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Forums - General Discussion - Savage says: Oil for War.

luinil said:
Note: I never said they owed us anything. If you got that impression, sorry. I mean that since we are supposedly helping them why not get paid for doing so?

Ah, but right there you ARE saying that they owe us something. You are implying that our invasion and occupation have provided them with a service ("we are supposedly helping them"), and so they owe us for that service ("why not get paid [by them] for doing so").



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Haha, Savage is so funny. He hates everyone
I really doubt that Iraqis would really want Saddam back though. ABC news...meh.

Even if times may not be ideal at the moment, at least they have a chance for something better in the future without Saddam in power (this is assuming the U.S. does not pull out to early, leaving the country in shambles and paving the way for a new Saddam to take power.)

They should let the military commanders there make the decisions so we can get out as soon as possible but not leave the place in shambles in doing so. I don't agree at all with the notion that immediate pullout is required no matter what the consequences may be. There's too much of politicians getting involved with military strategy/directives/whatever. *coughVIETNAMcough*

I don't know what to say about Iraq "paying us back" because I haven't really thought about it. If we really need oil, why don't we get it from our own soil? I'm baffled as to why the EPA and the like would rather strangle the oil supply than allow refineries to be built in various locations and drilling to commence in Alaska (pristine wilderness my foot - we're talking about a couple square miles in a frozen tundra wasteland!). It's sheer idiocy.

The Republican party needs a revamp too - referring to them as the "whig" party fits them perfectly. (and I'm registered as a Republican for voting myself)



Epsilon, you hit the nail on the head. Savage does things like this to enrage people to thought and action.

@bluesinG: Debt that WE have incurred is just that, OUR debt. They don't owe us anything. But it would be nice for them to pay us while we are there to help our costs of re-building their country (since it helps everyone over there).



luinil said:
@bluesinG: Debt that WE have incurred is just that, OUR debt. They don't owe us anything. But it would be nice for them to pay us while we are there to help our costs of re-building their country (since it helps everyone over there).

Ah, but that rebuilding is only necessary because of our invasion and occupation. We broke their country, and now you want them to pay us to fix it.



luinil said:
Since we are paying for their reconstruction now, why not have them pay us while we are helping them build their country up? That is my only question.

I don't understand the mentality of invading a country based on lies, bombing and blasting the hell out it, destroying it's government and allowing looting, and then expecting the people there to pay for it all.  Some people talk of Iraq like it was Nazi Germany but there are major differences and the fact remains that even though Iraq was run by a ruthless dictator it wasn't the aggressor in this latest war, the United States was.

Should the United States be responsible for paying the costs?  I'm not sure but just based on the fact that the intelligence used to justify the war was grossly inaccurate and top U.S. politicians may have purposely mislead everyone I think they do in fact bare responsibility for most if not all of the costs for rebuilding that country.  If people are looking at someone to be angry at or that should be made to pay then look no further than George W. Bush, Dick Cheney, and all the others responsible for signing off on it.



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I don't see a valid reason for the Iraq to give any money (or oil) to the US. Unless I see a valid reason I will continue to look shamefully on the US government.

@luinil, the US isn't going broke because of government overspending on military. The US is going broke because of a ballooning consumer debt.



senseinobaka said:

Comments like these are the reason I no longer listen to Savage. The invasion of Iraq was done to protect the US from the precieved threat posed by Sadaam. The action was taken by the US for the US' best interest. To try to package that and sell it to the Iraqi's as a service rendered to them is wrong. If the Iraqi's want to show appreciaiton they should shape up and take control of their own country.

Also Savage is truly an idiot. Is he actually suprised to hear a Democrat make a demand for money that they have no right to? That is the definition of Democrat.

I thought you were politically nuetral? Ah well, no matter...

 

For the actual topic, while the US is definately hurting for the war, the iraqis didn't exactly ask to be liberated. It's like me bludgeoning a guy over the head, cutting him open and removing a kidney stone then telling him to pay me twenty grand and go get himself fixed up while he's at it, because that's definately gonna get infected. The war is screwing the US, but it's government is to blame for that.

 



You can find me on facebook as Markus Van Rijn, if you friend me just mention you're from VGchartz and who you are here.

epsilon72 said:
I really doubt that Iraqis would really want Saddam back though. ABC news...meh.

Note that ABC was just reporting the results of a poll. The poll was jointly sponsored by USA Today, the BBC, and ARD German TV.

epsilon72 said:
Even if times may not be ideal at the moment, at least they have a chance for something better in the future without Saddam in power

But they also have a chance for something much worse, like rule by tyrranical, aggressive, Sunni fundamentalists.

epsilon72 said:
(this is assuming the U.S. does not pull out to early, leaving the country in shambles and paving the way for a new Saddam to take power.)

They should let the military commanders there make the decisions so we can get out as soon as possible but not leave the place in shambles in doing so. I don't agree at all with the notion that immediate pullout is required no matter what the consequences may be. There's too much of politicians getting involved with military strategy/directives/whatever. *coughVIETNAMcough*

I don't disagree with this. Given that we have broken Iraq, I certainly see why we have a responsibility for fixing it.



Legend11 the problem is that they haven't paid for ANY of it so far it would seem. We are pumping money over there and are going broke because of it. They should pick up the costs for the reconstruction and if we are helping they should pay for the service. Sadaam wouldn't allow free-inspections of suspected sites, sounds fishy.... Even after ~34 UN resolutions he defied the UN inspectors and never let them have free access to anything.

The intelligence was wrong it seems. However everything is 20/20 in hindsight. Everyone thought that they had WMDs, even Hillary Clinton made the case for invading Iraq on that intelligence. She then bragged when we caught Sadaam, and is not trying to distance herself from her vote. Was she lying or just mistaken?

I truly don't care too much if they pay us back, but for God's sake, stop having our money wasted over there! We can't afford it, and the weakened dollar is proof. We spend so much money at the Federal Level that it is disgusting. Small government and small Federal Spending I say.



The_vagabond7 said:

For the actual topic, while the US is definately hurting for the war, the iraqis didn't exactly ask to be liberated. It's like me bludgeoning a guy over the head, cutting him open and removing a kidney stone then telling him to pay me twenty grand and go get himself fixed up while he's at it, because that's definately gonna get infected. The war is screwing the US, but it's government is to blame for that.

 


Exactly. Well put.