen if games are made for cross gen

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What do you think

Cross gen games will held... 9 52.94%
 
Yes it suck to have cross... 6 35.29%
 
I don't care because the ... 1 5.88%
 
i don't agree with game d... 1 5.88%
 
Total:17
Azzanation on 19 April 2020
HollyGamer said:

Yup is just twice the ram and have slightly more FLOPS which is why is just slightly 

 Stop discussing games that intended made for Old gen and run on high end. That's not cross gen is. 

Cross gen games are games that made for both Current gen and next gen so stop mentioning Zelda BOTW (or like TLOU) those games are not Cross gen but games that made for old gen that ported to new gen.

No matter how good the developer is there is always limitation which is "OLD HARDWARE' . Developer cannot magically change the limitation of old hardware ". Games that are made on for both will be limited on how powerful last gen consoles is. The closer the gap between old gen and next gen the more unlikely we see bad cross gen games, but the bigger the gap is (Xbox One - Xbox Series X) the more we see games are held by Xbox One. 

That's just fact , developer ain't God that can change reality. 

You come out complaining about old hardware holding games back.. and I just proved to you that games on the same hardware have improved by leaps and bounds, hence Uncharted 4 to TLOU2. 

Good Developers will find ways on utilising current hardware. Not all devs need unlimited power to make great games. In some cases, some devs don't even utilise all the hardware potential and just use what they need.

You sound like someone who only cares for visuals, maybe you need to get out of the console market completely and just invest into a high end PC. Game designs wont change over night. You think Ori 2 will be a bigger game if it released on the Series X? No, it would most likely be the exact same game the devs visioned. Hardware is always good to have but the talent behind the games matter more.



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sales2099 on 19 April 2020

HollyGamer said:
Azzanation said:

Switch is not slightly more powerful than the WiiU, its marginally more powerful, it has twice the ram for games for starters and faster, which I stated.

You are just overreacting on the cross-gen system. I just proved to you that if Nintendo can make amazing games using as much as 1gig of ram than their is no excuse for Sony or Microsoft using 4x as much. Zelda's world is as good as any open world game on the market and again its a cross gen game.

Developers get better at using hardware over time, just look at Uncharted 4 to TLOU2 on PS4, look at the monster jump in visuals without adding in SSD drives, or having more ram or a better CPU or GPU, they managed to improve so much using base PS4 hardware. Developers also make more efficient engines which can do more while using less. 

Best part about next gen is that you will be able to play last gen games with all the bells and whistles of next gen hardware like boosting resolution and framerates, adding Ray Tracing and just boosting the overall game settings to polish up older games even better, much like how PCs work when playing older games on newer hardware. Imagine playing Resident Evil 2 on the Series X? Imagine if they add in Ray Tracing, locking in 60fps and native 4k with Ultra settings? That alone will feel like you are playing a remaster for free.

Yup is just twice the ram and have slightly more FLOPS which is why is just slightly 

 Stop discussing games that intended made for Old gen and run on high end. That's not cross gen is. 

Cross gen games are games that made for both Current gen and next gen so stop mentioning Zelda BOTW (or like TLOU) those games are not Cross gen but games that made for old gen that ported to new gen.

No matter how good the developer is there is always limitation which is "OLD HARDWARE' . Developer cannot magically change the limitation of old hardware ". Games that are made on for both will be limited on how powerful last gen consoles is. The closer the gap between old gen and next gen the more unlikely we see bad cross gen games, but the bigger the gap is (Xbox One - Xbox Series X) the more we see games are held by Xbox One. 

That's just fact , developer ain't God that can change reality. 

Ok what’s your overall message? Its not “cross gen games are held back by the older gen” because we all kinda know that. I mean what’s the narrative you got that expands that statement? 

Because if that’s all you got then it really just serves the “my console is better then yours narrative”. And if this is the best argument against Xbox in 2020 I say Xbox is doing pretty good for THIS to be the leading argument against it ;) All moot point if the games are critically acclaimed. It’s hard to boast superiority if your consoles launch titles are lesser quality then another.

But you must acknowledge there are so many factors at play that don’t make this what you got pictured in your head (scaling and optimization). There are many examples of cross gen games that have features in the latest hardware that are cut from the older version. That alone is a nice work around to your argument. 

Last edited by sales2099 - on 19 April 2020

Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

HollyGamer on 19 April 2020
Azzanation said:
HollyGamer said:

Yup is just twice the ram and have slightly more FLOPS which is why is just slightly 

 Stop discussing games that intended made for Old gen and run on high end. That's not cross gen is. 

Cross gen games are games that made for both Current gen and next gen so stop mentioning Zelda BOTW (or like TLOU) those games are not Cross gen but games that made for old gen that ported to new gen.

No matter how good the developer is there is always limitation which is "OLD HARDWARE' . Developer cannot magically change the limitation of old hardware ". Games that are made on for both will be limited on how powerful last gen consoles is. The closer the gap between old gen and next gen the more unlikely we see bad cross gen games, but the bigger the gap is (Xbox One - Xbox Series X) the more we see games are held by Xbox One. 

That's just fact , developer ain't God that can change reality. 

You come out complaining about old hardware holding games back.. and I just proved to you that games on the same hardware have improved by leaps and bounds, hence Uncharted 4 to TLOU2. 

Good Developers will find ways on utilising current hardware. Not all devs need unlimited power to make great games. In some cases, some devs don't even utilise all the hardware potential and just use what they need.

You sound like someone who only cares for visuals, maybe you need to get out of the console market completely and just invest into a high end PC. Game designs wont change over night. You think Ori 2 will be a bigger game if it released on the Series X? No, it would most likely be the exact same game the devs visioned. Hardware is always good to have but the talent behind the games matter more.

What??????????????????? , Uncharted 2 and TLOU 2 is PS4 games not PS3 games nor Cross gen games . LMAO 

a good developer can understand the limit thus working out to fill and utilize the potential while learning the limit but it doesn't mean the limit is gone.

Is not about Visual, if it's just visual then this thread wont exist because Xbox series X can run the games which better frame rates, resolution and added affect , it's about game design , NPC, interactivity, phisch , simulation, and others thing that and probably some graphic that also affecting gameplay . Game design is not just about graphic but overal experience. 



HollyGamer on 19 April 2020
sales2099 said:

HollyGamer said:

Yup is just twice the ram and have slightly more FLOPS which is why is just slightly 

 Stop discussing games that intended made for Old gen and run on high end. That's not cross gen is. 

Cross gen games are games that made for both Current gen and next gen so stop mentioning Zelda BOTW (or like TLOU) those games are not Cross gen but games that made for old gen that ported to new gen.

No matter how good the developer is there is always limitation which is "OLD HARDWARE' . Developer cannot magically change the limitation of old hardware ". Games that are made on for both will be limited on how powerful last gen consoles is. The closer the gap between old gen and next gen the more unlikely we see bad cross gen games, but the bigger the gap is (Xbox One - Xbox Series X) the more we see games are held by Xbox One. 

That's just fact , developer ain't God that can change reality. 

Ok what’s your overall message? Its not “cross gen games are held back by the older gen” because we all kinda know that. I mean what’s the narrative you got that expands that statement? 

Because if that’s all you got then it really just serves the “my console is better then yours narrative”. And if this is the best argument against Xbox in 2020 I say Xbox is doing pretty good for THIS to be the leading argument against it ;) All moot point if the games are critically acclaimed. It’s hard to boast superiority if your consoles launch titles are lesser quality then another.

But you must acknowledge there are so many factors at play that don’t make this what you got pictured in your head (scaling and optimization). There are many examples of cross gen games that have features in the latest hardware that are cut from the older version. That alone is a nice work around to your argument. 

Simple answer is cross gen are bad 



DonFerrari on 19 April 2020

I'm laughing with "older hardware doesn't limit developers, see BotW". We have had great games every gen, that doesn't mean the hardware wasn't limiting what was possible to do.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

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Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

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Azzanation on 20 April 2020
HollyGamer said:

What??????????????????? , Uncharted 2 and TLOU 2 is PS4 games not PS3 games nor Cross gen games . LMAO 

a good developer can understand the limit thus working out to fill and utilize the potential while learning the limit but it doesn't mean the limit is gone.

Is not about Visual, if it's just visual then this thread wont exist because Xbox series X can run the games which better frame rates, resolution and added affect , it's about game design , NPC, interactivity, phisch , simulation, and others thing that and probably some graphic that also affecting gameplay . Game design is not just about graphic but overal experience. 

Where did i say Uncharted 2? I said Uncharted 4.

Okay so lets ask this question. How bad is this gen for you? Has the hardware limits really affected your gaming that badly that you need all games to cross over to next gen?

I keep finding great games to play this gen and some games continue to push the envelope much further. You must be disapointed in FF7 Remake and upcoming Cyberpunk 2077 because they all use current gen hardware which has limited these games protential. Thats what you sound like.

DonFerrari said:
I'm laughing with "older hardware doesn't limit developers, see BotW". We have had great games every gen, that doesn't mean the hardware wasn't limiting what was possible to do.

Any reason you didnt reply to my post but dicided to post a reply directed towards my post?

As someone else mentioned already as a response, hardware limits had existed since Gen 1 and there will be hardware limits in Gen 9. Great games have been made on limited hardever since forever. Hence BOTW, a game designed on very limited hardware yet outshines all games this gen in terms of a quality game, limits or not, wont stop good devs from creating good games.



Leynos on 20 April 2020

Remember E3 2005 and 2006 where MS and Sony said the only thing limiting developers now was their imagination with the power of 360 and PS3. Times have changed. Yes I know it's buzz marketing BS. I recently rewatched those E3s.



Bite my shiny metal cockpit!

Pemalite on 20 April 2020
Barozi said:
In reality the game is held back because big budget PC exclusives don't generate enough money.

Say what?

StarCitizen. - $277 Million.
https://robertsspaceindustries.com/funding-goals

World of WarCraft. - Over $9 Billion.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_of_Warcraft

League of Legends $1 - $2 Billion per year. (Over $5 Billion.)
https://www.statista.com/statistics/806975/lol-revenue/

DOTA 2 - $1 Billion.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/807617/dota-2-revenue/

I could keep going. Games like Crysis, Elder Scrolls, Doom, Quake, Unreal Tournament, Fable, Halo, Grand Theft Auto, PUBG and more all existed on the PC as exclusives at first as well at one point remember.

We need to remember that the PC Market is more than a $25-$35 Billion dollar market, it's not small or insignificant like you might insinuate.

Can you name a singular console that is bigger than the PC?



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

Fragenstein on 20 April 2020
Azzanation said:
HollyGamer said:

What??????????????????? , Uncharted 2 and TLOU 2 is PS4 games not PS3 games nor Cross gen games . LMAO 

a good developer can understand the limit thus working out to fill and utilize the potential while learning the limit but it doesn't mean the limit is gone.

Is not about Visual, if it's just visual then this thread wont exist because Xbox series X can run the games which better frame rates, resolution and added affect , it's about game design , NPC, interactivity, phisch , simulation, and others thing that and probably some graphic that also affecting gameplay . Game design is not just about graphic but overal experience. 

Where did i say Uncharted 2? I said Uncharted 4.

Okay so lets ask this question. How bad is this gen for you? Has the hardware limits really affected your gaming that badly that you need all games to cross over to next gen?

I keep finding great games to play this gen and some games continue to push the envelope much further. You must be disapointed in FF7 Remake and upcoming Cyberpunk 2077 because they all use current gen hardware which has limited these games protential. Thats what you sound like.

DonFerrari said:
I'm laughing with "older hardware doesn't limit developers, see BotW". We have had great games every gen, that doesn't mean the hardware wasn't limiting what was possible to do.

Any reason you didnt reply to my post but dicided to post a reply directed towards my post?

As someone else mentioned already as a response, hardware limits had existed since Gen 1 and there will be hardware limits in Gen 9. Great games have been made on limited hardever since forever. Hence BOTW, a game designed on very limited hardware yet outshines all games this gen in terms of a quality game, limits or not, wont stop good devs from creating good games.

Err.. wasn't Cyberpunk delayed because the Xbox One couldn't run it at an acceptable framerate? https://metro.co.uk/2020/01/23/cyberpunk-2077-delay-reason-xbox-one-performance-12109802/

I'm sure it will still turn out great, but Cyberpunk could obviously have been even better if it skipped current gen. Also, nobody is saying you can't have good games on weaker hardware and developers always have to work around the limitations of a console. With next gen consoles those limitations are just a lot smaller, allowing them to do stuff not possible on current gen. What they'll do with it is up to the developers, of course. But I think Outer World is pretty good example of how hardware limited their ambitions of their game.



HollyGamer on 20 April 2020
Azzanation said:
HollyGamer said:

What??????????????????? , Uncharted 2 and TLOU 2 is PS4 games not PS3 games nor Cross gen games . LMAO 

a good developer can understand the limit thus working out to fill and utilize the potential while learning the limit but it doesn't mean the limit is gone.

Is not about Visual, if it's just visual then this thread wont exist because Xbox series X can run the games which better frame rates, resolution and added affect , it's about game design , NPC, interactivity, phisch , simulation, and others thing that and probably some graphic that also affecting gameplay . Game design is not just about graphic but overal experience. 

Where did i say Uncharted 2? I said Uncharted 4.

Okay so lets ask this question. How bad is this gen for you? Has the hardware limits really affected your gaming that badly that you need all games to cross over to next gen?

I keep finding great games to play this gen and some games continue to push the envelope much further. You must be disapointed in FF7 Remake and upcoming Cyberpunk 2077 because they all use current gen hardware which has limited these games protential. Thats what you sound like.

Any reason you didnt reply to my post but dicided to post a reply directed towards my post?

Yeah my mistakes , a typo. But then again Uncharted 4 are PS4 games and not Cross gen games

This gen in the middle of the generation has been a blast , not so much in the early PS4 or Xbox One days because it has many cross gen. The capability of the hardware were shown after 2 to 3 years after the consoles has been released . But there is exception like "The Witcher 3" which is exclusives to PS4/Xbox One.

Did i disappointed FF7 remakes and Cyber punk made for current gen? A little,  but did i regret buying of course no, because this games were made to optimize current gen and not next gen. I already satisfied with current gen, i just want to see something new that even better then Cyberpunk (The witcher 4 are now in planning) and FF 7 remake part two for next gen.