TH3-D0S3R said:
It did directly say marriage and the name of the two men. |
Well if that's the case then I'd side with the bakery.
TH3-D0S3R said:
It did directly say marriage and the name of the two men. |
Well if that's the case then I'd side with the bakery.
| CosmicSex said:
BTW as if there was a God(s) he(she/they) would not give a damn about sexuality. |
You are thinking about Paganism, but ethical monotheism does have strict moral rules.
CrazyGamer2017 said:
Then what are you doing on this forum? This forum acts like Europe. You are free to express yourself but if you insult or discriminate gays or people of color you get warned and banned. Yet you stay here so it seems this system of taking responsibility for what you say does not really bother you after all. And it's much easier to leave a forum than to leave a country. And like I said before it seems we in Europe are free to enter any store and buy anything regardless of our skin color or sexual orientation, you guys are free to refuse service to the people. So who is the most free then? We the people or you the businessmen? Very ironic that We the people of Europe are more free than you the people of a country whose constitution begins with the words "WE THE PEOPLE" Perhaps you should change it to "We the corporations...". |
I think you should think a bit of what your saying before hitting post. Your forum argument just works against you. This forum is privatly owned and the guy who made it enforces whatever rules he sees fit and nobody can tell him what to do. Like any buisness. If i want part of what he is ofering i have to abide by his rules. I agree and take part. Where i not to agree i can choose to not partake and find another forum that would offer what i like. I would not ask the goverment to force vgc to do what i want.
And your comparison between the us and eu are just laughable. Freedom dosent come from individual to individual. Like i said before if someone dosent offer what i want i can go somewhere else. Freedom comes when i can choose to do what i want even if the world disagrees and the goverment or any other group can stop me as long as im not doing harm to others or inciting harm. What you described is fear. That if you dont comply severe consequences will follow.
It takes genuine talent to see greatness in yourself despite your absence of genuine talent.
RJ_Sizzle said:
One is actually illegal to both do and even threaten to do in the EU and the other one is a legal union. Not anywhere on the same level. This case sets a precedent for anyone to discriminate using religion as a basis. If people started refusing to provide services to Christians, you better believe they would be up in arms about it and Trump would be compelled to get his little tweeting thumbs ready to disapprove. |
You just responded with the same lack of reading as the other guy. I never said they where on the same level. I said they are diferently in severity but it should not matter either way. Being forced to eat chocolota and being forced to eat human flesh is still being forced to eat what you dont want.(i highly doubt anybody is discusted by chocolate but thats not the point).
People can deny service to anybody. The market will sort out the ridicous ones. Not the goverment.
It takes genuine talent to see greatness in yourself despite your absence of genuine talent.
Mcube said:
You cant just create a religion out of nowhere thats just anti black or something. There is a certain way this case should be measured instead of blatant racism. As far as we know the baker only refused to make a cake, something he makes himself, his own kind of art. He´s christian he doesnt believe in gay marriage so he wont make a cake for it since he´d be helping something he himself doesnt believe in. While thisismeintel´s example is a bit over the top he does have a point. When a KKK member walks into a bakers shop and the baker is black he´s not gonna make a cake with a fire cross on it and man in klux klux klan uniforms around the cross. Nor should he. Its a really really out there example its the extreme of the extreme but I do agree with what he says with it. You cant push your believe on other people as narrow minded as it is every person has a right to believe what they believe in. |
Every single religion is made up so of course you can create whatever religion you want.


| Baldeagle8 said: Do you think there would have been the same amount of out-cry if this was a Muslim bakery??? Think about it honestly. |
Oh definitely.
| Maxosaurus-rex said: You can't force someone into a contract |
Correct. However, not all contracts are written.
| NightlyPoe said: Incorrect. The 1st Amendment is a prohibition on government from stopping citizens from exercising their religious beliefs as they choose. It's a prohibition on the government from forcing people to endorse a view that is against their religion. It actively bars the government from shielding you from other people's religious views. |
I am not American, so obviously I am not going to be privvy to American law.
I am also not talking about the Government or it's legislation per-say, I am talking about fundamental internationally recognized freedoms... And if a country promotes Freedom of Religion, then there is always the implied right of Freedom From Religion.
| NightlyPoe said: Legalized gay marriage might be the law of the land, but that doesn't mean everyone must participate. |
No one is being asked to participate in the ceremony. They were asked to bake a cake, don't conflate the two, they are actually separate entities.
Nowhere in the Bible does it state "Thou shalt not bake gay cake".
| Jon-Erich said: That wasn't the issue here. He never denied the same sex couple services. He simply said he could not decorate the cake the way the wanted it. They were even offered alternate options which they refused. If anything, he tried to provide them with a service, and they're the ones who turned down the service. |
It comes down to principle in the end. - Sure they could have chosen a cake design that conformed to someone elses religious views, but why the hell should they?
| irstupid said: He wasn't contracted for a job. Two guys came into his business and asked him to do a job. He refused. No contract was made. He didn't promise services and then change his mind. It's like the same if I walk into a store with no shirt or shoes and am refused service. |
I don't know about the USA, but if someone was to walk into my work environments, there is an implied contract that I will do what I can for them... And I am to set aside all Religious, Moral, Political and any other personal views aside. - It is only when the individual says "no" is that implied contract terminated.
Granted, my jobs are to save lives, so standards may indeed differ.
But if I was to walk into any shop and I was denied a product/service because of someone elses religious beliefs, you bet your ass I will take that business through the ringer.
| KLAMarine said: If this bakery is the man's privately-owned business, this gay couple is imposing their religious/political/moral views on the baker and his privately-owned business. They're telling him how to run his business. |
Homosexuality isn't a religious, political or moral view. You don't have a choice to be Homosexual.

www.youtube.com/@Pemalite
Pemalite said:
Oh definitely.
Correct. However, not all contracts are written.
I am not American, so obviously I am not going to be privvy to American law.
No one is being asked to participate in the ceremony. They were asked to bake a cake, don't conflate the two, they are actually separate entities.
It comes down to principle in the end. - Sure they could have chosen a cake design that conformed to someone elses religious views, but why the hell should they?
I don't know about the USA, but if someone was to walk into my work environments, there is an implied contract that I will do what I can for them... And I am to set aside all Religious, Moral, Political and any other personal views aside. - It is only when the individual says "no" is that implied contract terminated.
|
You can't force someone into a contract written or otherwise. That's literally an illegal contract
| Pemalite said:
|
Gay marriage is a political, religious and moral topic - everybody agrees on that, regardless on where you stand.


| Maxosaurus-rex said: You can't force someone into a contract written or otherwise. That's literally an illegal contract |
Not saying anyone was forced. Either way... That isn't always the case, there is a grey area there which I alluded to prior.
| numberwang said: Gay marriage is a political, religious and moral topic - everybody agrees on that, regardless on where you stand. |
Religion, Morals and Politics should play no part in it.
Everyone should always be seen and treated as equals in the eyes of the law, marriage is very much a legal construct.
All this moaning about Same-Sex marriage is ultimately irrelevant due to the above point.

www.youtube.com/@Pemalite
Pemalite said:
Not saying anyone was forced. Either way... That isn't always the case, there is a grey area there.
Religion, Morals and Politics should play no part in it. |
Marriage is political. Unless, you're a Libertarian. In which case, I agree. The government should be out of the marriage business