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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Alternate history, 7th gen: Clash of the HD dreadnaughts

 

What do you think would've been the outcome?

Nintendo would still have won 1 4.76%
 
PS3 would've won 12 57.14%
 
Xbox 360 would've won 8 38.10%
 
Total:21
curl-6 said:
The_Liquid_Laser said:

A cool image does not sell hardware.  Cool games do, but a cool image does not.  The Genesis had the coolest image of any console and it still lost to the SNES, which had a kiddie image.

At this point we are talking in circles about game library though.  I think the Wii HD would have gotten most of the multiplats that the PS3 and XBox360 had.  You don't.  It's kind of pointless arguing beyond that, because this is a hypothetical scenario and we'll never find out who is right.

DonFerrari said:

No problem as I don't think WiiHD costing 50 or even 100 more than X360 would be the key point of it doing worse or not than what you predicted anyway. Just pointed out because Liquid was so damn sure WiiHD would have price advantage against it. MS is much more willing to eat loss on HW than Nintendo.

I would probably prefer a WiiHD than what we had, but for Nintendo I believe Wii was a much better ideia, only if WiiU had done a better job =[

I think "Gamecube 2" is a better description of this theoretical console than "Wii HD". The Wii after all was largely defined by its motion controls and blue ocean approach whereas what we're talking about here, a standard HD console from Nintendo, would be more like a traditional successor to Gamecube.

Fair enough. GC2 or Super GC then.

For your tastes would you have liked more the GC2 than Wii?



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

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DonFerrari said:
curl-6 said:

I think "Gamecube 2" is a better description of this theoretical console than "Wii HD". The Wii after all was largely defined by its motion controls and blue ocean approach whereas what we're talking about here, a standard HD console from Nintendo, would be more like a traditional successor to Gamecube.

Fair enough. GC2 or Super GC then.

For your tastes would you have liked more the GC2 than Wii?

I think the Wii probably would've more to my tastes. While it would've been cool seeing Nintendo games in HD a gen earlier, I expect we would've had to suffer through a lot of the delays and droughts that made the Wii U so painful as Nintendo like a lot of devs had trouble transitioning to HD development. I'm also one of those who quite liked motion controls, when done right.



Bet with Liquidlaser: I say PS5 and Xbox Series will sell more than 56 million combined by the end of 2023.

curl-6 said:
DonFerrari said:

Fair enough. GC2 or Super GC then.

For your tastes would you have liked more the GC2 than Wii?

I think the Wii probably would've more to my tastes. While it would've been cool seeing Nintendo games in HD a gen earlier, I expect we would've had to suffer through a lot of the delays and droughts that made the Wii U so painful as Nintendo like a lot of devs had trouble transitioning to HD development. I'm also one of those who quite liked motion controls, when done right.

Understood, so even if droughts weren't a problem (so all games Wii had, GC2 would as well, or at least the non movement ones) you would still be divided between motion controls and HD output.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari said:
curl-6 said:

I think the Wii probably would've more to my tastes. While it would've been cool seeing Nintendo games in HD a gen earlier, I expect we would've had to suffer through a lot of the delays and droughts that made the Wii U so painful as Nintendo like a lot of devs had trouble transitioning to HD development. I'm also one of those who quite liked motion controls, when done right.

Understood, so even if droughts weren't a problem (so all games Wii had, GC2 would as well, or at least the non movement ones) you would still be divided between motion controls and HD output.

Yeah, and in that scenario, I think I'd have to go with motion + pointer controls, I just really enjoyed them in games like Metroid Prime 3, Mario Galaxy 1 & 2, Sin & Punishment 2, the Goldeneye remake, etc.



Bet with Liquidlaser: I say PS5 and Xbox Series will sell more than 56 million combined by the end of 2023.

If we assume the HD Wii would lose all of its casual titles, then we have to assume it would get some major HD games. Perhaps it would get a Zelda Breath of the Wild, or a Splatoon. The Wii got a lot of quality games in its first years, so the HD Wii would have gotten even more. Consoles sell due to games, but the HD Wii would have lost the blue ocean crowd. So I will call it a narrow loss, but still satisfactory performance. Overall 7th gen sales would be much lower, and the PS2 would have gained a bit by being the cheap popular casual console. Due to the PS2 continuing to do well and the PS3 being the most expensive out of 3 expensive consoles it would have lost even more. 360 would be the eventual winner with kinect and more momentum early without a cheap Wii.

So without further ado here is my estimates.

PS2- 172m
360- 85m
PS3- 73m
Wii HD- 67m



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curl-6 said:
The_Liquid_Laser said:

A cool image does not sell hardware.  Cool games do, but a cool image does not.  The Genesis had the coolest image of any console and it still lost to the SNES, which had a kiddie image.

At this point we are talking in circles about game library though.  I think the Wii HD would have gotten most of the multiplats that the PS3 and XBox360 had.  You don't.  It's kind of pointless arguing beyond that, because this is a hypothetical scenario and we'll never find out who is right.

DonFerrari said:

No problem as I don't think WiiHD costing 50 or even 100 more than X360 would be the key point of it doing worse or not than what you predicted anyway. Just pointed out because Liquid was so damn sure WiiHD would have price advantage against it. MS is much more willing to eat loss on HW than Nintendo.

I would probably prefer a WiiHD than what we had, but for Nintendo I believe Wii was a much better ideia, only if WiiU had done a better job =[

I think "Gamecube 2" is a better description of this theoretical console than "Wii HD". The Wii after all was largely defined by its motion controls and blue ocean approach whereas what we're talking about here, a standard HD console from Nintendo, would be more like a traditional successor to Gamecube.

The reason I decided to use HD Wii instead of Gamecube 2 is because I am assuming Nintendo's marketing would be on point for this theoretical gen unlike in the Gamecube era. Naming it Gamecube 2 would have been a disaster, due to the perception of Nintendo at the time. Of course this theoretical console would have had it's own brand, but I choose to use the stronger brand to better represent the superior marketing Nintendo had at the time.



Farsala said:
curl-6 said:

I think "Gamecube 2" is a better description of this theoretical console than "Wii HD". The Wii after all was largely defined by its motion controls and blue ocean approach whereas what we're talking about here, a standard HD console from Nintendo, would be more like a traditional successor to Gamecube.

The reason I decided to use HD Wii instead of Gamecube 2 is because I am assuming Nintendo's marketing would be on point for this theoretical gen unlike in the Gamecube era. Naming it Gamecube 2 would have been a disaster, due to the perception of Nintendo at the time. Of course this theoretical console would have had it's own brand, but I choose to use the stronger brand to better represent the superior marketing Nintendo had at the time.

I didn't mean it'd literally be called Gamecube 2, more that it would be a continuation of that system's philosophy of playing the power game extended into the HD era. The name "Wii" on the other hand was chosen to reflect the blue ocean nature of the system, something this theoretical console won't be embracing as described in the OP.



Bet with Liquidlaser: I say PS5 and Xbox Series will sell more than 56 million combined by the end of 2023.

Again, it wasn't like 3rd parties were going all in on making multiplats for the first couple of years of the generation. Bioshock 1 was exclusive to XBox. So was Mass Effect 1. Assassin's Creed only went multiplat because of the 360's success in its first year. It took several years for most of the big third parties to settle on making everything multiplat. A Gamecube 2 with hardware comparable to the 360 would get COD 4, but it would still miss out on many of the biggest franchises of the generation, and it would need to sell in that crucial first 2 years when 3rd party support would be all but guaranteed to be abysmal and Nintendo itself would be struggling with HD development. Maybe the sequels like Mass Effect 2, Bioshock 2, Assassin's Creed 2, would come over. But the first games would almost certainly not come to Nintendo and by the time any of the sequels came out the system would be dead in the water and possibly not worth bringing anything over to.



Considering:

- Nintendo was in a disadvantaged postinion in terms of image compared to the PS brand at its peak and the growing Xbox brand.
-The slow momentum of the Gamecube in 2004/2005
- Their smaller avaliablity of marketing resources compared to the other 2 larger companies
- Their lack of alternative business braches to mitigate hardware losses
- Their lack of an online infrastructure to compete with Xbox live
-Increased costs and production time of their 1st party content (due to increased production values and)

It would have been a bloodbath for them.

Last edited by freebs2 - on 23 August 2019

I propose another alternate story:
Wii U released 2010 or 2011, without the gamepad.
2 version:
1-white, with wiimote+ inside and wii sports club(just the wii version in HD);
2-black, with pro controller.
250$~300$.
In 2012/13 release the gamepad to be bought separately, along with games that use it(all adapted also to be used without it).
Also a wii U version with gamepad included and a game.

Any chance to outsell at least N64?