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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Outer World game design are held back by PS4 and Xbox One , another prove that Next gen will be held back by current gen if games are made for cross gen

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What do you think

Cross gen games will held... 9 52.94%
 
Yes it suck to have cross... 6 35.29%
 
I don't care because the ... 1 5.88%
 
i don't agree with game d... 1 5.88%
 
Total:17
AngryLittleAlchemist said:

No, I understand your point, I don't even disagree with it, it's just that the part I actually replied to - the highlighted part (which I noticed you cut out my quotation of you for some reason in your reply) was literally wrong, so I addressed  it. 

Did I cut something out of your post? I just hit the quote button, no intention if that got cut out. But since we don't disagree with the post than their is nothing to debate about. I just find it funny how many act like this is some kind of big deal.

HollyGamer said:

Yes it's more powerful but not that more powerful. It's just a slightly . And also BOTW can ran better and be even better if from the get go were design for Switch. In fact it was underwhelm on Switch, it could have been better. 

The funny thing is Zelda BOTW just pointed that cross gen will held back games on future iteration (in this case Switch). Just wait how Zelda BOTW 2 will be different in size, world and gameplay. 

LMAO , try again 

Dude are you actually being serious? The Switch blows the WiiU out of the water in terms of specs. The Switch can run XB1 and PS4 games like Doom and Witcher, something the WiiU wouldn't be able to do unless they completely overhaul the games and make them from the ground up to run on WiiU hardware. The fact you think the Switch is just a portable WiiU is where your post falls hard and fast.

Nintendo was able to create the game they wanted (BOTW) on WiiU hardware. They didn't need XB1, PS4 or Switch hardware to create there immersive world and one of the best open worlds ever created. You can bash on its limitations all you want but maybe you need to play these games rather than call them limited.

EG: BOTW was created with 1gig of Ram on the WiiU (2gigs Total, 1gig allocated to System Functions), the Switch has 4gigs (2x more) and the PS4 and XB1 have 8gigs of Ram (4x more).

Last edited by Azzanation - on 19 April 2020

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Azzanation said:
HollyGamer said:

Yes it's more powerful but not that more powerful. It's just a slightly . And also BOTW can ran better and be even better if from the get go were design for Switch. In fact it was underwhelm on Switch, it could have been better. 

The funny thing is Zelda BOTW just pointed that cross gen will held back games on future iteration (in this case Switch). Just wait how Zelda BOTW 2 will be different in size, world and gameplay. 

LMAO , try again 

Dude are you actually being serious? The Switch blows the WiiU out of the water in terms of specs. The Switch can run XB1 and PS4 games like Doom and Witcher, something the WiiU wouldn't be able to do unless they completely overhaul the games and make them from the ground up to run on WiiU hardware. The fact you think the Switch is just a portable WiiU is where your post falls hard and fast.

Nintendo was able to create the game they wanted (BOTW) on WiiU hardware. They didn't need XB1, PS4 or Switch hardware to create there immersive world and one of the best open worlds ever created. You can bash on its limitations all you want but maybe you need to play these games rather than call them limited.

EG: BOTW was created with 1gig of Ram on the WiiU (2gigs Total, 1gig allocated to System Functions), the Switch has 4gigs (2x more) and the PS4 and XB1 have 8gigs of Ram (4x more).

I am not here for debating wii U spec i will not continue debating after this if spec debating is still continuing.

first of all Wii U is slightly more powerful and has modern arc compared to Xbox 360 and PS3, secondly Switch is Slightly more powerful then Wii U that means Switch is far more powerful than Xbox 360 and PS3 but not like PS4/Xbox One level difference. 

Switch can run PS4 games and Xbox does not mean it far superior than Wii U, even PS3 and Xbox 360 can run PS4 and Xbox games with a lot sacrifice, but the main problem is still there.

Also BOTW is not the correct answer, because BOTW was Wii U games and  design based on Wii U limitation and ported to Switch. It has Wii U limitation and game design limitation from Wii U. It's like The Last of Us from PS3 that run better on PS4. It;s still old games running slightly better. 



sales2099 said:
Fragenstein said:

Obviously cross gen games are hold back by the weakest link. Just because the early next gen titles don't always deliver, doesn't mean they have to be terrible by default either. Mario 64 was a launch title and so was Halo. Both are considered as some of mankind's greatest achievements at the time. 

We’re not talking about quality. The whole point of this topic is that being held back > quality game. Which is ridiculous and I’m glad you see that.

Im talking potential of the system. Compare Mario 64 to Conker. Huge graphical difference between beginning and end of gen potential. My argument is that early gen potential and cross gen “hold backs” ultimately are the exact same thing. 

Of course if the game scores very well anybody claiming the game is held back is fighting a losing battle. Like Zelda BOTW. Cross gen game that just happens to be one of the best games ever made. Go figure.

If Halo Infinite scores well and I see a PS fan mock the Xbox One holding it back I’ll throw its metascore back in their face and laugh :)

Quality is objective whereas a game being held back because it has to run on a much weaker console, is not. Zelda BOTW is a master piece but it could have been even more ambitious if it was designed to run on more powerful hardware. 

The cool thing about Series X and ps5 is that they have SSD's that are specifically there so developers can be more ambitious with their world and level design and do things not possible on current gen. Look at Outer World for example, It's not a bad game but it never felt like you're flying a ship and visit different planets because you just got a bunch of loading screens every time you visit a location. If Outer World 2 was designed for Series X we should see much larger and denser worlds with seamless, real time transitions from outer space, to planets, to complex indoor locations. It would be a much more immersive experience because of it, but that's not possible if it also has to run on Xbox One. Because then the locations still have to be cut in separate levels, number of NPC's still have to be cut and the loading screens would still be there across all platforms. This is a simple fact and throwing Metacritic scores in people's faces isn't going to change that. 

Last edited by Fragenstein - on 19 April 2020

HollyGamer said:

I am not here for debating wii U spec i will not continue debating after this if spec debating is still continuing.

first of all Wii U is slightly more powerful and has modern arc compared to Xbox 360 and PS3, secondly Switch is Slightly more powerful then Wii U that means Switch is far more powerful than Xbox 360 and PS3 but not like PS4/Xbox One level difference. 

Switch can run PS4 games and Xbox does not mean it far superior than Wii U, even PS3 and Xbox 360 can run PS4 and Xbox games with a lot sacrifice, but the main problem is still there.

Also BOTW is not the correct answer, because BOTW was Wii U games and  design based on Wii U limitation and ported to Switch. It has Wii U limitation and game design limitation from Wii U. It's like The Last of Us from PS3 that run better on PS4. It;s still old games running slightly better. 

Switch is not slightly more powerful than the WiiU, its marginally more powerful, it has twice the ram for games for starters and faster, which I stated.

You are just overreacting on the cross-gen system. I just proved to you that if Nintendo can make amazing games using as much as 1gig of ram than their is no excuse for Sony or Microsoft using 4x as much. Zelda's world is as good as any open world game on the market and again its a cross gen game.

Developers get better at using hardware over time, just look at Uncharted 4 to TLOU2 on PS4, look at the monster jump in visuals without adding in SSD drives, or having more ram or a better CPU or GPU, they managed to improve so much using base PS4 hardware. Developers also make more efficient engines which can do more while using less. 

Best part about next gen is that you will be able to play last gen games with all the bells and whistles of next gen hardware like boosting resolution and framerates, adding Ray Tracing and just boosting the overall game settings to polish up older games even better, much like how PCs work when playing older games on newer hardware. Imagine playing Resident Evil 2 on the Series X? Imagine if they add in Ray Tracing, locking in 60fps and native 4k with Ultra settings? That alone will feel like you are playing a remaster for free.



Yes the more power you have the better the games. That's why Nintendo games are rated so low. Not enough power.



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sethnintendo said:
Yes the more power you have the better the games. That's why Nintendo games are rated so low. Not enough power.

More power simply allows for more possibilities and ambitions in game design. Doesn't mean all games made for more powerful hardware will be better by definition. That's all up to the talent and budget of the developers. But don't you expect your favorite Nintendo franchises to be even better and more ambitious on the Switch 2? If not, than what's the point of releasing new consoles at all lol.  

Last edited by Fragenstein - on 19 April 2020

sethnintendo said:
Yes the more power you have the better the games. That's why Nintendo games are rated so low. Not enough power.

Nobody is equating power  to quality. Dont continue the straw man please. 



It takes genuine talent to see greatness in yourself despite your absence of genuine talent.

Fragenstein said:
sethnintendo said:
Yes the more power you have the better the games. That's why Nintendo games are rated so low. Not enough power.

More power simply allows for more possibilities and ambitions in game design. Doesn't mean all games made for more powerful hardware will be better by definition. That's all up to the talent and budget of the developers. But don't you expect your favorite Nintendo franchises to be even better and more ambitious on the Switch 2? If not, than what's the point of releasing new consoles at all lol.  

I haven't really seen games progress that much in past 5-7 years or so.  I'm a relic of the past and a game like NES Ice Hockey can entertain me.  It's best just to ignore me because I'm obviously part of a lost generation now.  Have fun with your "new" gaming experiences that have barely materialized in the past decade.

To me it takes like 15-20 years to notice much difference in games.  GTA: San Andreas seems just as good as GTAV to me.   What did GTAV introduce?  Slow motion special abilities and ability to switch semi on the fly to other characters?  Mind blown...

You are right it is up to talent and the developers.  Obviously the industry doesn't have the best talent if they are always bitching about the limitations of the systems.

Last edited by sethnintendo - on 19 April 2020

Azzanation said:
HollyGamer said:

I am not here for debating wii U spec i will not continue debating after this if spec debating is still continuing.

first of all Wii U is slightly more powerful and has modern arc compared to Xbox 360 and PS3, secondly Switch is Slightly more powerful then Wii U that means Switch is far more powerful than Xbox 360 and PS3 but not like PS4/Xbox One level difference. 

Switch can run PS4 games and Xbox does not mean it far superior than Wii U, even PS3 and Xbox 360 can run PS4 and Xbox games with a lot sacrifice, but the main problem is still there.

Also BOTW is not the correct answer, because BOTW was Wii U games and  design based on Wii U limitation and ported to Switch. It has Wii U limitation and game design limitation from Wii U. It's like The Last of Us from PS3 that run better on PS4. It;s still old games running slightly better. 

Switch is not slightly more powerful than the WiiU, its marginally more powerful, it has twice the ram for games for starters and faster, which I stated.

You are just overreacting on the cross-gen system. I just proved to you that if Nintendo can make amazing games using as much as 1gig of ram than their is no excuse for Sony or Microsoft using 4x as much. Zelda's world is as good as any open world game on the market and again its a cross gen game.

Developers get better at using hardware over time, just look at Uncharted 4 to TLOU2 on PS4, look at the monster jump in visuals without adding in SSD drives, or having more ram or a better CPU or GPU, they managed to improve so much using base PS4 hardware. Developers also make more efficient engines which can do more while using less. 

Best part about next gen is that you will be able to play last gen games with all the bells and whistles of next gen hardware like boosting resolution and framerates, adding Ray Tracing and just boosting the overall game settings to polish up older games even better, much like how PCs work when playing older games on newer hardware. Imagine playing Resident Evil 2 on the Series X? Imagine if they add in Ray Tracing, locking in 60fps and native 4k with Ultra settings? That alone will feel like you are playing a remaster for free.

Yup is just twice the ram and have slightly more FLOPS which is why is just slightly 

 Stop discussing games that intended made for Old gen and run on high end. That's not cross gen is. 

Cross gen games are games that made for both Current gen and next gen so stop mentioning Zelda BOTW (or like TLOU) those games are not Cross gen but games that made for old gen that ported to new gen.

No matter how good the developer is there is always limitation which is "OLD HARDWARE' . Developer cannot magically change the limitation of old hardware ". Games that are made on for both will be limited on how powerful last gen consoles is. The closer the gap between old gen and next gen the more unlikely we see bad cross gen games, but the bigger the gap is (Xbox One - Xbox Series X) the more we see games are held by Xbox One. 

That's just fact , developer ain't God that can change reality. 



Please stop mentioning games that blow holes in his argument guys, please.